Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Whidon · Jan 17, 2014

So KS only did about 16k the past day. This is bad news, I was hoping for more like 20-25k. Basically it needs to do better then that somehow despite the fact most KS hit the funding valley right about now.

If it only manages 16k a day going forward. And based on how other KS have done that is likely pretty optimistic. Then this is going to miss funding by about 100k. Even if you get a really good amount on the last cpl days that seems unlikely to hit 800k.

At this point what needs to happen is the word really needs to get out. Ideally "something" an article or whatever will bring alot of backers..

Barring that gonna really have to kill the social media aspect from now on.

Khane · Jan 17, 2014

Do they even have a design document? Or is it the wild west over there? "Ok you design a dungeon that makes sebilis look like pre-school, and you start writing some lore that he won't be able to design around because it doesn't exist, and you start coding the druid class even though we aren't sure what other classes and abilities are even going to make it into the game because they are stretch goals and then somehow we will magically tie it all together and make it work"

Spynx_sl · Jan 17, 2014

Khane_sl said:
Do they even have a design document? Or is it the wild west over there? "Ok you design a dungeon that makes sebilis look like pre-school, and you start writing some lore that he won't be able to design around because it doesn't exist, and you start coding the druid class even though we aren't sure what other classes and abilities are even going to make it into the game because they are stretch goals and then somehow we will magically tie it all together and make it work"

god it sucks that 1/2 of me agrees with you

Furious · Jan 17, 2014

Creslin_sl said:
Ut is the guy who tells you that new hot girl you met is really a whore scumbag who will try to marry you asap so she can sleep with your brother and then take your house and dog. You hate that motherfuckers guts for saying that about your sweet little innocent girl. Then two years later she is living your mcmansion while you have an apartment on the wrong side of the tracks and Ut comes back to tell you that rebound girl is also a whore lookin to take some of that sweet disability money you get now because the first girl fucked you in the head so bad you can't work, and you hate Ut all over again for a second time for calling your sweet girl a whore, she gets you and would never do you like that first one did.

I like UT and I agree with him more then not. BUT! like he said, Brad manned up, took some heat said sorry and moved the fack on. I don't give a shit that the KS lools like a mess or whatever. EQ was a fucking wreck but it was fun! I hate Train tracks and exclamation marks, Ill take a little mess anyday.

Tad, keep leading us idiots to mmo heaven! (or off a cliff)

Laerazi_sl · Jan 17, 2014

The way I see it.. a Kickstarter launch is like any MMO launch. You get one chance to make a first impression, and then the majority of people will decide to kickstart or not. Getting the word out will only get people to look at the Kickstarter page.. but that's where the issue lies. If their initial impression is bad, I doubt most people would be noting it and returning at a later date.

For me, EverQuest stands as my favorite game of all time, yet this Kickstarter still hasn't convinced me it's worth my time. My brothers loved EQ, as well, and I have some co-workers that did too. Yet, I have zero desire to convince them to Kickstart, since there's nothing of substance I'd want them to see.

Meh..

a_skeleton_03 · Jan 17, 2014

Convo_sl said:
Lol not sure there is anyone on here who hasn't critiqued this project. That doesn't mean we don't want to see it succeed.. And lol at ripping on Tad with marching orders when we damn know you're one of the guys who was probably PMing UT asking him to post in this thread. It's funny how when UT shows up more haters start posting.. Does he make you feel more confident in your stance??

I think at this point the VR team needs to take a second and really fix this KS.. Going ahead it can't lead to all this confusion. It's not good enough at this point.

Utnayan and I don't talk to each other ... ever. I was posting in this thread before him. I talked to Tyen about getting Requiem involved so that fohguild could get linked to the kickstarter. I in fact WANT this game to succeed and was actually thinking about going over $1k, I even had a mental patient moment and debated the $10k for like 8 hours. I am not hating on this game in the slightest. Every aspect of the game needs to be talked about, not just what tard10 thinks is important.

Troy_Costisick_sl · Jan 17, 2014

Whidon1_sl said:
So KS only did about 16k the past day. This is bad news, I was hoping for more like 20-25k. Basically it needs to do better then that somehow despite the fact most KS hit the funding valley right about now.

According to Kicktraq they got over $20k yesterday. That should fall in the range you hoped for:Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. :: Kicktraq

bayr_sl · Jan 17, 2014

Laerazi_sl said:
The way I see it.. a Kickstarter launch is like any MMO launch. You get one chance to make a first impression, and then the majority of people will decide to kickstart or not. Getting the word out will only get people to look at the Kickstarter page.. but that's where the issue lies. If their initial impression is bad, I doubt most people would be noting it and returning at a later date.

For me, EverQuest stands as my favorite game of all time, yet this Kickstarter still hasn't convinced me it's worth my time. My brothers loved EQ, as well, and I have some co-workers that did too. Yet, I have zero desire to convince them to Kickstart, since there's nothing of substance I'd want them to see.

Meh..

This doesn't give me EQ vibes at all, it's oozing Vanguard though. They need a badass midi playing like the original Everquest website

Xaxius · Jan 17, 2014

Utnayan_sl said:
I am 99% sure SOE is on board with this after they siphon dollars from consumers.

I'll take it a step further... I'm 100% sure SOE is on board. To really know that though, all you had to do was pay attention... I'd hardly call that any sort of revelation.

Sept 9th via Twitter:

Purposely vague now, but stoked about plans I've been cooking up since leaving SOE. Just had a great lunch with Smed and he's excited too!

From BradMcQuaid.com:

Brad left SOE in August 2013 as part of a huge RIF. With so many jobless developers in the area and so many exciting game design ideas in his head, Brad intends to start something. He?s run the ideas by John Smedley, who was visibly excited.

Brad's responseto my post earlier this week:

1. it's always nice to have Smed's blessing
2. We were talking about sharing some tech where and when it might make sense.

I fully expect SOE to publish Pantheon, if they hit their 800k goal. They'll publish it in the same way they did with Dragon's Prophet and Wizardy. I'm sure they'll pony up additional funding to finished the game, in exchange for a % ownership of the company with Brad retaining creative control. That's not exclusively based on the tidbits Brad left above, but previous history and common sense.

1.) Brad and Smed have extensive history together.
2.) Brad is 2 for 2 with games he's made being published by SoE.
3.) A company the size of SoE only helps a smaller studio if they have a vested financial interest.

popsicledeath · Jan 17, 2014

Creslin_sl said:
Ut is the guy who tells you that new hot girl you met is really a whore scumbag who will try to marry you asap so she can sleep with your brother and then take your house and dog. You hate that motherfuckers guts for saying that about your sweet little innocent girl. Then two years later she is living your mcmansion while you have an apartment on the wrong side of the tracks and Ut comes back to tell you that rebound girl is also a whore lookin to take some of that sweet disability money you get now because the first girl fucked you in the head so bad you can't work, and you hate Ut all over again for a second time for calling your sweet girl a whore, she gets you and would never do you like that first one did.

Hrm, more like he's the guy telling you your girl is a whore because she's had sexual experiences at all like anyone else or maybe had a few wild nights in college, and then when you don't bite, has an unnamed friend he can't name swear he knows a story about how something bad happened that he can't completely divulge. And then if you still don't bite? Rages and rapes your girlfriend until you get the point? SEE, TOLD YOU SHE WAS A WHORE!!!

When Ut is right, he's right. And he's right often enough. But going around yelling in the face of everyone in a new relationship that their relationship will not work makes you right a good amount of the time, but still makes you an asshole for thinking being the loudest about the worst possible scenario that we're all already aware makes him special.

We get it, Ut. In the back of our minds we're also scared our new relationship won't last. And you're right that you'll probably help it not last if you yell enough and make being in that relationship miserable. What the fuck are you gaining, though? What's the point? Just to feel better when you've ensured every kid isn't manipulated and tricked into believing Santa Claus is real?

spronk · Jan 17, 2014

Whidon1_sl said:
So KS only did about 16k the past day. This is bad news, I was hoping for more like 20-25k. Basically it needs to do better then that somehow despite the fact most KS hit the funding valley right about now.

If it only manages 16k a day going forward. And based on how other KS have done that is likely pretty optimistic. Then this is going to miss funding by about 100k. Even if you get a really good amount on the last cpl days that seems unlikely to hit 800k.

the kickstarter estimate page (kicktraq) should be added to the FP so non math people can just click on something to see where the KS is estimated to end up at. Its currently estimated at 1.1m at current run rates
Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen by Visionary Realms, Inc. :: Kicktraq

its hilarious reading this thread though, ut is one one end of the spectrum (negative about everything) while tad10 is on the other end (this is the last hope for MMOs! If you don't give money you are literally HitlerSuperAids performing an abortion on this game!) I'm enjoying just reading all the back and forth more than I could possibly enjoy any new MMO. Its also awesome how incredibly inept the team seems to be in dealing with the internet of 2014, hopefully their next kickstart update is a link to their myspace page.

a_skeleton_03 · Jan 17, 2014

Xaxius_sl said:
I'll take it a step further... I'm 100% sure SOE is on board. To really know that though, all you had to do was pay attention... I'd hardly call that any sort of revelation.

Sept 9th via Twitter:

From BradMcQuaid.com:

Brad's responseto my post earlier this week:

I fully expect SOE to publish Pantheon, if they hit their 800k goal. They'll publish it in the same way they did with Dragon's Prophet and Wizardy. I'm sure they'll pony up additional funding to finished the game, in exchange for a % ownership of the company with Brad retaining creative control. That's not exclusively based on the tidbits Brad left above, but previous history and common sense.

1.) Brad and Smed have extensive history together.
2.) Brad is 2 for 2 with games he's made being published by SoE.
3.) A company the size of SoE only helps a smaller studio if they have a vested financial interest.

I was pretty sure that Brad said in this thread that they are not attached to SOE for funding at all and don't want to be. Someone correct me if I am wrong.

jilena_sl · Jan 17, 2014

Convo_sl said:
well, he mentioned somewhere(maybe here) that dungeons will be so large groups will actually have places they can safely camp at.. I'm assuming hes thinking some players may look to sell shit at those locations? I'm ok with AH's if they are regional.. I just hate the global system.. I'd prefer a straight trading system tho

Maybe an in between convenience like some sort of system where in major towns you have a big bulletin board type thing where you can post up a message saying you had XYZ for sale or want to buy and let people tear off little pieces of paper with your number on them. Then a bunch of interested parties could contact the buyer/seller and even try to convince him to sell/buy to/from them over the others and plan to meet up for the exchange etc. Or to modernize the thought, more like craigslist than ebay.

The idea being to streamline the annoying part of having to stand around hawking your wares or shouting you want to buy something instead of playing but without removing the "human" element. As it still can't be completely automated, those who want the EC tunnel experience can still stand around buying or selling possibly in a spot it becomes convenient for people to meet up at to finalize transactions. Then you could pick up the sword you ordered from the blacksmith and shop around for a shield or shout that you have donkey pelts for sale while you're there.

Furious · Jan 17, 2014

Xaxius_sl said:
I'll take it a step further... I'm 100% sure SOE is on board. To really know that though, all you had to do was pay attention... I'd hardly call that any sort of revelation.

Sept 9th via Twitter:

From BradMcQuaid.com:

Brad's responseto my post earlier this week:

I fully expect SOE to publish Pantheon, if they hit their 800k goal. They'll publish it in the same way they did with Dragon's Prophet and Wizardy. I'm sure they'll pony up additional funding to finished the game, in exchange for a % ownership of the company with Brad retaining creative control. That's not exclusively based on the tidbits Brad left above, but previous history and common sense.

1.) Brad and Smed have extensive history together.
2.) Brad is 2 for 2 with games he's made being published by SoE.
3.) A company the size of SoE only helps a smaller studio if they have a vested financial interest.

$100 bucks says a BIG no from SOE. Brad has stated that.

Like i said back on page 30, there is no benifit for SOE to get involved. Sony is hurting, Smed and Brad have a long history and are friends but that's where it ends. If Smed helped out with resources from SOE he would lose his job FAST. Imagine explaining helping your competition to the board of directors!

AmberT._sl · Jan 17, 2014

Brad or Ben, get over to the Kickstarter site and clear up all this shit about the two $250 tiers. People are freaking out over there. Gawd, why couldn't you have made the new one cost $255 or $245 to avoid all this confusion?

DickTrickle · Jan 17, 2014

popsicledeath_sl said:
Vanguard didn't have anything in the game that was being mentioned by Brad? Didn't have anything? Nothing at all, that Brad had talked about having?

You've been right enough, and are smart enough, that you yourself don't have to bullshit us.

I don't know if internet forums could exist without massive hyperbole. By all people on all sides.

Hah.

Quaid · Jan 17, 2014

That cleric class reveal have me a derection.

The intention behind all communication during this KS campaign should be too generate excitement. Telling us your traditional fantasy MMO has clerics isn't exciting at all. Also, you present almost no specifics about the class at all. Why not just reveal them all at once if you have do little to say about them?

Aradune_sl · Jan 17, 2014

jilena_sl said:
This^

I thought the implementation (staring at a book, later sitting) in EQ was stupid. However having the idea of limited resources and how you choose to manage them was important. Should you burn that mana now to end the fight quicker, or hold on to it just in case some shit jumps off you weren't expecting. The key was that you had a finite pool of resources that you could not immediately regenerate. You had the ability to make it regenerate faster but that also required a choice (sitting vs fighting). The resource was so important some classes brought huge utility to the group just by being able to increase its rate of regeneration.

The point being that while maybe not on par with a game of chess, every encounter required strategy and poor strategic choices resulted in more downtime, even death, or in some cases a complete failure and wipe. Some people are scoffing at the thought of ice comet but really spells like that and complete heal were huge strategic choices. The large mana investment and cast time meant planning ahead before using them.

Burn 400 mana on complete heal and you may not have enough to cast gheal or remedy on that wizard that just dropped ice comet. Cast it too soon you are wasting mana. Cast it too late, your tank dies.

Burn 400 mana on ice comet and you might not have enough mana to evac after the next horrible pull or enough to snare that fleeing mob. Cast it too soon, the mob is eating your face. Cast it too late, the rogue got some nice BS in and you just wasted half the damage.

In WoW I miss a reactionary and my DPS drops 1% for that fight, who cares.

I agree with both of you and we will be clarifying and adding more detail to the downtime section and other sections. thanks.

Utnayan · Jan 17, 2014

Xaxius_sl said:
I'll take it a step further... I'm 100% sure SOE is on board. To really know that though, all you had to do was pay attention... I'd hardly call that any sort of revelation.

Sept 9th via Twitter:

From BradMcQuaid.com:

Brad's responseto my post earlier this week:

I fully expect SOE to publish Pantheon, if they hit their 800k goal. They'll publish it in the same way they did with Dragon's Prophet and Wizardy. I'm sure they'll pony up additional funding to finished the game, in exchange for a % ownership of the company with Brad retaining creative control. That's not exclusively based on the tidbits Brad left above, but previous history and common sense.

1.) Brad and Smed have extensive history together.
2.) Brad is 2 for 2 with games he's made being published by SoE.
3.) A company the size of SoE only helps a smaller studio if they have a vested financial interest.

And...

Aradune:

SOE does NOT have this backed. They're putting everything they have into Landmark/EQN.

And obviously Tad10's delusional comment towards me. Well, I was called delusional back when I told everyone Sigil Games was an absolute mess along with the game and calling out feature launched lies. Looks like I'll be delusional again Tad10. Just for you.

Utnayan · Jan 17, 2014

Aradune_sl said:
I agree with both of you and we will be clarifying and adding more detail to the downtime section and other sections. thanks.

You have said that twice now. When? Or is that not written into the design doc yet?

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Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

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