Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Mr Creed_sl said:

You make sense mostly but I think you need to rethink this.

I agree with Convo that interest is there (for a niche 50k-100k subs game, not millions), but people were reached. Would love to hear how many views the KS got. The team just failed to deliver a professional presentation, and only 1 in 1000 interested people was willing to overlook the gross incompetence and lack of any common sense or in the latter parts decency of the people on this project. VR are the reason this fails. I want this game, but not from these people. Action speaks louder then worlds and their actions throughout this month have made it clear they dont have the abilities needed, and thats coming from someone that didnt play VG and went into this entirely neutral to positive.

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Yea, it wasn't an issue of reaching people. It was a bunch of different reasons that mostly can be overcome by a solid game.

Mr Creed_sl said:

I agree with Convo that interest is there (for a niche 50k-100k subs game, not millions), but people were reached.

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The interest for this style of game is like 10k people, tops. If you haven't played Darkfall: Unholy Wars yet, I suggest you go do so.

popsicledeath_sl said:

The problem is there was little word of mouth outside the early dedicated people, because people like me started feeling pretty uncomfortable calling up old pals saying "hey, yeah, Brad is making another mmo

The word was out. It just wasn't spreading. And honestly for good reason.

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This. After day 3 I was far too embarrassed of their kickstarter to let any old guild mates know about this.

I'm glad I held back.

If their kickstarter was bad then their paid website is atrocious.

I will spread the word when the team does some actual work on the game.

Hell, they have a team of ten and 6 months behind them. I honestly think that a single person working alone could have produced more in that 6 months. I believe I could have with my noobish tinkering in unreal. I could have even put together some sort of soundtrack with komplete 9 ultimate in a weekend.

They do, at this point, seem like complete frauds. It hurts me to say that though.

Sabbat_sl said:

The interest for this style of game is like 10k people, tops. If you haven't played Darkfall: Unholy Wars yet, I suggest you go do so.

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That's a really weird comparison...

The fact of the matter is with the amount of people that knew and were following this ever since Brad left SoE, it was agreed that this could do 3000in the first week, not for the entire life of the project. Brad came here and some other places and pleaded with everyone to get the word out and it did. Most took one look at the KS and left. And just like any MMORPG that is launched really bad, if you don't grab your initial customers they are not going to come back no matter what you do. At least not a vast majority of them. This is no different. I have no doubt that within the first week there must of been at least 10k unique hits on the KS page and out of those, only a few percentage pledged. That's horrible. A successful KS makes a bulk of it's money in the beginning and at the end and the initial surge just wasn't enough (compared to other project) and the KS has never overcome that.

Vandyn_sl said:

The fact of the matter is with the amount of people that knew and were following this ever since Brad left SoE, it was agreed that this could do 3000in the first week, not for the entire life of the project. Brad came here and some other places and pleaded with everyone to get the word out and it did. Most took one look at the KS and left. And just like any MMORPG that is launched really bad, if you don't grab your initial customers they are not going to come back no matter what you do. At least not a vast majority of them. This is no different. I have no doubt that within the first week there must of been at least 10k unique hits on the KS page and out of those, only a few percentage pledged. That's horrible. A successful KS makes a bulk of it's money in the beginning and at the end and the initial surge just wasn't enough (compared to other project) and the KS has never overcome that.

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No doubt. They grossly underestimated what it would require to have a successful KS.

You have become better at begging (1)


2flare 5 minutes ago
I know there's a multi-millionaire who's reading this who 350k is nothing but a drop of sand.
Come on please, show mercy... save us all You can buy anything but this time...you can buy respect and admiration!!

And yet another email update using Kickstarter's resources to promote an alternative crowd funding site.

They can fuck themselves.

Tauro_sl said:

"Bill Harkins 8 minutes ago
Was doing some sketching and decided to bust out a character inspired by one of the Pantheon race descriptions. Went with the Ogre since that's what I really want to play: Let's get this thing funded!"http://fav.me/d77ijvt

Unbelievable that a backer can do a quick sketch of one of the races, but the DEVs, who are longtime professionals, cannot do so in 40 days

Worst KS campaign ever!

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Didn't I see that thing over in the Wildstar thread? Except it had a cigar

New update is out. They talk about transferring the tiers over to the website, plus new ones but I don't even see where you can get information about the tiers.

ETA: NM, You have to click on each one. It's still some sort of bullshit that you have to pay at least $100 to post on their supporter forums.

Whew , Brad needs to calm down and take a break. His overwhelming dedication to his Kickstarter in it's last few hours is exhausting to watch. You go Brad. We love you , anything you do is great , shining example of your work ethic for all to see.


Seriously, how can this KS campaign not be a way to judge him as not changed from Sigil stupidity ? What one example is out there to show he has learned anything from his mistakes and is ready to take a sum of money and make a game ?

Bradavatar.small
Creator Visionary Realms, Inc. 12 minutes ago

If you're having problems with the registration, please let us know at[email protected]/* <![CDATA[ */!function(t,e,r,n,c,a,p){try{t=document.currentScript||function(){for(t=document.getElementsByTagName('script'),e=t.length;e--if(t[e].getAttribute('data-cfhash'))return t[e]}();if(t&&(c=t.previousSibling)){p=t.parentNode;if(a=c.getAttribute('data-cfemail')){for(e='',r='0x'+a.substr(0,2)|0,n=2;a.length-n;n+=2)e+='%'+('0'+('0x'+a.substr(n,2)^r).toString(16)).slice(-2);p.replaceChild(document.createTextNode(decodeURIComponent(e)),c)}p.removeChild(t)}}catch(u){}}()/* ]]> */. Like Andrew said, it could take a few minutes, and also check your spam folders.

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I chuckled.....if you find the Pantheon messages in your spam folder then I would say your email filter is working as intended.

popsicledeath_sl said:

With how short-sighted they've proven to be, thinking solely for the now, not what's next, my guess is they're seeing enough cash come in from subscriptions and people saying they're ready to donate to the private site that they see being able to pay themselves back for the work on the KS and pay for enough staff to man the website (by the sounds of it they had to bring people in to do the website, so 'adding more team members' could really be talking about the people they already owe for the website and forums).

They've run this thing, intellectually, week-to-week, so my guess is that's their typical scope financially. If they can pay the bills this week, then bring more people in because why would next week be any different?

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Yea the last KS update pretty much says that, to me:
The benefit of a live pledging system such as the one on the PantheonRotF.com site is that the funds received can immediately go into development, with no delay. Your pledges or subscriptions will be directly responsible for the progress on the game!
Translated: We can spend the money as soon as you pledge!
Someone figured they've already made $1000+ on the forum, prior to KS ending. So if they're just paying themselves back for work already done, that's gonna suck up the initial funds pretty quickly and then what...
Unless...they have this mystery investor.
Cool. I still want to see this game.
According to Dayna on the KS comments, we'll see alpha later this year!!

Also, I know it was said already but if "Bill" from the KS comments can draw something like this in "about an hour"...


Why couldn't the pantheon artist sketch out races! Artists are always doodling and sketching.
just...UGH!

I'm stunned at how blindly most of those KS supporters follow Brad. Especially to the extent that they throw money at this project. According to some comments, one supporter admitted to being on a fixed income, yet alleged that she donated more than she could afford to back this disaster despite having two grandchildren (gee, how about saving up for them?). Another stated that they are considering opening up another credit card simply to donate its max limit to fund the project. Best of all was the guy who upped his contribution after getting his tax returns. Fucking tax returns?!

I'm a stranger to KS generally, but from their website:

"Can Kickstarter refund the money if a project is unable to fulfill?
No. Kickstarter doesn't issue refunds as transactions are between backers and creators directly. Creators receiveall funds(less fees) soon after their campaign ends."


The old adage is right, there truly is a sucker born every minute. . .and, if ever one doubted, this KS campaign proved it.

Notch_sl said:

I'm stunned at how blindly most of those KS supporters follow Brad. Especially to the extent that they throw money at this project. According to some comments, one supporter admitted to being on a fixed income, yet alleged that she donated more than she could afford to back this disaster despite having two grandchildren (gee, how about saving up for them?). Another stated that they are considering opening up another credit card simply to donate its max limit to fund the project. Best of all was the guy who upped his contribution after getting his tax returns. Fucking tax returns?!

I'm a stranger to KS generally, but from their website:

"Can Kickstarter refund the money if a project is unable to fulfill?
No. Kickstarter doesn't issue refunds as transactions are between backers and creators directly. Creators receiveall funds(less fees) soon after their campaign ends."


The old adage is right, there truly is a sucker born every minute. . .and, if ever one doubted, this KS campaign proved it.

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I have been a supporter of this and put $ in kickstarter... but the question always remained even IF this thing was Funded, how would they get from small KS funded project, to MMO fundage and what would that MMO fundage do to the design mechanics.

Even funded and even for what many wanted us to be it was always a longshot from hell.

Hmm... was looking at the tiers on their new website... the 120$ and the 150$ pack are exactly the same atm... well, they are game experts, not website/sales experts, right?

pantheon is the white people version of rims

I bet if you did a race survey it would be like 90% white people, 10% hispanic, 0% asian and black people

I think people way overestimate how many people were attracted to check out the ks and passed just based on the quality. I suspect most views were more nostalgic curiosity than anything else. Most people who likely checked it out were not going there with the intent to donate and were unlikely to be swayed, regardless as to what the kick starter showed.

Not to mention it is a weird sell. Should they have had a demo of a corpse recovery and losing levels when dying? Just having graphics and images that any other mmog has would not be promoting the soul of the game.

I still question the market for the game and thus don't necessarily agree that with a magical ks the money would have flowed in and easily funded.

I think to this day what the core game they are trying to build is still very unclear and I think having community members going out promoting their own interpretation of what they want the game to be did not help.

I think this lack of clarity of purpose was and is a much bigger issue than a super polished ks with a bunch of screenshots.

I still believe the scope of the project is much too broad given the resources and potential budget they may have to work with. I think a more clear and concise mission statement that specifically outlined the tightly focused core of the game would have done much more than just a bunch of pretty pictures.

I will continue to follow on their website but many here seem to believe if they just had a pretty makeover with some videos and screenshots the kickstarter might have funded. Maybe it would have, but not if what the game is intended to be was actually properly outlined.

I defy anyone here to concisely, and accurately explain the scope and objectives of the game they want to develop. You can't just say "hardcore, niche, old school."

I look at the tier offerings on the website but I still don't see a meaningful mission statement that does not only explain what they intend the game to be but more importantly what it is not going to be. I feel like they continue to be loosey goosey with this in order to keep the appeal, and thus the potential cash influx open.

I think they would be better off clearly defining what the game is going to be and outline the parameters and limitations. Then pursue the players who aggressively want to be a part of that project. All I see now are a bunch of players with a massive range of feelings as to what old school eq is, which makes for a horrible focus for a new game.

They should outline what they are doing and if it turns some people off so be it. At least it allows people who do want to play the game outlined to share what it is going to be with others without just guessing and wishing. Right now I feel like it is no different than any other mmog which tries to be all things to all people.