Marriage and the Power of Divorce

Grumpus_sl said:

No break up. The thing that got me thinking about it was last night my grandparents where over. They have had an amazing marriage. True love and all that bull shit. And they were giving my little sister a wedding gift.

My grandma said to me "If you ever get married we will get you a nice wedding gift to"

I had no clue what to say because I have no intention of ever getting married. My little sister is getting married at 19 years old, to a guy that's 20. Making a huge mistake and she is getting praise for it, and presents.

I don't have the heart to tell my grandparents that will most likely be dead soon that marriage is bullshit when if one of them passes the other will likely follow from a broken heart. Yet they are so happy at the thought of me getting married.

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Maybe it isn't a huge mistake, none of us know. Statistically sure, it is doomed to fail. But we don't really know, all you can do is hope for the best.

Marriage isn't bullshit. For some people, it just isn't right. But for some people it is. If it isn't right for you, then it just is what it is. There are plenty of women out there who aren't looking for marriage necessarily but still a relationship.If the legal thing is the only thing stopping you, don't think that just not getting married absolves you of liability, because it doesn't.

mkopec_sl said:

/shrugs, this dude that I work with gets an alimony because his wife made more than him.

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haha, what a fag

Maybe, maybe not. It sounds like they are in similar places financially so I doubt she'll be able to get much of anything. I wouldn't stress about it. My sister did plenty of stupid shit, if I learned anything from that mess it was that I should have just told her the truth and supported her regardless. Don't sugarcoat it but also dn't be overly judgmental or whatever.

Chaperoned while dating? are you mormon or something?

chaos how long have you been married/with your wife? ive always wanted to ask the question, what if you never got married would you two still be together? or is that little contract what is really holding two people together, as i said my parents never got married, still together 35 years, and both uncles had 2 divorces each, and i dont have any friends that have been married a long time, im only 26 so never really had anyone to ask the question too.

Heh ok I take back everything I said, those people are fucked.

Although... I remember seeing something about people who didn't live together or have sex prior to marriage having a much lower divorce rate than those who did.

TecKnoe_sl said:

chaos how long have you been married/with your wife? ive always wanted to ask the question, what if you never got married would you two still be together? or is that little contract what is really holding two people together, as i said my parents never got married, still together 35 years, and both uncles had 2 divorces each, and i dont have any friends that have been married a long time, im only 26 so never really had anyone to ask the question too.

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We've known each other for like 8 years I think and been married for almost 5. We got married because she got pregnant and didn't have insurance. That doesn't sound romantic or whatever, but it was the right decision. We would have gotten married eventually anyway, just not right then. I think that without the kids or the marriage we would definitely still be together, but there's no way to tell.

I was previously married though, that marriage was a huge mistake. I was young and fucking retarded and married a girl that I never should have even been with, much less married. My wife was in a pretty long relationship prior to this that ended pretty shittily. Stuff happens, you move on. It is all about the right people, but I'm sure plenty of people thought they had found the right people only to find out later maybe not.

Grumpus_sl said:

That makes more sense to me then getting married for the sake of getting married.

In a world where girls grow up watching fairy tale movies and read fairy tale stories. Men getting married to appease the more emotional of the two sexes and the more emotional having the power to both end the marriage and to profit from it is to crazy for me to get behind.

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Again, that is naive Grumpus.

Tons of men get married because they want to. Because it is something that feels right to them and means a lot.

There are people that don't want to get married because they just don't which is fine, but to say all men just get married for the sake of the dumb bitches in their life is just childish.

Honestly, this entire discussion from you has sounded like the beliefs of a 16 year old that has just been dumped by the girl he thought was the one.

Yeah women have their crazy moments, men have the asshole moments but most people are not as one dimensional and stupid as you are making them out to be.

chaos_sl said:

Heh ok I take back everything I said, those people are fucked.

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^

Grumpus_sl said:

But the precedent that has been set is scary as fuck. Less and less rights for men when it comes to marriage.

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It's not that out of the ordinary as it's already been said. Pre-nups are contracts, and while States may have some additional rules for them (state interest in marriage etc.), at the end of the day it's still an agreement. In any form of contractual litigation fraud is THE universal solvent. All she did here was prove that he defrauded her/that her signature was not voluntary.

The reason this case is getting press is probably because she succeed at meeting a very VERY high standard. In Texas, for example, pre-nups can be voided only under very strict circumstances such as if they are not signed "voluntarily." This could possibly mean having your fiancee threaten to cancel the wedding 30 seconds before it happens, hold a gun to your head, or whatever. The difficulty comes in because the signed document creates a presumption of voluntariness that you have to rebut. This case is news because she actually met that burden.

Texas has not violated a prenup is over 27 years on grounds of "voluntariness." So, it's kind of a bitch to prove. Had this guy pulled out the prenup ahead of time (ALI model statues say 30 days or more), had lawyers for both him and her present, and been a bit smarter with the drafting language, he could have easily had it stand. It sounds like he put a bunch of crap in there (first born son I'll throw it away, etc.) and it bit him in the ass.

Contractual obligations cut both ways Ser Davos, and she proved that he just didn't live up to his and defrauded her.

I live in a regular old middle class neighborhood in the Pacific Northwest, not some reality show in Malibu.

I get that your sister is being some crazy religious freak but the rest of this sounds like you are living the Jersey Shore or whatever the fuck is on these days.

I'm glad I don't live in that world honestly lol.

Grumpus_sl said:

That's what im trying to say though. You are a woman, you have nothing to be worried about if you so choose. As long as you look decent and make less money then the man you are with, you have no weight on your shoulders should your marriage end.

Apart from the heartache and all that.

You don't live in my world, you have a vagina.

If I want to get married "Can I trust her with my kids,money,property, life"

If a woman wants to get married "Does he have enough money?"

If you want the kids, you can take them, if you want money you can have it, property to be taken. And you can choose to drag him through the courts if you feel like being malicious.

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You are missing the point of marriage entirely though. You don't enter into marriage thinking "Can I trust her with my kids,money,property, life". If that IS what you are thinking, that isn't the right person for you. When you find that person, you are looking towards the rest of your life together, not dreading the end of it.

Read my earlier post, yes if I were to get divorced tomorrow I would have a ton to worry about. Sure I would get alimony and child support but I would also have to start over, at 28 where I should have been at 18. And do that with 3 kids.

I get that I will never totally understand your point of view, but I live with, sleep with and talk with a man every day and we do talk about things like this. I do understand some of it.

Like Chaos said earlier, at some point it doesn't become about "his money" and "her money", it is your family and yes, both parties are entitled to split that if they should separate because they worked together to build that family.

You obviously don't understand marriage which is totally cool given that you haven't met that person yet, but if and when you do, those things will not be the concern you are making them out to be now.

The advent of the internet means you hear about the crazy fucks more. I had a friend who after ~15 years of marriage with his wife (no kids, never wanted them), decided to get divorced... and it was amicable. They never fought over it and just split everything down the middle. Even when their house wasn't selling (~2009) and was holding up everything being final, she bought out his half at fair market value, which I doubt they would have gotten.

Honestly, there are a lot of cool women out there that aren't psychotic, you just read/hear about them less.

Well gents, the moral of the story is that marriage is forever. If you don't stay married till you die, you'll probably wind up wishing you had.

Be smart. Buy/rent something with a 2nd story. Just in case.