Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

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Goonsquad Officer
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Burns said:
a forge next to the woodworkers area in the docks,
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i found this forge! its handy...but now you need an ingot mould to make each ingot and they're very heavy. so they're too hheavy to carry in bulk. and arn't sold there. they (to my knowledge) are only sold near the west gate.

so i lost again

*shakes fist at sky*
 
Burns

Burns

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... said:
i found this forge! its handy...but now you need an ingot mould to make each ingot and they're very heavy. so they're too hheavy to carry in bulk. and arn't sold there. they (to my knowledge) are only sold near the west gate.

so i lost again

*shakes fist at sky*
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Make a mule on a second account and stock it with molds! Start as a LW/Tailor/Chanter/Survivalist for 1 free 6 slot bag, then go see shady gnome for a second.
 
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Goonsquad Officer
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Burns said:
Make a mule on a second account and stock it with molds! Start as a LW/Tailor/Chanter/Survivalist for 1 free 6 slot bag, then go see shady gnome for a second.
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i don't think a mold mule could walk very far. i bought...like 60 moulds to make my ingots and i suddenly could only crawl. it's wild how heavy they are. or i guess it's the bulk you need them in that does it heh.
 
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Pasteton

Pasteton

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I’ve heard the devs on stream say their main focus is single group content. I forgot about the planes I am not sure if they were there at eq release as I didn’t play till kunark. But based on how the devs seem to be focused on group content I’d be surprised if they had that level of raid content
 
Araxen

Araxen

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The planes weren't in at release. They came in after launch in EQ. Fear, then Hate, and then the terrible one Sky.
 
Quaid

Quaid

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Quaid said:
Before Kunark there was like 30+ hours of potential raid content in Fear, Hate, Sky, Vox, Naggy, and Phinny every week. We had different experiences in EQ for sure.
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Araxen said:
The planes weren't in at release. They came in after launch in EQ. Fear, then Hate, and then the terrible one Sky.
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Within a year of release there was a ton of raiding to do if you were so inclined.

If it’s true that there’s no real raid game to speak of, that means there will be no real guild meta experience either. That’s a tough one. I really enjoy the large group bonding over kills that carries over into discord conversations. The internal memes and culture that develops around pursuing common goals. I even enjoy the occasional bit of drama and politics, just like a club that exists in real life.

There are thousands of players in guilds in old school MMORPGs playing right now. MNM should be interested in attracting entire guilds to move over and set up shop. How do they attract these guilds without a robust set of activities for them to do as a team? “Come over and grind levels and then when you reach the end do it again”?

I dunno - I really hope the people saying there's limited raid content are incorrect. It'd be wise for NWC to very publicly clarify one way or the other, because I think this could make a massive percentage of potential customers tune right out. How many games have died in the cradle because the narrative early is 'there's no endgame'?
 
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Siliconemelons

Siliconemelons

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Quaid said:
Shaun confirmed again on last stream posted to YouTube, zero instancing. They’re looking at ‘other ideas’, but hoping the ‘scale of the world’ will help…. I dunno. I have seen some shit. Guilds power leveling mages and parking COTH chains to mobilize raid forces… leveling and parking rangers as track bots… logging out entire alt raid forces at spawn points.

They better get real creative to defeat the poopsock army who will dominate the top end content. You're dealing with folks who have no problem playing 80+ hours per week, and more targets just means more poopsock.
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Animosity said:
Open world raiding quickly became cancer on EQ TLP's and still is. They must not have played any of those servers if they dont see that instancing raid content is a good idea. Alienating 99% of the player base is a stupid idea.
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Size of world is a legit means… even on Veeshan by SoL and esp by POP there were multi tiers of guilds of various sizes doing various “things” all over the world. Many of them never really “ran into” super poop sock competition. Guilds competed and had spats, but it was not like there was NOTHING for the thousands of active players all day to do, no guilds to form and join and find their niche etc.
 
Quaid

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Siliconemelons said:
Size of world is a legit means… even on Veeshan by SoL and esp by POP there were multi tiers of guilds of various sizes doing various “things” all over the world. Many of them never really “ran into” super poop sock competition. Guilds competed and had spats, but it was not like there was NOTHING for the thousands of active players all day to do, no guilds to form and join and find their niche etc.
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Ya some guilds during SOV were doing Plane of Hate & Nagafen purely by choice, and because the world was just too damn big to get to Western Wastes.

Definitely sounds like what I remember happening.

My guild kept Vox cockblocked deep into Luclin because folks still wanted White Dragon Hides for Improved Damage III cloaks.
 
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Kithani

Kithani

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Quaid said:
There are thousands of players in guilds in old school MMORPGs playing right now. MNM should be interested in attracting entire guilds to move over and set up shop. How do they attract these guilds without a robust set of activities for them to do as a team? “Come over and grind levels and then when you reach the end do it again”?
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I understand what you’re saying but your last sentence could also read “I mean what do they expect to do, make the core part of the game fun?!”
 
Quaid

Quaid

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Kithani said:
I understand what you’re saying but your last sentence could also read “I mean what do they expect to do, make the core part of the game fun?!”
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I find the notion that the leveling game is the 'core part of the game' debatable. In every MMORPG I've ever played I have spent the bulk of my time at max level, increasing my power through gear.

If they force players to focus on leveling as the core gameplay they're selling a version of MMORPG I simply haven't played, and I'm unsure I'll even enjoy that.
 
Kithani

Kithani

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Quaid said:
I find the notion that the leveling game is the 'core part of the game' debatable. In every MMORPG I've ever played I have spent the bulk of my time at max level, increasing my power through gear.

If they force players to focus on leveling as the core gameplay they're selling a version of MMORPG I simply haven't played, and I'm unsure I'll even enjoy that.
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EQ wasn’t that way for me and I imagine a lot of players in Classic. The game was the leveling / small group game and then when it came time to have a 2nd job (raiding) I quit
 
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Quaid

Quaid

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Kithani said:
EQ wasn’t that way for me and I imagine a lot of players in Classic. The game was the leveling / small group game and then when it came time to have a 2nd job (raiding) I quit
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If you enjoyed leveling so much and that was such a long term engaging gameplay loop, why did you quit instead of just rolling an alt, enjoying the loop again, and opting out of raiding?

The only way raiding becomes a second job is if there's no instancing and you're either on-call batphoning guildies for targets, or required to be online at set times because you don't know what spawn competition will be for targets of opportunity.

On Project Quarm I'm in a raiding guild with every target on farm status. There are guild locked instances of all raid targets. There are set raid nights 3 days a week, 3 hours each session. We field a force of about 62-75 folks every night, but the raid roster is 110ish members. Average attendance sits around 70%. It's fucking awesome. Come when you want, or don't. It doesn't matter and it's so so nice. There's at least 8 other guilds just like this.

S Secrets absolutely fucking nailed it.
 
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Kriptini

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Two different approaches to this that I liked were Rift and Throne & Liberty. In Rift, traditional raid bosses were instanced, though there were open world bosses labeled as "world events" that didn't encounter lock, so anyone could participate in killing them. (The loot kinda sucked though, so that concept would probably need to be developed further.)

Throne and Liberty had the PvE and PvP versions of all bosses, plus guild instances. The PvP versions of bosses spawned at scheduled times you could check on in-game, only stayed up for an hour at a time, and didn't encounter lock but dropped loot to guilds based on their contribution on the boss (increased by damage done, reduced by dying).

I agree with Quaid that for traditional raids, instanced is better, but it is cool to have some kind of open world boss that everyone can participate in.
 
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Quaid

Quaid

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Like a part time job?
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Is a part-time job one with zero attendance requirements, that is entirely optional and occurs at 100% predictable times that you are free to opt into or out of at your whim?

If I were a member of a DND game that met twice per week, would you consider that a part time job? How about a board game club? An astronomy club with bi-weekly meetings? A softball team? A church congregation?
 
Del

Del

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Quaid said:
If you enjoyed leveling so much and that was such a long term engaging gameplay loop, why did you quit instead of just rolling an alt, enjoying the loop again, and opting out of raiding?

The only way raiding becomes a second job is if there's no instancing and you're either on-call batphoning guildies for targets, or required to be online at set times because you don't know what spawn competition will be for targets of opportunity.

On Project Quarm I'm in a raiding guild with every target on farm status. There are guild locked instances of all raid targets. There are set raid nights 3 days a week, 3 hours each session. We field a force of about 62-75 folks every night, but the raid roster is 110ish members. Average attendance sits around 70%. It's fucking awesome. Come when you want, or don't. It doesn't matter and it's so so nice. There's at least 8 other guilds just like this.

S Secrets absolutely fucking nailed it.
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Quaid said:
Been doing EQ Velious era raiding on Quarm the last few weeks, for the first time in 25 years.

it fucking sucks so bad lol

I wonder how these guys are gonna do things.
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So Quarm and raiding fucking sucked so bad up until you learned that M&M wouldn't be very raid focused and would be non instanced. Interesting...
 
Kithani

Kithani

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Quaid said:
Is a part-time job one with zero attendance requirements, that is entirely optional and occurs at 100% predictable times that you are free to opt into or out of at your whim?

If I were a member of a DND game that met twice per week, would you consider that a part time job? How about a board game club? An astronomy club with bi-weekly meetings? A softball team? A church congregation?
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Hmm I see where you’re coming from and it’s difficult to really explain why I feel like there is a difference but I’ll try.

If I had to try and sum it up, I’d say none of those other activities have to reward your attendance/participation with points you can eventually spend on prizes which is the actual goal of the activity. I would say that outside of the actual raid LOOT most people wouldn’t show up every week just to hang out and kill a relatively easy dragon boss with 30 other sweaty dudes. With those other activities, assuming you like to do them, then doing the activity itself is the end goal/fun part

Edit: Also yes as a married dude with a career and family I prob wouldn’t find any of those “meet up multiple times per week” activities a good fit for my life too but yeah back in College or my single 20s I would have
 
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Quaid

Quaid

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Del said:
So Quarm and raiding fucking sucked so bad up until you learned that M&M wouldn't be very raid focused and would be non instanced. Interesting...
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Uhhh i was talking about raid encounter quality of early EQ in that comment, and yes, it was and is dogshit. I hope MNM does much better.

I said nothing of Quarm as a server. Totally disingenuous of you after reading my subsequent comments.

Good try though chief.
 
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Quaid

Quaid

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Kithani said:
Hmm I see where you’re coming from and it’s difficult to really explain why I feel like there is a difference but I’ll try.

If I had to try and sum it up, I’d say none of those other activities have to reward your attendance/participation with points you can eventually spend on prizes which is the actual goal of the activity. I would say that outside of the actual raid LOOT most people wouldn’t show up every week just to hang out and kill a relatively easy dragon boss with 30 other sweaty dudes. With those other activities, assuming you like to do them, then doing the activity itself is the end goal/fun part

Edit: Also yes as a married dude with a career and family I prob wouldn’t find any of those “meet up multiple times per week” activities a good fit for my life too but yeah back in College or my single 20s I would have
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I dunno man I think you're imagining it wrong. I play this instead of having out of the house hobbies/interests BECAUSE I'm intensely a family man.

My wife is my favourite person of all time, and every minute I'm not in her presence is a sub-optimal minute. I have 3 kids, two under 7 who are in bed by 8pm. On the 3 raid nights (they're all weeknights) I go downstairs after their bed time ritual and boot up EQ. Wife usually does a yoga or some beauty shit, and we're sitting next to each other by 8:30. I'm on my 6 year old gaming laptop on the couch and she's right there too. Sometimes I keep only a single earphone on so we can watch a Basketball game or some reality TV or whatever. If it's a serious target I pay more attention. We're shooting the shit the whole time. She goes to bed around 10:30pm, I stay up another hour or so on raid nights. The other nights we go to bed at the same time.

Anyway, it's awesome, and it's enabled entirely by the scheduling that instancing makes possible.
 
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GuardianX

GuardianX

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Found a way to get under NH and man they have a lot of things underground.

Question though, do I need a key for the fight club or just a rogue?
 
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