Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Caeden

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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I spent all of two months in EQ; I'm not the target audience by any means. I don't care one way or the other; I just find trainwrecks and blind faith fascinating subjects. I imagine TESO is next on the block. I mean, I have no leg to stand on as I'm currently subbed to SWTOR right now.
 

bayr_sl

shitlord
715
0
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
It's difficult to find it within myself to lament what never was when a group of chucklefucks can't manage a kickstarter or give reasonable or any answers to questions by prospective doners and have to redact every single update they do because their ideas are so bad
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,761
613
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
I would say some people obviously don't want this to succeed but Brad didn't help his case. The majority are poking at the effort. It's frustrating for me because I am a supporter, but to see a KS launch that isn't on par with what other successful KS have done gives people plenty of ammo. Regardless of how much they are making up on the go, Pantheon is a game I'd love to see made and play. I've followed it enough to know if the game is made properly, it would be tops on my list to try out. I do think Brad and team are capable of making the game, but like I said.. they gave the doubters plenty of ammo. I'm also frustrated with the lack of involvement with some of the team. I don't know what their excuses are, but I'm not seeing them post anywhere, and I'm certainly not seeing any possible work they may of done. Again, it opens the team up to questions.. Is everyone as committed as Brad, Ben, Tony, Wu and Sal? I've seen a few other guys post, and maybe it's not their thing but some guys have been completely absent. I can't help but want to call out the artist.. Basically no concept art, or posting.. He could have a very legit reason but it doesn't change how it's lingered in my mind.. Especially when I've put my own time into spreading the word..It goes back to not fully understanding what it will take to launch a successful Kickstarter.
 

Dahkoht_sl

shitlord
1,658
0
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
I'll be honest , Convo is a much nicer version of how I feel atm.

I want this game , correction this type of game , pledged a decent amount , and in the first couple weeks put in some time to spread the word and also give Brad suggestions.

I'm pissed at the lack of cohesion and effort that went into this KS ,and the line about "videos take a long time to make correctly" they've used as an example, has me going, WTF , that intro video was horrible originally and looks like it took 10 mins to make. Currently it looks like they have given up , after a few bursts of effort here and there.

The bitter side of me now wants to mock certain tools who have said "This Will Fund" and continue to say it shouting down anyone who thinks it is in trouble , and don't seem to have a grasp on reality.

In the end I much rather have Pantheon. Very much so. But the hilarity of the delusional on the KS thread is my most likely only amusement to come out of this ordeal.

I don't want it to fail , but I don't have any problem with pointing out that if it doesn't fund then the blame needs to go squarely on how shitty of a job they have done on the KS ,and not as a measuring stick of are there 50-100k people who would buy a retail Pantheon type game and sub to it ,as I feel confident there are.

(side note , my one serious concern now is that if they cannot run the KS well enough , it is a genuine concern to think that maybe lessons were not learned in Vanguard development that should have been. I'm not talking about drug/personal issues as I'm not going there , I'm purely talking about you should know to put on your absolute best face and effort for a KS/public show, even without the Vanguard baggage. With it , even more so. It doesn't take an MBA to see the organization and decision making is bad , very bad , and even as a huge fan of the idea of an EQ/VG style game , I am not blind to the fact that Brad and Co is inspiring zero confidence in the ability to make this thing).
 

Furious

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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LOL. K.

Wanted to make sure I got it quoted before you changed it. I guarantee that the average income/education of this board is higher than the national average by a significant margin.
Ya, I was wtf at that post. I'm under the assumption there are a lot of well to do people on this board that just like MMO's.
 

Dahkoht_sl

shitlord
1,658
0
Ya, I was wtf at that post. I'm under the assumption there are a lot of well to do people on this board that just like MMO's.
I agree with this. BTW my original post talking about this was in no way implying it was the norm , I mean to point out the spectacle of a certain group on the KS forums who have admitted that they are tapped out till the next months paycheck, and than for this type throwing another 200 bucks is something that they should step back and think about what they are doing.

I never meant to imply we are all paupers here.

(although my wife and two kids seem to help keep me feeling like I am :p )
 

Kirun

Buzzfeed Editor
<Gold Donor>
18,783
35,027
EQ today is nothing like it was. FFXI is dead in the water. It's not that the era is effectively over,it is over!It's been over for a long time now, it's just that some people (you) refuse to accept that.
So much this. As somebody made the analogy earlier, think about the games you played 15 years prior to EQ. Did you harken back to those days of yesteryear and wish they were making Gauntlet, done right?! The industry has moved on, just like any other. The sooner people accept that, the sooner we can start trying to innovate and revolutionize the current generation.
 

Convo

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Ben posted this on PJP

Truth of the matter is there was a lot we could have done differently with the Kickstarter. As mentioned in interviews and elsewhere, none of us had any Kickstarter experience prior to the launch. We had done homework, but there are many things we would do differently should we have launched it today. There's still a little under two weeks to go and we're still intending on pushing all the way through.
I think one of the biggest things this Kickstarter has shown is that there is a good, strong community for this type of game. Not only that but there's such a big desire to see this game come about, not just from the pledgers and the community here, but everywhere. We've received so many emails and phone calls from so many people all over the world offering to help out in any way they can. The offers have ranged from making simple suggestions for the game all the way up to offers of expensive services and licensing at deep discounts or in some cases, free. The Internet wants to see this game happen. Networks, too, have graciously offered us a ton of coverage to get the word out. It's really been amazing.
So, if the Kickstarter doesn't meet its goal - that's on us. We take responsibility for that. But I can guarantee you it's not going to stop this game from being made. We're already starting work on some other options to make things happen. This stuff takes time and is privacy-controlled for now, for obvious reasons, but we're not stopping, whether the Kickstarter reaches $400k or $40 million -- lots more of Pantheon coming up.
Ben de la Durantaye
Director of Communications, Visionary Realms, Inc.
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. Kickstarter
@PantheonRotF
 

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
So much this. As somebody made the analogy earlier, think about the games you played 15 years prior to EQ. Did you harken back to those days of yesteryear and wish they were making Gauntlet, done right?! The industry has moved on, just like any other. The sooner people accept that, the sooner we can start trying to innovate and revolutionize the current generation.
Actually I still play Janes Longbow 2, C&C Red Alert, and Civ....well shit, the entire series. I also have my own EQEMU on my home computer I play often, although with school back in session not as much as I want to. There is an audience for the game. The industry is packed with garbage games all trying to get a piece of the Blizzard crowd. I wouldn't call that "moving on". This is why everyone is referring to Pantheon as a niche game. Its not intended to "revolutionize the current generation". Go play EQN. They are attempting to.
 

pharmakos

soʞɐɯɹɐɥd
<Bronze Donator>
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if this $800k kickstarter doesn't fund, i feel like their second kickstarter is going to ask for $400k and hit $1million

just because people are weird
 

Dahkoht_sl

shitlord
1,658
0
So much this. As somebody made the analogy earlier, think about the games you played 15 years prior to EQ. Did you harken back to those days of yesteryear and wish they were making Gauntlet, done right?! The industry has moved on, just like any other. The sooner people accept that, the sooner we can start trying to innovate and revolutionize the current generation.
Yeah, actually I really enjoy some of the gauntlet style games remade with better graphics I've grabbed on steam.
 

Furious

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Ben posted this on PJP

Truth of the matter is there was a lot we could have done differently with the Kickstarter. As mentioned in interviews and elsewhere, none of us had any Kickstarter experience prior to the launch. We had done homework, but there are many things we would do differently should we have launched it today. There's still a little under two weeks to go and we're still intending on pushing all the way through.
I think one of the biggest things this Kickstarter has shown is that there is a good, strong community for this type of game. Not only that but there's such a big desire to see this game come about, not just from the pledgers and the community here, but everywhere. We've received so many emails and phone calls from so many people all over the world offering to help out in any way they can. The offers have ranged from making simple suggestions for the game all the way up to offers of expensive services and licensing at deep discounts or in some cases, free. The Internet wants to see this game happen. Networks, too, have graciously offered us a ton of coverage to get the word out. It's really been amazing.
So, if the Kickstarter doesn't meet its goal - that's on us. We take responsibility for that. But I can guarantee you it's not going to stop this game from being made. We're already starting work on some other options to make things happen. This stuff takes time and is privacy-controlled for now, for obvious reasons, but we're not stopping, whether the Kickstarter reaches $400k or $40 million -- lots more of Pantheon coming up.
Ben de la Durantaye
Director of Communications, Visionary Realms, Inc.
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. Kickstarter
@PantheonRotF
I do agree that there is a lot of intrest in this type of game. They know they Fubared the KS from the get go. IMO it is the primary reason for failure. People go there and turn away pretty fast.
 

Dahkoht_sl

shitlord
1,658
0
Ben posted this on PJP

Truth of the matter is there was a lot we could have done differently with the Kickstarter. As mentioned in interviews and elsewhere, none of us had any Kickstarter experience prior to the launch. We had done homework, but there are many things we would do differently should we have launched it today. There's still a little under two weeks to go and we're still intending on pushing all the way through.
I think one of the biggest things this Kickstarter has shown is that there is a good, strong community for this type of game. Not only that but there's such a big desire to see this game come about, not just from the pledgers and the community here, but everywhere. We've received so many emails and phone calls from so many people all over the world offering to help out in any way they can. The offers have ranged from making simple suggestions for the game all the way up to offers of expensive services and licensing at deep discounts or in some cases, free. The Internet wants to see this game happen. Networks, too, have graciously offered us a ton of coverage to get the word out. It's really been amazing.
So, if the Kickstarter doesn't meet its goal - that's on us. We take responsibility for that. But I can guarantee you it's not going to stop this game from being made. We're already starting work on some other options to make things happen. This stuff takes time and is privacy-controlled for now, for obvious reasons, but we're not stopping, whether the Kickstarter reaches $400k or $40 million -- lots more of Pantheon coming up.
Ben de la Durantaye
Director of Communications, Visionary Realms, Inc.
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. Kickstarter
@PantheonRotF
Just because you know I have to nit-pick and be negative nancy too :p , I'll quote the one statement out of that that makes me either want to roll my eyes or scream , really ?

"none of us had any Kickstarter experience prior to the launch.We had done homework"

I think I could take my wife who knows zero about gaming but used to be in corporate sales before our 2nd kid , get her to spend a week researching Kickstarters and their history for games specifically , and she would have come up with a better structure and plan for the actual site and layout than they did.

If they did their homework and still produced it as is or are lying about doing their homework , I'm not sure which is worse.
 

Furious

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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So much this. As somebody made the analogy earlier, think about the games you played 15 years prior to EQ. Did you harken back to those days of yesteryear and wish they were making Gauntlet, done right?! The industry has moved on, just like any other. The sooner people accept that, the sooner we can start trying to innovate and revolutionize the current generation.
Yes, many people want older games with updated graphics. Like Zelda ect. I would Love a ff7, remake. Keeping it the exact same except for new graphics.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,761
613
Yes, many people want older games with updated graphics. Like Zelda ect. I would Love a ff7, remake. Keeping it the exact same except for new graphics.
There's other evidence too - like the amount of networks picking up the story, and the quality of those networks. As mentioned, I've done plenty of PR and some of the sites covering this news won't cover just anything. In fact some of them won't even do Kickstarters but have made an exception for this project.

There's also the amount of people who have watched the video. Unfortunately Kickstarter doesn't give us any metrics on the amount of people who have actually come to the KS and there's no way to put in a Google analytics script, but we do see how many people who have watched the video. And that number is much, much greater than the amount of pledgers (also an indication that we may have missed the mark a bit with the initial vid, but not a lack of interest).

And then there's the email... gosh, the email... it's... insane. Brad has several mailboxes set up for different filtering and they're all just jam packed.

The interest is there - now we've got to provide something that is enough to change that interest into investment. For most, this will happen at game launch, but for some, we're still looking at ways to give you all something special for being early backers of the project.
Ben de la Durantaye
Director of Communications, Visionary Realms, Inc.
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. Kickstarter
@PantheonRotF
 

Dahkoht_sl

shitlord
1,658
0
One thing I don't know about KS is are you allowed to pull it down before it ends ?

If so , I lean towards thinking it would be better to see them come out and say (short version) , "Hey we have learned some things ,need to do this right ,and will be back in a couple months" and not let it limp along and fail at the end. Yank it now. Do the private funding if you want on your own site then a better kickstarter later on , whatever ,but why just let it go along the last 10 days basically ignoring it ( a few paragraphs every few days isn't cutting it )? Seems to me better in long run to yank it now , let the die hards paypal you some money on your own site , then try again with a better KS.

I know it comes out the same moneywise , just PR wise a taken down KS that they say they will redo later in a better manner (then prove it ) will come across better than a "failed" KS.
 

Merlin_sl

shitlord
2,329
1
One thing I don't know about KS is are you allowed to pull it down before it ends ?

If so , I lean towards thinking it would be better to see them come out and say (short version) , "Hey we have learned some things ,need to do this right ,and will be back in a couple months" and not let it limp along and fail at the end. Yank it now. Do the private funding if you want on your own site then a better kickstarter later on , whatever ,but why just let it go along the last 10 days basically ignoring it ( a few paragraphs every few days isn't cutting it )? Seems to me better in long run to yank it now , let the die hards paypal you some money on your own site , then try again with a better KS.

I know it comes out the same moneywise , just PR wise a taken down KS that they say they will redo later in a better manner (then prove it ) will come across better than a "failed" KS.
. There's still a little under two weeks to go and we're still intending on pushing all the way through.
OF course not. Why correct a mistake? Just make more!