Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

I saw something about it somewhere too. One of the deep dives maybe?

Then make the buffs longer if using reagents IMO. Can't have short buffs and reagents else people will be carrying 8000 reagents to groups

Reagents for Druid were 3 silver each. For Druid, group regen does not cost a reagent, while group skin does. For enchanter, both group enlightenment and group int/wis/cha (one spell) cost a regent. No group strength or swiftness right now.

Can’t speak for the other classes.

Daidraco said:

Reagent spells for Clerics start at 24. You have a single person HP buff that stacks with your regular HP buff that costs a token of devotion and the group resilience buff costs a token of devotion. So you're buffing your tank and your group every 35 minutes for 40 copper in total.

I understand the idea of taxing people to keep the economy in better shape - but I think theyre going after the wrong "faucet" of funds. As a Cleric, you're most likely going to be grouping in a full group of 6. So income from mobs is already going to be low. Your exp rate is going to be lower in a full group of 6. Then theyre taxing you an additional 40 copper every 35 minutes. Clerics that routinely group wont have enough money for most of their vital spells by 24, much less gear. If theyre that worried about inflation, they need to nerf or balance out the classes that can solo. I just soloed on my fighter farming one of the level 8 nameds in NH from like 6 to 10? Somewhere around that amount of time and he had close to 5g by the time he was done. Way, WAY more money than my Cleric did this phase by level 10.

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Terrible idea, single target buffs for me then.

Daidraco said:

Reagent spells for Clerics start at 24. You have a single person HP buff that stacks with your regular HP buff that costs a token of devotion and the group resilience buff costs a token of devotion. So you're buffing your tank and your group every 35 minutes for 40 copper in total.

I understand the idea of taxing people to keep the economy in better shape - but I think theyre going after the wrong "faucet" of funds. As a Cleric, you're most likely going to be grouping in a full group of 6. So income from mobs is already going to be low. Your exp rate is going to be lower in a full group of 6. Then theyre taxing you an additional 40 copper every 35 minutes. Clerics that routinely group wont have enough money for most of their vital spells by 24, much less gear. If theyre that worried about inflation, they need to nerf or balance out the classes that can solo. I just soloed on my fighter farming one of the level 8 nameds in NH from like 6 to 10? Somewhere around that amount of time and he had close to 5g by the time he was done. Way, WAY more money than my Cleric did this phase by level 10.

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I have imagine part of their vision is fixing exp so that full groups get the most exp

Noodleface said:

I have imagine part of their vision is fixing exp so that full groups get the most exp

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There really isn't a "vision" - that's the whole problem. So far it's just been a whole hell of a lot of, "What was it like in EQ?!?" and "winging it".

They haven't really laid out what exactly their hopes, dreams, plans, direction, etc. are. You'll get a lot of nebulous, vague terms like, "a return to old school MMO games!!!" but they don't ever actually define what that stuff means.

This game is going to be a mess.

Oh shit, there isn't a vision? I guess I better go unsub. How'd that vision work out for Pantheon?

Fucking doomers.

Has anyone encountered any lore at all? Gods, villains, heroes, legends, history, etc?

is it compiled anywhere?

Kirun said:

There really isn't a "vision" - that's the whole problem. So far it's just been a whole hell of a lot of, "What was it like in EQ?!?" and "winging it".

They haven't really laid out what exactly their hopes, dreams, plans, direction, etc. are. You'll get a lot of nebulous, vague terms like, "a return to old school MMO games!!!" but they don't ever actually define what that stuff means.

This game is going to be a mess.

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Oh I know. Everything is very vague. I just like saying vision in brads legacy

Shawn’s spelled out his vision ad nauseum on his streams, but yea the website is more murky about it . What Shawn has said repeatedly about what his vision means

- slow progress (accomplished easily enough with combat time and xp gain, but also with less dull mechanics including long and in my opinion, interesting quests and pursuit of gear and access keys and special spells that prolong the process. It’s not the same as a lineage style endless grind, is best way I can summarize)

- an emphasis on the leveling experience and not just a flat rush to endgame. Even though degenerates like me will still try to rush, you will get stomped if you don’t spend a bit of extra time trying to equip yourself a bit as you level, esp after lvl 30ish. This also means a disproportionate amount of low level content. I personally don’t like this but I have gotten a lot of pushback on this and it is their vision, so I appreciate them sticking to their guns. You could make 15 characters and the leveling experience will be new every time easily- that’s how much content there is! I know it sounds unbelievableThere’s still a lot at the high end too so I’m good.

- real danger. This just means dying sucks and slows you down, basically. This one I’m mixed about. It ends up feeling like an annoyance or frustration sometimes as you end up just kinda sittin around waiting for a drag or rez, but there will be some larpy stories out there about some high level helping some lowbie getting his corpse and how it enriched the gameplay experience or some crap. But either way there is a real consequence to death and it makes exploration more interesting,
as you can’t just Leroy everywhere most of the time.

Limited raiding - this is looking to be true but it’s honestly stil more endgame content than we are generally used to in MMOs these days. They save a lot of time by not really polishing or qa’ing anything or having much in the way of complex encounter design or visual flairs. So even with their small team they can pump out hp sponges to beat on with your squad. I honestly don’t mind, because the exploration aspect is such a huge part of it and progress is so glacial, that the simplicity of the encounters isn’t necessarily a glaring negative. For example even tho raiding is limited, there’s going to be atleast two raid zones before 1.0, one is an expedition and one is a raid zone of fallen watch- both will be very large.

They are doing a great job meeting those vision points Shawn talks about.

what Shawn doesn’t talk about as much, and which IS the big problem in this game, is combat mechanics and class design, and i think for long term survival he will need to hire an experienced guy to salvage that for him

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Pasteton said:

what Shawn doesn’t talk about as much, and which IS the big problem in this game, is combat mechanics and class design, and i think for long term survival he will need to hire an experienced guy to salvage that for him

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I'm pretty sure they've been working on that? The whole class revamp pass they're doing is supposedly to differentiate the classes and lean into the power-fantasy of each of them. Combat is obviously EQ-style but leaning into interdependence and situational abilities. I don't think it's very complicated, but tbd if they will hit the mark

Should have just used VG classes and a bit of EQ or vice versa. With a limited team, no need to reinvent the wheel.

Quaid said:

Has anyone encountered any lore at all? Gods, villains, heroes, legends, history, etc?

is it compiled anywhere?

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Not really, almost dark souls level of lore in loading screens and random npc yammering. There were a bunch of lore spergs on the discord that were trying to document some of it.

I'm not a fan of the MUD action commands or the archaic text box and journal setup for quests and such. It's a bit of a pain until you know what to do for each quest. The bard quest in Wood Elf city for instance has you speak to 5 different people all around the tree city, and I had to ask the quest giver about each one of them by typing out their names, and scrolling up to see what their names were since the chat box is scrolling constantly, then I had to go through the journal as I went along, figuring out which ones I've talked to and which were left... Since the entries in the journal were separated into paragraphs I had to piece together which location went to who and some of them didn't even mention the names. Maybe there's an easier way to do that, but I can't say I enjoyed it even a small amount. Then figuring out what to do to get the instrument from the shelf, figuring out what to do on the carpet during the performance and what to type, it was all a complete chore and felt disconnected from the game. Maybe some people like that kinda thing, and maybe it brings back memories of the old days for them, but I just found myself wanting to skip it all. I wasn't interested in the bard lore after that. Also, the loading screen text never seems to match up with the loading screen image which is kinda jarring.

The total extent of my lore knowledge... Ashira are dirty, they hate goblins and visa versa, boats can tokyo drift into port, everyone hates dark elves, especially other dark elves and gnomes are kinda smelly.

The lack of lore really is odd especially when they make weird class/race combos but there’s zero lore to support it

Daidraco said:

Reagent spells for Clerics start at 24. You have a single person HP buff that stacks with your regular HP buff that costs a token of devotion and the group resilience buff costs a token of devotion. So you're buffing your tank and your group every 35 minutes for 40 copper in total.

I understand the idea of taxing people to keep the economy in better shape - but I think theyre going after the wrong "faucet" of funds. As a Cleric, you're most likely going to be grouping in a full group of 6. So income from mobs is already going to be low. Your exp rate is going to be lower in a full group of 6. Then theyre taxing you an additional 40 copper every 35 minutes. Clerics that routinely group wont have enough money for most of their vital spells by 24, much less gear. If theyre that worried about inflation, they need to nerf or balance out the classes that can solo. I just soloed on my fighter farming one of the level 8 nameds in NH from like 6 to 10? Somewhere around that amount of time and he had close to 5g by the time he was done. Way, WAY more money than my Cleric did this phase by level 10.

Click to expand...

The tokens of devotion from the DE trainer are 75c a piece. I’ve settled on playing cleric, but looking forward to such reagent costs tbh.

What lore do we know of any MMO sans… Conan lotr or even wow, they all had established worlds and lore before.

Even EQ was very lore absent unless you dove into it. Same here..but.. I didnt.

I got some sense of “i wonder…” from wyrmsbane named Agro and death messages but…ehhh. But perhaps the removal of the armor quests put a damper on the lore exposition of that zone.

I mean…did anyone read the lore of even their Epics in EQ? Bards doomed the world in their for exchange of some sword a dude found on the side of the road.