NHL 2012-13 - Half Season Thread

Eomer_sl said:

I've seen it mentioned in several articles as well, from a couple months back. Having 32 teams is optimal from a scheduling/division perspective. Quebec would get one team for the 2015 season when their arena is finished or near finished. Not sure where the other team would go, but I'd imagine somewhere in the US.

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Think Halifax could support a team?

lurkingdirk_sl said:

Think Halifax could support a team?

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No, Halifax is barely 400,000 people. Quebec is the last Canadian market that could support a team, outside of the greater Toronto area. And really, even Quebec and Winnipeg are marginal. If the loonie were to drop 15% in a short period they'd be in deep shit.

Eomer_sl said:

No, Halifax is barely 400,000 people. Quebec is the last Canadian market that could support a team, outside of the greater Toronto area. And really, even Quebec and Winnipeg are marginal. If the loonie were to drop 15% in a short period they'd be in deep shit.

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I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL put a second team in Toronto.

I would be. It's a massive headache to do. Buffalo, Detroit and most importantly Toronto would all want hundreds of millions of dollars because it would encroach on their markets. I doubt that's something the NHL wants to take on. And I don't know that there's too many people with pockets big enough to pay a ~200 million dollar expansion fee along with half a billion to a billion in compensation.

Araxen_sl said:

I think Portland or Seattle would be the US Team. There was somebody that has shown interest in buying a franchise for one of those cities I forget which one.

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It's probably Paul Allen who is interested.

Araxen_sl said:

I think Portland or Seattle would be the US Team. There was somebody that has shown interest in buying a franchise for one of those cities I forget which one.

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I believe it's Seattle that is trying to get an arena built.

Eomer_sl said:

No, Halifax is barely 400,000 people. Quebec is the last Canadian market that could support a team, outside of the greater Toronto area. And really, even Quebec and Winnipeg are marginal. If the loonie were to drop 15% in a short period they'd be in deep shit.

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Filwen_sl said:

I wouldn't be surprised if the NHL put a second team in Toronto.

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Eomer_sl said:

I would be. It's a massive headache to do. Buffalo, Detroit and most importantly Toronto would all want hundreds of millions of dollars because it would encroach on their markets. I doubt that's something the NHL wants to take on. And I don't know that there's too many people with pockets big enough to pay a ~200 million dollar expansion fee along with half a billion to a billion in compensation.

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You all make good points.

I'd not be surprised, however, if the NHL is looking to go bigger into the Canadian market. Especially with this latest lockout - they've just pooched themselves with the American television market. They're starting again from square one. What a mistake this lockout was.

Given their track record with expansion, they'll probably put another franchise in Arizona and one in Mexico City or some shit.

Anybody interested in a buyout pool? Everyone picks one player from each team, and most correct picks wins? Or pick 15 players and highest total dollar value of correct picks wins?

Hamilton should get a team. The Leafs and Wings would not be hurt one iota, especially the Leafs. They'd probably save money on travel expenses if you put them in the same division. Fuck, let the Leafs own both teams in Ontario. Not like Norris didn't own and/or control the Wings, Black Hawks, Rangers and Bruins all at once. Might hurt Buffalo I guess, not sure how many people are going to drive an hour, plus cross the border from Buffalo. Do people in Canada really root for Buffalo unless they have friends or relatives on the team?

Dropping the Devils 6 miles from the Rangers has not hurt the Rangers, and that's adding a third team to an area that's not nearly the hotbed of hockey that Ontario is. Surely a second team in Ontario would receive better support than the Devils right from the start. If I was a Leaf fan, I'd be begging for a second team in Toronto to force my ownership to put a better product on the ice. Of course, the Leafs ownership isn't interested in that, when they can literally halfass the team and far exceed the revenue of every other team in the league.

Not sure why Hartford can't have it's team back too if cities like Portland are an option. Been talk about upgrading/replacing the arena in Hartford to get their team back.

Cap recapture is going to suck for the wings. I bet franzen and zetts will end up on the ltir their last two years.

Eomer_sl said:

I agree, he's simply doing what the owners have empowered him to do. But that aside, I think it's best that he move on. He is universally hated. Let Bill Daly run it for a few years, and then have Shanahan run the league. Better yet, have a former player like Stu Grimson or someone else (Parros?) run the NHLPA. Have former players in charge of both, and try to move past this ridiculous era of contentious bargaining.

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I find it mildly amusing that people think he controls as much as he does. He's a mouthpiece. If not Bettman, the owners would have found another sonofabitch to take the heat and the strike would have lasted just as long. Once the onwers decided they get screwed on the last agreement, nothing was going to prevent what just happened short of the players agreeing to bend over.

I don't think the owners were serious about ending the strike until now anyway. I think the same deal agreed to last week would have been rejected last October. What's not to like for the owners? Half a regular season's paychecks with intra-conference games to reduce travel expenses, and a whole playoffs where the owners make all the money.

The only way Bettman leaves, is if he wants to leave. The owners can't get rid of him now. Firing the guy who was the mouthpiece for your negotiations right after the deal is done makes you look weak. The owners don't want that. Not even sure what the point would be for the owners to fire him. The TV contract is good for another 9 years, the collective baragain agreement is good for at least 8 years. What's left for him to negotiate? Why fire him and pay off the last three years of his current contract and hire a replacement when there's nothing too major to do.

I said "move on", not fire. You'd think even Bettman could recognize that pretty much everyone is sick of his shit, and it would be better for everyone if he retired or resigned. It doesn't even have to be immediate, but when his contract runs out.

Leafs just fired Brian Burke. Pretty awkward timing but will result in some funny reporting.

As for the NHL expanding to Halifax, I live in Halifax and we average between 7000-9000 fans a game for our Junior team. The lowest average attendence in the NHL was 12,000 (Pheonix) and the league average was just under 18,000. Additionally we don't have a Rink to support an NHL franchise nor the sustained Corperate dollars that are required to sustain an NHL franchise. While Halifax is a hockey hotbed on the east coast, we are simply too small to justify an NHL team. We are probably looking at 2020 until we even approach the ability to just enter the conversation.

I would imagine about 95% of people who follow hockey are smiling about Burke's firing. What an arrogant fuckwad. The only thing he ever won, the Cup in Anaheim, was with a team built by his predecessor. He did an alright job building Vancouver before he left, but they'll likely not win the cup either.

Burke brought in Phaneuf, Kessel, JvR -- those are pretty good signings for a team that's coached like a sack of potatoes. I wouldn't say everything he did was bad.

Bane_sl said:

Burke brought in Phaneuf, Kessel, JvR -- those are pretty good signings for a team that's coached like a sack of potatoes. I wouldn't say everything he did was bad.

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Yeah, but mostly he's a loud mouthed cunt.

Araxen_sl said:

I dunno the Leafs might luck into hiring a good GM and make the Leafs a good team. Leafs fans are more annoying than Boston sports fans. I'd rather they have kept Burke and for him to keep fucking up!

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I'm a Leafs fan. They were closest to me growing up. I love the team, I hate the way it is currently run. Just changing the GM isn't going to turn them into a good team, that's for sure. I am certain that from day one of this season, the Leafs will be inconsequential, and won't make the playoffs. The owners and players don't care. They're making boatloads of money, and until that changes, don't hope for any significant reorganization in that franchise.

Wankers.

Eomer_sl said:

I said "move on", not fire. You'd think even Bettman could recognize that pretty much everyone is sick of his shit, and it would be better for everyone if he retired or resigned. It doesn't even have to be immediate, but when his contract runs out.

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Like I said, his contract doesn't run out until 2015. That's three more years at a salary of at least 7.2 million a year. I doubt he'll be around in 2018-2020 when the new CBA or TV contract comes up, but he's 60 years old and he's not walking away from 21 million dollars because he's a convieniet scapegoat for fans and players to vent their anger. It goes with the job and the owners aren't going to fire him and pay him and another person to be the commissioner when there's nothing major to do anyway, the subject is moot.

If jackass fans want to ruin the best moment in a hockey players life and overshadow the event by booing Bettman during the Stanley Cup ceremony, shame on them.

lurkingdirk_sl said:

I'm a Leafs fan. They were closest to me growing up. I love the team, I hate the way it is currently run. Just changing the GM isn't going to turn them into a good team, that's for sure. I am certain that from day one of this season, the Leafs will be inconsequential, and won't make the playoffs. The owners and players don't care. They're making boatloads of money, and until that changes, don't hope for any significant reorganization in that franchise.

Wankers.

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I love it when people say Rogers/Bell doesn't care if the Leafs make the playoffs cause they make so much money ayways. How much cash would they make from playoff games through concessions, tickets, tv, etc? If you guessed a holy fuckton you would be correct. Its not like they don't spend to the cap every year anyways. If they didn't care they would spend the bare minimum and do whatever, but when its probably the most popular team in all of hockey making money off playoff revenue is a no brainer.

For years tools have blamed everyone from owners, to players to fans of all people. Yes its the fans fault because they don;t boycott going to games (laugh). The fact of the matter is since the institution of a salary cap they have had one GM who was a complete moron who couldn't manage a paper bag (JFJ), and a GM who made a badly timed move, a couple a bad FA signings, a couple of meh moves and a couple of great moves. He never addressed goaltending from a stability standpoint (ie. Louongo, or whoever). One common theme from the 90's early 2000's teams were a ridiculous goaltender behind a suspect defense and a deadly group of forwards. If they add a premium goalie in some way they are a playoff team and can build on that.

Burke wasn't a bad GM he just wasn't the right GM for the time. You put him on a playoff team he can pull a trade or two that will put a team over the top and have the guts to do it (Pronger to ANA), but he is not a rebuilding GM.