Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Erronius

Macho Ma'am
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Random KS comment_sl said:
I honestly never understood why everyone swung on FoH's nuts anyways. Afterlife was a far better guild, and their members were actually decent people. FoH just threw 70+ people at every fight to accomplish anything.
I actually remember some front-page (not forum) posts that Alex made way back when, where he was complaining about whichever expansion it was that completely changed raid balancing to the point that they had to up and recruit a bunch of people because everyone was going to be forced to max out their raids. Maybe someone else can go into further detail because I can't remember further, was never in FOH and you can't open the front portion anymore.

Ironically enough, Req even has the front redirecting to Pantheon now it looks like - so not only can't you bring up the old guild specific updates separate from the forum like you used to be able to, the last vestiges of what was FOH now simply exists to plug Pantheon...

Not to mention how retarded the "FOH" hate is when only an infinitesimally small percentage of the current community was in FOH during EQ1 anyways (or really any MMO), so lobbing jabs at us using the FOH label does seem a bit out of touch.

Some people just can't handle strong differences of opinion. It's like they never go outside and witness real, actual people interacting. They just sit in vent with like minded people and agree all day. Sounds boring as shit to me.

I grew up on Long Island. If you act cordially and polite it's considered a sign of disrespect. Compliments actually mean something because nobody ever says anything nice. Rerolled is the internet's version of Long Island.
That's bullshit, go fuck yourself

Also which one of you fat fucks is this?
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Cakepops are a helluva drug
 

Arctic_Slicer_sl

shitlord
155
0
I've been wondering this too. I keep reading posts from people wanting warriors. I pretty much always play tanks bc I have anger issues and love to pound on shit. And I didn't "grow up" on EQ like a lot of people here. But I did play it and EQemu and I tried to play warrior. But gawd. it was boring. you hit "auto-attack" and go make a sandwich. Rotate between "kick", "taunt" ...and "sense heading" lol. SK was so much more interesting.
Someone explain the warrior love.
Warriors were probably the most streamlined class I have ever played in an MMPORG. It wasn't my first choice in EverQuest because it seemed so "simple". However after rolling one myself I quickly fell in love with the whole design. Auto-attack, ranged attack, bash, kick, taunt and a few discs is all a warrior needs. You don't need 50 different buttons to pull mobs and hold aggro when simply a bow and a good two-handed sword can do the job, respectively. There is also the thrill of being the "point-man" on raids that gets to be the one that stands toe-to-toe with 90% of raid bosses; while you have multiple clerics and other support classes focusing all of their efforts on just keeping you alive. The EverQuest warrior is one of the best examples of the "K.I.S.S." principle being applied to an MMORPG class and doing it well.
 

unegoono_sl

shitlord
6
0
unless something amazing happens no, its not going to come close to making it and will probably end in the $250-300k range
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. :: Kicktraq
That is simply trending not a prediction. Someone posted a KS somewhere between here, the KS and PJP that showed a KS that was doing worse then this and in the last few days jumped a crazy amount to get funded. You never know what will happen, they're working on to get everything on track and listening to our feed back so honestly that site means as much as flipping a coin to see if this will fail or not.
 

Quineloe

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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yes, but without knowing how the KS actually went, that's no information to work with. What if the KS guy got in an accident and was hospitalized for 3 weeks, then got out just in time to throw all the remaining info on the KS and people went batshit crazy over it?
 

Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
3,656
1,382
That is simply trending not a prediction. Someone posted a KS somewhere between here, the KS and PJP that showed a KS that was doing worse then this and in the last few days jumped a crazy amount to get funded. You never know what will happen, they're working on to get everything on track and listening to our feed back so honestly that site means as much as flipping a coin to see if this will fail or not.
It still has a shot but it's a pretty long shot. I think a vast majority of those who would be interested in this type of game have already seen the KS at this point and made up their mind. Yes those that pulled their pledges would put them back but that's not going to help them get to goal, they need new blood. Plus I think while there are a decent number of people who played EQ who want this and would fund it, I think a large majority of EQ players have moved on for a variety of reasons. I've been checking a number of guild/server websites and even if this KS is mentioned, it's in passing only. Most don't really care. I'm not seeing a whole lot of groundswell support from anyplace else except the KS backers page and here (and here has been 50/50). This isn't to say that I think they should give up. Go through the whole 40 days, if it doesn't get funded then pool all your stuff together, get someone who know how to do a proper KS campaign and come back in a few months.

It's also obvious at this point that he's going to need more investor money just to hit stretch goals than he probably wanted, which means someone other than the fans are going to have a hand on how this game is developed. I think it also matters how much it falls short if it doesn't get funded. If it can't reach even 400k, that's going to be a hard sell to any investor.
 

unegoono_sl

shitlord
6
0
yes, but without knowing how the KS actually went, that's no information to work with. What if the KS guy got in an accident and was hospitalized for 3 weeks, then got out just in time to throw all the remaining info on the KS and people went batshit crazy over it?
This is a valid point, but Brad might just throw something up and people go bat shit crazy over it. Can't rule anything out yet, a lot can happen in 29 days.

This is all valid too. Right now Brad is really reaching out to the PJP forums for help and a lot of the concerns here have been mirrored over there. We can only hope now that he actually cares and listens to them and improves everything. He still has ways to reach out to a bigger audience, but first he needs to get everything polished.
 

Miele

Lord Nagafen Raider
916
48
Oh trust me I'm just joking. I don't care who's who or what's what.

You should have seen the Millie stuff. It was a spectacle to behold.
This thread moves at the speed of light, so I'm late when replying to this (also I'm on a different timezone, so suck it up). I received a fucking dozen -internets when they were still around during the last months of FoH just because my forum name looked or sounded like Millie. Fuck that wrecked spectacle of a human being for ruining my oh-so-important internet fame and glory meter.
 

Bruman

Golden Squire
1,154
0
Welp, now we begin the long ass wait. The next 27-28 days are going to be boring. Pledges are only going to come in at a trickle, with maybe a little bump here and there when/if they get any more articles published on big gaming sites.

Then we'll finally be at the last 2 days, where many projects actually reach funding with big pledges. My 8-Ball says we'll be at $300k or so going into those last two days.
 

Tide27_sl

shitlord
124
0
It still has a shot but it's a pretty long shot. I think a vast majority of those who would be interested in this type of game have already seen the KS at this point and made up their mind. Yes those that pulled their pledges would put them back but that's not going to help them get to goal, they need new blood. Plus I think while there are a decent number of people who played EQ who want this and would fund it, I think a large majority of EQ players have moved on for a variety of reasons. I've been checking a number of guild/server websites and even if this KS is mentioned, it's in passing only. Most don't really care. I'm not seeing a whole lot of groundswell support from anyplace else except the KS backers page and here (and here has been 50/50). This isn't to say that I think they should give up. Go through the whole 40 days, if it doesn't get funded then pool all your stuff together, get someone who know how to do a proper KS campaign and come back in a few months.
It's also obvious at this point that he's going to need more investor money just to hit stretch goals than he probably wanted, which means someone other than the fans are going to have a hand on how this game is developed. I think it also matters how much it falls short if it doesn't get funded. If it can't reach even 400k, that's going to be a hard sell to any investor.
The reason there is a lack of interest is because most people do not want to play a game like the old EQ community remembers. I keep hearing some key points tossed around and everytime a game releases that has some of the keypoints mentioned, everyone is up in arms and mad as hell. Examples...


1) People want some form of long travel to get to out of the way dungeons.

Look at every mmo released since WoW had their dungeon finder implemented and tell me how much screaming and crying went on when the newer MMOs did not copy that. Swtor didn't have a dungeon finder at launch and you could manually make groups and run to the instance, but no one liked it. People bitched, moaned, and complained until a dungeon finder went in. The VERY same people in this thread were crying about a "lack" of dungeon finder, yet they want a game with no dungeon finder??

2) No AH system.

Look at the recent FF14 threads...the Swtor threads...the Guild Wars 2 threads...and you will find a common occurrence of where their AH system did not work properly at release. It didn't stop people from manually trading, but no one could be bothered to do that. They just hoarded their goods until the AH was working and keep bitching about the AH not working.

3) Very hard and long dungeons

Very few people like long and hard dungeons anymore. People will find the fastest dungeon to grind for the fastest experience possible. Other games have proved that as well. Look at the people complaining in the NWN forums. They had some pretty decent dungeons there, but most of the population went to do the player created dungeon with the 40 ogres in a box that couldn't attack to level up to cap within a day or so depending on your playtime. Same exact scenario in every game. Whatever is the path of least resistance and the quickest mode to level to cap is what will be used. Long and hard dungeons don't get used, but the quick, fast , AE snorefest dungeons that can be repeated and reset every few minutes gets abused.

4) Some form of some super long leveling grind

Every game that has come up with a long leveling grind has become automated. Look at Aion. When that game released here once you hit the level 30s or so, the experience grind was brutal. So instead of playing the game, everyone downloaded MacroGoblin or some other form of automated bot and went to the zone that only had PvE enabled and they would set up their paths to grind for days / weeks at a time.

The majority of the original people from the FOH / Uber guilds back in yesteryear did everything possible to exploit every system available to them to cheese any and all content to give them a leg up on the competition. I know, I raided with them for years. Content the could be exploitable was, crafting that was exploitable or automatable was, program injectors that could be used and not detected were used.

Basically anything people could find to use to bypass the systems that people swear they want to see again here were used.

It's also obvious at this point that he's going to need more investor money just to hit stretch goals than he probably wanted, which means someone other than the fans are going to have a hand on how this game is developed. I think it also matters how much it falls short if it doesn't get funded. If it can't reach even 400k, that's going to be a hard sell to any investor.[/QUOTE]
 
437
0
The reason there is a lack of interest is because most people do not want to play a game like the old EQ community remembers. I keep hearing some key points tossed around and everytime a game releases that has some of the keypoints mentioned, everyone is up in arms and mad as hell. Examples...
This is no a mass market game. It is a focused design that will pull in a loyal and dedicated fanbase that won't drop the game when the next new shiny thing comes out. It is an entirely different business model, and one I am personally happy to see being embraced by people like Brad.
 

unegoono_sl

shitlord
6
0
The reason there is a lack of interest is because most people do not want to play a game like the old EQ community remembers. I keep hearing some key points tossed around and everytime a game releases that has some of the keypoints mentioned, everyone is up in arms and mad as hell. Examples...


1) People want some form of long travel to get to out of the way dungeons.

Look at every mmo released since WoW had their dungeon finder implemented and tell me how much screaming and crying went on when the newer MMOs did not copy that. Swtor didn't have a dungeon finder at launch and you could manually make groups and run to the instance, but no one liked it. People bitched, moaned, and complained until a dungeon finder went in. The VERY same people in this thread were crying about a "lack" of dungeon finder, yet they want a game with no dungeon finder??

2) No AH system.

Look at the recent FF14 threads...the Swtor threads...the Guild Wars 2 threads...and you will find a common occurrence of where their AH system did not work properly at release. It didn't stop people from manually trading, but no one could be bothered to do that. They just hoarded their goods until the AH was working and keep bitching about the AH not working.

3) Very hard and long dungeons

Very few people like long and hard dungeons anymore. People will find the fastest dungeon to grind for the fastest experience possible. Other games have proved that as well. Look at the people complaining in the NWN forums. They had some pretty decent dungeons there, but most of the population went to do the player created dungeon with the 40 ogres in a box that couldn't attack to level up to cap within a day or so depending on your playtime. Same exact scenario in every game. Whatever is the path of least resistance and the quickest mode to level to cap is what will be used. Long and hard dungeons don't get used, but the quick, fast , AE snorefest dungeons that can be repeated and reset every few minutes gets abused.

4) Some form of some super long leveling grind

Every game that has come up with a long leveling grind has become automated. Look at Aion. When that game released here once you hit the level 30s or so, the experience grind was brutal. So instead of playing the game, everyone downloaded MacroGoblin or some other form of automated bot and went to the zone that only had PvE enabled and they would set up their paths to grind for days / weeks at a time.

The majority of the original people from the FOH / Uber guilds back in yesteryear did everything possible to exploit every system available to them to cheese any and all content to give them a leg up on the competition. I know, I raided with them for years. Content the could be exploitable was, crafting that was exploitable or automatable was, program injectors that could be used and not detected were used.

Basically anything people could find to use to bypass the systems that people swear they want to see again here were used.

It's also obvious at this point that he's going to need more investor money just to hit stretch goals than he probably wanted, which means someone other than the fans are going to have a hand on how this game is developed. I think it also matters how much it falls short if it doesn't get funded. If it can't reach even 400k, that's going to be a hard sell to any investor.
[/QUOTE]



Niche is niche. If they don't like it move on. Brads also addressed a lot of these concerns in his Q&A's. People didn't like demon souls when it came out, now look at dark souls 2 and its suppose to be the hardest yet and people are hyped out their assholes. Fact is niche games are becoming a trend whether or not you like it, that's just the best example there are tons more, like super meat boy and the binding of issac. Not to mention the fact that EQ is still a highly populated game to date with new people joining daily and expansions still being produced, along side hundreds of EMU servers and project 1999 is becoming hugely popular. Again I could go on, but I rest my case. No one here is a psychic, the only thing that will tell us if this is going to flop is once it ends. Anything else is speculation, sorry to burst your bubbles.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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Sorry, did you want a bunch of buttons to push? Perhaps a button that does some damage while also knocking the mob back 2 inches, then another button that slows it 1%? Along with another 42 buttons each on a 2 minute timer?

The warrior in EQ was one of the best classes in any MMO ever for precisely the reasons you misunderstand. And the complaints you voice are exactly what have ruined modern MMOs.

Being a warrior freed you from the stupidity of whack a mole to actuallyplay the fucking game. Only warriors (and some enlightened monks) actually played EQ; everyone else pressed buttons. We were free to learn how the world worked. Warriors were free to learn how to gain or lose the attention of a mob, how to time pulls, how pathing worked, where mob spawned and the quirks of their behavior.

Meanwhile every other class (except again monks) got to sit on your ass in a corner and play the super exciting game of press the button when it popped up.
As someone who played the whole range of classes from Warrior to Bard I have to say you're pretty misguided.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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The only thing that playing a warrior allowed me to do that most other classes couldn't was read Dragonlance novels.
 

Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
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Niche is niche. If they don't like it move on. Brads also addressed a lot of these concerns in his Q&A's. People didn't like demon souls when it came out, now look at dark souls 2 and its suppose to be the hardest yet and people are hyped out their assholes. Fact is niche games are becoming a trend whether or not you like it, that's just the best example there are tons more, like super meat boy and the binding of issac. Not to mention the fact that EQ is still a highly populated game to date with new people joining daily and expansions still being produced, along side hundreds of EMU servers and project 1999 is becoming hugely popular. Again I could go on, but I rest my case. No one here is a psychic, the only thing that will tell us if this is going to flop is once it ends. Anything else is speculation, sorry to burst your bubbles.
Let's be fair though, although P99 has a decent amount of players, that's not enough to make a full scale MMO profitable. I also think the crowd that plays EQ today is not the same type of player that played in 1999. Even then, that game is not profitable enough to be a sub game, it's FTP. These comparisons to Dark Souls and other single player games is ridiculous. Yea, people like a challenge but they like a challenge and they put the game down. Can't do that in an MMO, you need a consistent sub base. Another thing that needs to be considering and that's community. The reason why community was strong in EQ is because people played and stayed playing, even if they weren't in a top guild. The biggest thing that community did on a server was not only social interaction, but reputation. Start ripping people off in EC tunnel, the whole server will know who you are.

There's a strong argument to be made is the reason players stayed with EQ is because of lack of options. It's a different landscape now, there are tons of other options. Can you guarantee that a server community can stay intact for 6 months? A year? Most games now can't manage that. In some ways it sounds like you want a game that so small and so niche like a better version of Mortal Online. I was at least hoping for something a little bigger than that.