Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
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Nirgon said:
so I am going to equate you both to being brain dead individuals and not engage with you on this subject because it will shit up and the thread
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Be honest, you're not engaging further because you are incapable of it. Your argument makes no sense, and your position is weak. You can sense this in the deep primal roots of your brainstem, because lord knows it's not happening in your barren frontal lobe.

It's ok man. Just put the fries in the bag.
 
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Masakari

Masakari

שלום ושגשוג
<Aristocrat╭ರ_•́>
15,147
57,377
Games that are oppressive towards its players (like Everquest) provide trauma bonding experiences that help get people addicted (e.g. the idea of losing everything in a hard to get to place).

Casual playstyles have taken away the trauma that gaming used to induce, which deadens the rollercoaster of emotions, and I think it needs to be brought back.

Suffering is what unites us.
 
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Nirgon

Nirgon

Log Wizard
18,371
29,409
Masakari said:
Games that are oppressive towards its players (like Everquest) provide trauma bonding experiences that help get people addicted (e.g. the idea of losing everything in a hard to get to place).

Casual playstyles have taken away the trauma that gaming used to induce, which deadens the rollercoaster of emotions, and I think it needs to be brought back.

Suffering is what unites us.
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Velious on live wasnt out half this long, and on P99 the amount of bitching I've seen about "I didn't get X yet!" blows my mind

You aren't supposed to get every single thing
 
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Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
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8,570
Nirgon said:
You aren't supposed to get every single thing
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It was Brad McQuaid's vision that a quarter century after his game's release, and years after his actual death, that a small group of the most narcissistic degenerates to ever play his creation would gather on a single free-to-play server, and gatekeep the completion of epic and zone access quests from players who can only devote 20 hours a week instead of 40.

We're so lucky Nirgon has seen the early design docs and can tell us how EverQuest is supposed to be.
 
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Araxen

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
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You can't even get an Earth staff on P99 green unless it's via the draft. It's gatekeeped by some RMT retards on that server. Quarm is the server that does raiding right if you are going to have it.
 
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Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
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8,570
Araxen said:
You can't even get an Earth staff on P99 green unless it's via the draft. It's gatekeeped by some RMT retards on that server. Quarm is the server that does raiding right if you are going to have it.
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I mean it’s fair. Velious has only been out for *rifles through calendar* four fucking years now. Totally reasonable that Hate is still on incel lockdown.
 
Nirgon

Nirgon

Log Wizard
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Araxen said:
You can't even get an Earth staff on P99 green unless it's via the draft. It's gatekeeped by some RMT retards on that server. Quarm is the server that does raiding right if you are going to have it.
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Yeah, that part is a legit complaint at least.

I read some of the discord getting shitted up over at M&M, the beloved Inquisitor class discussion no less. Is nothing sacred?

1760066182909.png


1760072480193.png



Literally covered cc like this for a whole wyrmsbane clear
 
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Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
13,544
21,262
Quaid said:
I mean it’s fair. Velious has only been out for *rifles through calendar* four fucking years now. Totally reasonable that Hate is still on incel lockdown.
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People were wiping on breaking into hate until the day the zone got remade lol.

So its prime for incel lockdown….

(Member berries my p99 decrepit hide during drakes w a shaman bro…oh the fun)
 
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Pasteton

Pasteton

Vyemm Raider
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They’re definitely not listening to lots of people. It’s the opposite of pantheon where scope creep was a constant issue. there’s a crazy amount of content that’s worth doing and there’s definitely time commitment and risk in doing it. The game is designed in a way that it’s rewarding to go exploring, but there’s a real sense of danger. Not ‘oh I have to waste time getting my body and xp back’ but real oh shit i might never get my corpse back or for days if I die here type of fear. It’s subjective of course but I enjoy the anxiety of it and that’s why I said this is really for 5% or less of people, most won’t consider that fun but just frustrating. At the same time, if you’re prepared and got the right buffs etc, your actual chance of dying or not escaping a shit situation is pretty low so a lot of things have to line up badly to actually die, so far in my experience.
 
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Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
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Pasteton said:
They’re definitely not listening to lots of people. It’s the opposite of pantheon where scope creep was a constant issue. there’s a crazy amount of content that’s worth doing and there’s definitely time commitment and risk in doing it. The game is designed in a way that it’s rewarding to go exploring, but there’s a real sense of danger. Not ‘oh I have to waste time getting my body and xp back’ but real oh shit i might never get my corpse back or for days if I die here type of fear. It’s subjective of course but I enjoy the anxiety of it and that’s why I said this is really for 5% or less of people, most won’t consider that fun but just frustrating. At the same time, if you’re prepared and got the right buffs etc, your actual chance of dying or not escaping a shit situation is pretty low so a lot of things have to line up badly to actually die, so far in my experience.
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Aren't there in-game corpse retrieval NPCs? Is it even possible to permanently lose your stuff?
 
Burns

Burns

Avatar of War Slayer
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16,537
Quaid said:
Aren't there in-game corpse retrieval NPCs? Is it even possible to permanently lose your stuff?
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I didn't see or hear of a corpse summoning npc in this game, only Necros (and SKs?) with coffins can, just like EQ. You may be thinking of Adrullan (Evercraft), which has npc summoners atm, but I assume that's just for the Alpha/Beta tests.
 
Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
12,130
8,570
Burns said:
I didn't see or hear of a corpse summoning npc in this game, only Necros (and SKs?) with coffins can, just like EQ. You may be thinking of Adrullan (Evercraft), which has npc summoners atm, but I assume that's just for the Alpha/Beta tests.
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No. They added a corpse retrieval NPC to cities that you can activate after a period of time elapses for a fee. It's not possible for your corpse to rot.

The only real death penalty is the potential destruction of your play session. Corpse retrieval NPCs in game basically guarantees 50% of your group logs out on every wipe and just waits until tomorrow to get their body the easy way. Unless of course, it takes like a week for the corpse to be available for summoning, but that would be absurd for a whole other set of reasons.
 
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Burns

Burns

Avatar of War Slayer
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Quaid said:
No. They added a corpse retrieval NPC to cities that you can activate after a period of time elapses. It's not possible for your corpse to rot.
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Oh, that's nice I guess. Wonder if it's just for the alpha/beta or if it is/will be 10x or more than a PC necro coffin.

Any idea where they are located, the cost, or what the time lock is? It took something like 30 to 45 min to run back to Vale when I died, then another 30 to 45 min to run back to town on a class w/o gate... so that would have been useful.
 
Quaid

Quaid

Trump's Staff
12,130
8,570
Burns said:
Oh, that's nice I guess. Wonder if it's just for the alpha/beta or if it is/will be 10x or more than a PC necro coffin.

Any idea where they are located, the cost, or what the time lock is? It took something like 30 to 45 min to run back to Vale when I died, then another 30 to 45 min to run back to town on a class w/o gate... so that would have been useful.
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No I haven't played since several tests ago. Likely won't until retail release.

I saw Nick demonstrate its function on a stream, but he didn't give any specific details.
 
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Nirgon

Nirgon

Log Wizard
18,371
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Pasteton said:
They’re definitely not listening to lots of people. It’s the opposite of pantheon where scope creep was a constant issue. there’s a crazy amount of content that’s worth doing and there’s definitely time commitment and risk in doing it. The game is designed in a way that it’s rewarding to go exploring, but there’s a real sense of danger. Not ‘oh I have to waste time getting my body and xp back’ but real oh shit i might never get my corpse back or for days if I die here type of fear. It’s subjective of course but I enjoy the anxiety of it and that’s why I said this is really for 5% or less of people, most won’t consider that fun but just frustrating. At the same time, if you’re prepared and got the right buffs etc, your actual chance of dying or not escaping a shit situation is pretty low so a lot of things have to line up badly to actually die, so far in my experience.
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Risk vs reward is so sorely missing from these modern MMOs. It's one of the major hallmarks of a good one when they balance it well. Going into Seb and howling stones with a key or going into fear/hate, knowing the risk in real classic EQ was a totally different and exciting experience. Good posts on the interactions and lifelong friendships that stemmed from such systems. I enjoyed the read about that Fungul guy and all that... wishing to see something like that exist again.

I'd also echo the waiting to play and test again, I showed up for the early stress tests and was extremely pleased to see their turn around time on improvements and basically total fixes. These are the kinds of things that separate a real dedicated development team from the script kiddies running some of these chain crashing WoW emulators.

When they have it mostly near a true beta state and flesh the classes out again, I'll be back. My only feedback right now is obvious things to keep in mind: more risk/reward, more class identity (esp quests) and of course more memorable monsters/NPCs.
 
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Nirgon

Nirgon

Log Wizard
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Araxen said:
You can't even get an Earth staff on P99 green unless it's via the draft. It's gatekeeped by some RMT retards on that server. Quarm is the server that does raiding right if you are going to have it.
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PvP is the solution to shit being locked down like that btw

Don't care what the mostly alt tabbed out dummies think, this is the answer

It's either that or petition quest, and if you prefer that, I am going to laugh at you
 
Kithani

Kithani

Blackwing Lair Raider
1,700
2,398
Quaid said:
I thought so at first - but now I think it may be worst of both worlds given likely player behaviour. Will absolutely encourage more ragequits.
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Corpse rotting completely deleting your gear forever is a dumb mechanic and I would argue only happened very, VERY rarely back in the day. Corpse runs are fairly debatable but I won’t go there as it’s a separate issue IMO.

I think corpse decay with a shadowrest like system is a good compromise but make it like 2-3 IRL days. Basically an option if it’s Sunday night and you don’t have 2 hours to burn on a CR but if you want to actually keep playing then you’re stuck with the traditional CR or find a corpse summon Necro etc. I agree if it’s 30 minutes or a couple hours or whatever then it’s probably dumb.
 
Pasteton

Pasteton

Vyemm Raider
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2,211
first time I’m hearing of this corpse retrieval thing. Will see if it’s still there, it may be removed. I also think it seems dumb. Anyways you get a long time to get your corpse back and many options that depend on other players. Having an npc for it could be an alpha test only thing
 
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