Malaysian Airlines 777 Shot Down (?)

Quineloe

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It's like there is a wall of crazy blocking off east from west. I don't think there's a "safe" striaght route withut taking detours.
Turkey and Iran? That takes you to the Arabian Sea. I'm not aware of any no flight restrictions over Iran. But as Phoenix said, it's unlikely the Syrian rebels even have the means to shoot down a plane travelling at 40,000ft
 

Pasteton

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Wow. So Russian media is that much of a farce? They cant seriously think anyone is buying that tabloid crap. What is it with communist countries and hilariously totalitarian government control of the media? Do these go hand in hand?
 

Burnem Wizfyre

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Wow. So Russian media is that much of a farce? They cant seriously think anyone is buying that tabloid crap. What is it with communist countries and hilariously totalitarian government control of the media? Do these go hand in hand?
Have you watched Fox News? Not like we have any right to complain about the poor state of media in another country when we have things like CNN/MSNBC and Fox News.
 

fanaskin

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Have you watched Fox News? Not like we have any right to complain about the poor state of media in another country when we have things like CNN/MSNBC and Fox News.
yeah we can when the tv news is all state run, even internet news is regulated by the state in Russia and bloggers have to "register with the state"
 

Tuco

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Yeah it'd be a false equivalence to compare Russian media and fox/cnn. One is governed by being favorable to those in power, the others is favorable to ratings.
 

khalid

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Comparison makes no sense, unless the government is going around and trying to shut down CNN, MSNBC, PBS, etc, throwing these people in jail who aren't in Fox news.
 

fanaskin

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The Aviationist

Iranian defense expert Babak Taghvaee believes the mistake was caused by the fact the Malaysian Boeing 777 was escorted over eastern Ukraine. Taghvaee is always very well informed and an extremely reliable source. Therefore, after he provided some details about this activity of the Ukrainian Air Force on ACIG forum thread about the war in Ukraine, we contacted him for some more insight.

Here's what he wrote to us.

"When the Crimea crisis began, the Ukrainian Air Force air command center quickly forward deployed six Su-27s to the Kulbakino AB. Since beginning of the crisis and the Russia intervention, the 831st TAB has the important task to provide air defense as well as security of whole country. Six fully armed Flankers have always been in the sky especially when the other Ukrainian Air Force airplanes such as transporters and attackers like Fulcrums and Rooks were in the East of Ukraine," explains Taghvaee.

"But when the Su-25M1 was shot down by the Russia Air Force 6969th AB's MiG-29 on Jul. 16, the situation and condition became more critical than previous days and more Su-27 sorties were conducted to confront Russian MiG-29s. I believe those two Su-27s were not in sky just for standard practice in that day [Jul. 17], I believe they were involved in HAVCAP (High Asset Value Combat Air Patrol) mission sortie in that day."

In other words: since the Russian interceptors had downed a Su-25 on the previous days, the Ukrainian escorted all military and civil flights over eastern Ukraine on Jul. 17. Including MH17.

"During the UEFA 2012, the 831st TAB and its Flankers had same role, during those competitions they had duty to escort the airliners in FL330 and other routes in case emergency. They played same role during the Sochi Winter Olympics in Russia. They were airborne and they even escorted a hijacked airplane. They were also ready to provide security of all passenger airplanes over Ukraine. They are now following same procedure and they could protect all of the airplanes over Ukraine in-front of Russians since Jul 16."

Provided the Su-27s were really escorting or (more likely) watching from their CAP station many, if not all, civil flights over Eastern Ukraine for the first time ever on Jul. 17, in the wake of the downing of the Su-25, the operators inside the Buk may have mistaken the Boeing 777 shadowed by/near two Flankers for a high-value plane of the Ukrainian Air Force. On their radar screens, the sight of a large plane with two accompanying (or circling in CAP not too far away) fighter jets was completely new and may only mean the Ukrainians were escorting an important plane. And that would be the reason why they downed it without spending too much time analysing its transponder code and altitude.
 

Burnem Wizfyre

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Wow. So Russian media is that much of a farce? They cant seriously think anyone is buying that tabloid crap.What is it with communist countries and hilariously totalitarian government control of the media? Do these go hand in hand?
Comparison makes no sense, unless the government is going around and trying to shut down CNN, MSNBC, PBS, etc, throwing these people in jail who aren't in Fox news.
It is a fair comparison in that regard, the media in this country is a farce as well. I should have elaborated as it wasn't my intention to say that a state run media is the same as what we have, just the end result of media in this country is just as shit as theirs, lies and propaganda and if you think no one in Russia believes the shit they spew I will point to Araysar in the same way we point to Merlin, Tad10, Bleedat and the other members of the herp derp crew that recycle fox news talking points on this forum.
 

Loser Araysar

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Burnem, I am seeker of truth. I have no reason to believe the western narrative to create casus belli considering that the West initiated the crisis by destabilizing Ukraine in the first place.
 

Loser Araysar

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Bro I cant be bothered to read and click all your drivel on a phone. I just read the highlights
 

fanaskin

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Cockpit of MH17 found sawed in half at crash site
International monitors who have finally gained full access to the Malaysia Airlines crash site in eastern Ukraine said Tuesday the Boeing 777's cockpit inexplicably had been sawed in half while under the control of Russian-backed separatists.

The monitors said said large parts of the cockpit -- and every part of the fuselage -- were carried off. They said they are not sure why such vital pieces of evidence from the downed plane were tampered with.
 

zombiewizardhawk

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Fox News is definitely the one and only biased news channel the US has ever and will ever have. The other news sources are saints and angels who only want to enlighten us to the truth of the world while Fox News wants us all to be pathetic little worms with no idea what is actually going on.
 

Moogalak

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Fox News is definitely the one and only biased news channel the US has ever and will ever have. The other news sources are saints and angels who only want to enlighten us to the truth of the world while Fox News wants us all to be pathetic little worms with no idea what is actually going on.
You have to be trolling. MSNBC not biased??
 

Tuco

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Wizardhawk usually responds to statements he doesn't like by building absurd strawmen then sarcastically having his way with them.