Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

gogojira_sl

shitlord
2,202
3
I think what's clear to everyone is that this team is not fit for Kickstarter. They don't get it and while they put a lot of work into patchworking a better Kickstarter page, the end result is a Frankenstein of a home page. The boogie interview was a great idea and it went well, but what happens when people go to the page? 99 percent of them won't pledge. Updates seem to be flung up without a lot of looking over or proofing and simple shit like the shaman stuff gets posted and stuck. And honestly, nobody on Kickstarter cares about your halflings because everybody sees it as a stretch goal that willneverhappen. It's the equivalent of raving about your sick ass PVP at this point.

The tiers don't make much sense and in the past, I don't have to read a map with 1,500 intersections to find out which one fits me. And here's one of the biggest things that will push people away: the Kickstarter pledges say you get Pantheon, life time subs and all this other in-game shit, but Visionary Realms openly says $800,000 won't fund the MMO. Maybe I'm being naive here because I don't think it's anything malicious, but I think VR is rolling the dice and assumes that once they get the $800,000 they can get further financial support to make good on all those promises. That's all hopes and dreams though and essentially there are a list of rewards that, according to the words of the Pantheon creators, cannot be fulfilled without additional funding.

This should have went the Pathfinder route because that's what Pantheon is actually trying to do. There's essentially nothing right now but bought Unity assets, some ideas and a couple pieces of concept art. The language should have been "we need help to create a demo to pitch to publishers, please give us $400,000 and we'll reward you with some physical items, a neckbeard brush and a small demo or some shit." Now you're asking for less money and your tiers don't contradict your words.

This whole thing is a pity. All the Kickstarter research you can possibly peruse is there, even for the long-ended successful campaigns you should be emulating.
 

Cinge

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
7,055
2,118
Also clear do you want people that cant seem to run a KS, running a MMO you are paying to build(literally). Ideas are great and all, but holy god is execution missing.
 

Tide27_sl

shitlord
124
0
Genuinely, it's a little disconcerting to see a few of the constant posters on the KS remark that they are tapped out all the way on the tier they can be in , but they are planning on upping by a hundred or two the next month on the private website. By the way the payment system works ,that literally means they either are using their already max'd credit card and have to wait for a paycheck to pay it down to put some more to it , or they have no CC and are using their debit card and same way are awaiting a paycheck to donate more the next month.

God knows I've made my mistakes with money over the years and took a while to learn to manage it right , but I have a feeling there are some folks throwing a few hundred at it that are to the dime on rent each month as it is.

I've got zero problems with folks paying for betas and buying points in a cash shop all they want , I spend my money on stupid shit I like all the time , but it's discretionary money meant to do that.
This is because this is the type of game they can win at. Bunch of posters here have no careers , no family, and nothing in life to look forward to other than a minimum wage job and just able to get by. This type of game is very appealing to this subset of society because they can spend every second possible in game and at the end of the day in all MMOs, Time > Skill. This is probably their last great hope to have an MMO where they can feel significant again in the relative near future.
 

Oloh_sl

shitlord
298
0
This is because this is the type of game they can win at. Bunch of posters here have no careers , no family, and nothing in life to look forward to other than a minimum wage job and just able to get by. This type of game is very appealing to this subset of society because they can spend every second possible in game and at the end of the day in all MMOs, Time > Skill. This is probably their last great hope to have an MMO where they can feel significant again in the relative near future.
LOL. K.

Wanted to make sure I got it quoted before you changed it. I guarantee that the average income/education of this board is higher than the national average by a significant margin.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,761
613
LOL. K.

Wanted to make sure I got it quoted before you changed it. I guarantee that the average income/education of this board is higher than the national average by a significant margin.
What's funnier is the avg pledge is $132..
 

Tide27_sl

shitlord
124
0
LOL. K.

Wanted to make sure I got it quoted before you changed it. I guarantee that the average income/education of this board is higher than the national average by a significant margin.
Why would I want to change it? Ive played in the high end "uber" guilds from here in various MMOs over the course of the past 12+ years and know full damn well most of them are full of shit when it comes to average income / education. Internet is a great place since you can have any career and any income level to suit whatever argument that needs to be justified or defended.
 

Convo

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
8,761
613
Why would I want to change it? Ive played in the high end "uber" guilds from here in various MMOs over the course of the past 12+ years and know full damn well most of them are full of shit when it comes to average income / education. Internet is a great place since you can have any career and any income level to suit whatever argument that needs to be justified or defended.
The KS has a very high pledge avg.. We already established that.. Call the people dumb, suckers, whatever but money doesn't appear to be an issue for the backers...
 

PhoneticHalo_sl

shitlord
153
0
What is EQClassic?

EQClassic is a development project focused on creating an accurate server-side representation of the best MMORPG ever created.

How can I play?

EQClassic is still in development, so there is nothing to play--at least, not at this time.

How can I become a tester?

Although testing has not yet begun, invitations (auditor passes) are periodically awarded during special events.

How can I donate money to the project?

We do not accept donations, nor shall we ever. One should think twice before giving their hard-earned money away to other projects; professionals do not solicit handouts.
 

iannis

Musty Nester
31,351
17,656
I don't think you're having people who work 60+ hours a week clamoring to throw money at a game that, by "the vision", requires a 30+ hour a week time investment. There are stretches during the year where I won't play certain types of computer games because work is just too demanding. And then there are stretches where I can splorg out on them.

You can self righteously mock Tide if you like, and god knows i'll never stand in the way of a good self righteous mockery, but you can't wish away math. But yes, I'm sure everyone in silky venom is a Phd (at least) and gauges their earnings per quarter rather than per week.

To people that actually have to work for a living, Brads conjob could not be more obvious.
 

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,383
276
a game that, by "the vision", requires a 30+ hour a week time investment.
I think the disconnect lies in this quoted assumption. I dont expect to be able or willing to throw 30+ hours per week at a modernized EQ. With your own statement about your workload, would you expect game design to account for that and keep you caught up to the lets say second-best tier like WoW does? If you answer yes then there's a simple difference in expectation between us, because I hate it when games do that.

I really only want two things from an MMO. One is a focus on immersion and world-building but lets ignore that. The other is relevant to your statement: I know and accept that I cant play that much, but the way current gen MMOs equalize everyone systematically is not for me. I wont have the best gear, but I also dont want it handed to me for basically free just because there's a new patch and I have to be caught up to the status quo (since I didnt get there fast enough without handouts). I'd rather scrub my way through BoT while the tier 1 raiders do PoTime then be handed access to the elemental planes based on some chart that claims that I'm behind the curve.
 

iannis

Musty Nester
31,351
17,656
Nah, I don't expect games to cater to me in that way. I'd rather that they don't try to pander and just make a game worth playing. Not because of something I have in my head about aesthetic purity but just because none of them can seem to do it very well. Youdohave to take the bad with the good, and in trying to eliminate the bad it would seem that the good is equally effected. It would seem to me that this being demonstrably the case the better plan would be to accentuate the positive and accept that the inherent negative will limit your appeal. To build both a game AND a world -- yes, this is a fourth thing which is good in life, Conan. I doubt I disagree with you much on that. If I can't play it because I'm old... well, sucks to be old.

But I actually didn't mean to go down that road.

I just saw the "we're all rich doctors/lawyers/business owners so lol @ you. Poors and dumbs" and reflexively had to call bullshit. I couldn't help myself. I knew those kinds of neckbeards in EQ and made it a personal mission to keep them out of my guild. I knew those kinds of neckbeards during my brief stint in vanguard and was depressed that I recognized so many of them. If not by name then by archetype. It's such an obvious, shallow, and false appeal to authority.
 

Mr Creed

Too old for this shit
2,383
276
Fair enough on calling people out.

And yea that's the game I want, but I no longer have faith in this project being it even if they had the funds, because of the missing preparation, organization and enthusiasm.
 

Caeden

Silver Baronet of the Realm
7,400
12,030
Watching this and Curt's game crash and burn has been "tragically interesting." On the plus side, maybe fate won't give Brad cancer like it chose for Curt. Salt in the wound.
 
302
22
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
 

Soygen

The Dirty Dozen For the Price of One
<Nazi Janitors>
28,329
43,180
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
Or maybe a far more professional proposal will be submitted via Kickstarter in the future and it will do much better? This isn't the "death" of anything. There are tons of genres being revived via Kickstarter. This just might not be the one to do it.
 

Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
3,656
1,382
Is it just me or does it feel like people here are more happy that this kickstarter is failing than upset that we won't finally be getting a true successor to Everquest. Honestly, EQ and FFXI are the only MMORPGs still in production that are non-twitchy true diku-mud MMORPGs. When they go away, that's it. The era will effectively be over, and that makes me a sad panda.
EQ today is nothing like it was. FFXI is dead in the water. It's not that the era is effectively over,it is over!It's been over for a long time now, it's just that some people (you) refuse to accept that. But beyond all that, I think you are misinterpreting criticism for 'happy it's failing'. Most of us, even the critical ones would love to see this type of game being made. Not because we want to live in 1999 again (because that's impossible, another thing that some cannot accept). Because we'd like to see what that type of game a) looks like in this new era of MMORPGS b) how much interest will such a game generate in the current MMO landscape and c) to play something that's actually different than what's being put out now. When you say 'finally getting a true successor to Everquest', that's about as much bullshit as anything. Why, because Brad told you so? Show me something that shows that this is going to be the 'true successor to Everquest'. The criticism is because there is no confidence in this team. I'd love to see an EQ type game again, I don't think this team has a chance in hell in making it, one because I don't think they'll get enough money to do it and two, their kickstarter presentation doesn't give me hope that they can manage a MMO since they can't even manage a KS properly.

One thing that hasn't been brought up that I think is also affecting those on the fence is the pay model. Believe what you want, but there is a reason why games are going F2P. A lot of players would rather games be F2P than a subcription, especially since with a subscription I think there is a certain expectancy as to the type of content updates that should be produced. Who here believe that a small little MMO targeted at a niche audience is going to be sustainable with a subscription model?
 

iannis

Musty Nester
31,351
17,656
Even if the kickstarter succeeded you wouldn't be getting that. He's buying office space, dude. Office space. We're not gleeful over the fact that there will be less diversity in games. This kickstarter really has nothing to do with that. Succeed or fail, the impact of this to diversity in the genre is irrelevant.

But we are happier than a pig in shit that Brad's tired old conjob isn't working this time.

It's failing for the right reasons. If he'd put together a respectable, credible effort and it was still failing that would be different.

And if my aunt had a pair she'd be my uncle.