Paragon, Epic Games(Unreal) MOBA, PC/PS4

Intrinsic

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I've been playing this the past couple of days and between dota, LoL, Smite... almost everything, I'm not sure there has been a worse group of MOBA players. No one has any idea what is going on or what to do. Everyone treats this like team deathmatch. It is kind of infuriating. Having said that, it is pretty fun. Very shallow right now and seems there are quite a few cards that have been disabled which further limits what you can do build wise. Was doing super good as Muriel support and decided to switch it up with some Kallari for fun.
 

Arcaus_sl

shitlord
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Can someone give me a run down of how this game plays differently than Smite, Paladins, Overwatch? From what I've played, this one seems a lot slower paced, and more full tri-lane, creep killing DOTA style than a brawler like HOTS.
Differences from Smite -
1. Cards - before the match you build a "deck" of items that you can purchase in the game.
2. True 3rd dimension - Elevation matters. Similar to a WoW battleground you can stand on a ramp and they have to go up the ramp to get to you instead of just walking to you from any direction to punch you. This makes positioning in certain areas for team fights super important.
3. Harvesters - Starting at 3 minutes, Harvesters open. You can use an item to place a harvester at one of the pre-determined areas. These basically passive build up gold. When you go stand on them everyone in your team gets the stored up gold and it begins to passively build up gold again.
4. Last Hit - There is no last hit in Smite

@Intrinsic - I feel your pain. I logged on yesterday to get my quick daily win so I went co-op PVE. We had 4 Junglers. No one was killing the jungle creeps though, they were just wandering back and forth between lanes killing the computer players. I had to push two lanes to get the super creeps moving. It took 45 minutes to do an AI game
frown.png
 

Intrinsic

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Yeah, to expound on what Arcaus said...

You construct a Deck out of your overall card pool with a maximum of 40 points. Each card varies in value from 1pt - 4pt (they may go higher, not sure). Cards have stuff like +100 health, +phys damage, +cool down reduction, pretty much standard stuff you can come up with, higher value cards have a combination of things. Cards are either Equipment or Upgrades. Equipment cards have three Upgrade slots that you spend your currency in game to improve. So like, if I start with an "Adamant Edge" that gives me +7.6 Physical Damage and +100 Health, I can then slot it with up to 3 different upgrade cards to further increase Physical Damage, Health, Mana, Armor Pen, etc... And most of those equipment cards give you a bonus once fully upgraded. Like the Adamant Edge is +15.2 Physical Damage when fully upgraded.

It is kind of convoluted, and the interface for deck building and upgrading in game is pretty crappy. But looking at some old screenshots it seems like they're trying to improve it. Cards have other restrictions that aren't immediately obvious. You have to buy card packs with in game currency points (think I read these aren't going to be RMT, so it isn't supposed to be p2w for them). It isn't a bad system, it just needs a lot of work to be more user friendly while offering flexibility. It feels more like LoL's item shop than something like DotA. Not saying it is a bad thing just a kind of reference.

The Harvesters are kind of an interesting concept. There are 7 on the map and not locked to any team. Four open at 3 minutes, Two at 6 minutes, and the final one at 9 minutes. So at 3 min your jungle or support can go plant a harvester on your side. It will start "harvesting" currency until it gets full. At an time a team member can run through and extract the currency. The trick is that anything harvested applies to the whole team, so it is global $$$. Getting them planted and making sure you're tapping them really increases the efficiency of the team. Of course, the other team can invade your jungle and destroy / take over your harvester spot. So you still have to pay attention and defend them. Can't be totally passive if the toher team is good.

Since there are no couriers or anything for upgrading items you kind of do your Recall cycle like in LoL. But what you can do is, if a harvester is planted, drop back in lane then hit the harvester, then recall.

Another thing is that creeps / minions combined with the absolutely paper thin towers and inhibitors make laning kind of crazy. Towers and inhibs have like 5hp and if you ignore a lane that has a little bit of an imbalance in creep equilibrium, or that even one person from the other team is pushing, you can lose two towers real quick. On one hand it really forces rotations and fights to occur. But on the other even though you have a 'Sprint' ability to move between lanes, it kind of sucks man. That's what I was complaining about earlier where everyone just wants to run around and team deathmatch. The meta and game sense hasn't really evolved to get the laning stage figured out. People just want to rotate, rotate. Just tonight I decided that a real good strategy may be to grab an early jungle camp, rotate 3 people mid / right / left immediately, and push the tower. You could get the T1 in like 3 minutes and there's nothing the other team could do about it. Shit just pushes sooo fast with any sort of coordination and there isn't enough mobility for team members to respond if they're out of position.

Anyways, I'm just rambling b/c it was a long night and pretty much only played this. So was thinking about a lot of crap. I'm tired.
 

turbo

Molten Core Raider
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While it has alot of upsides the two major complaints from me are

1) Tower diving = just can't do it; with out minions you get stunned and each tower shot just rapes you so much to the point you can't even go 1 hit someone. Makes it to easy to live; i love in smite being able to make clutch tower dives for people trying to huddle under the tower. They need to change this

2) It just seems abit less skill based then you would think and unresposive. Granted this is from a Smite player's perspective but in Smite moving around you can do so much as far as juking and proper skill/executation can really turn the tables in fights. Paragon not nearly as much, its pretty much if you get jumped and can't get a sprint fired up without getting hit you are dead period (unless you have an escape). Not saying you CAN'T JUKE but its not nearly as effective and just feels really clunky and slow. I'd like to see movement speed increased more or i really think the game won't translate well to the higher skill level of play/pro's. Strategy is great and i do like alot of the components of the game but if you are going to go for the 3D full control movement vs stupid point & click shit of LOL/DOTA (YA!!!) then at least let people make plays. Don't get me wrong, i don't want a FPS type game, i favor strategy, position and card selection to be large drivers of success but i'd like to feel that juking etc has a part to play.

Will see how it progresses, i had hoped maybe to transition to this from Smite but as of now the movement probably means i will just play casually as Smite still provides such great and diverse game play and a good pro scene to follow.
 

Intrinsic

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I'm not sure how recently you have played (and I just started last week so have no historical context), but the new FOTM or meta or what ever you want to call it is kind of tower diving. Pick Rampage and you can kill a tower easy without a creep wave. Grux can do it also. And one person + a Muriel can. But I think that goes back to the towers and inhibs being made of paper. Plus a bit of Rampage needing an adjustment, his ult is just dumb.

I'm with you about the movement thing though. It could certainly keep me from playing it more seriously. They tried to add some interesting juke possibilities with the shadow poolss, but it kinda doesn't work. Also body blocking is stupid easy. Character collision boxes are huge so if you get jumped by two people and don't have a mobility spell it is pretty much RIP regardless.
 

turbo

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I meant single man tower dives to kill someone as a non tank. Its just not possible unless they changed it in the last few days or i didnt pay attention.
 

Intrinsic

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Ooohhh yeah, unless you are Rampage that probably isn't gonna happen right now.
 

Intrinsic

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Turbo has experience in both. I only played Paragon so could only compare it to something like Dota or LoL. Unfortunately haven't played this in the past month at all so no sure what has been patched / changed since the start of April.
 

Arcaus_sl

shitlord
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The big patch in April was increasing speed.

Personally I feel like Paragon has more potential but it's still young and the hero selection is limited because of that. Both are very good games. Smite has the additional game modes above and beyond the normal moba style which puts it over the top to me right now. After playing it i don't think I would drop money on Paragon. I would wait the 2 months or whatever it is until release and just play it at release.
 

Kanglor

Silver Knight of the Realm
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I haven't played Smite since the month it launched, so can't really compare it, but agree with Arcaus about Paragon having potential from the bit I've played of it. Even with it being fully playable it's still pretty raw in spots, match making being a big one, ie imbalanced skill levels, terrible hero comps, etc. From what I understand they are also discussing possible changes on how shared XP and Card XP works, because at the moment laning feels very lackluster. They've got a solid base, I really like the map, but unless you are really interested in getting in early for $20 I'd say hold off as well.
 

Nirgon

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splurged and got the master founder's pack

this game is really fun and the graphics are amazing

Rampage seems a little OP


Gonna work on Sevarog and Grim.exe tonight if anyone wants to play
 

Hatorade

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This is free now with playstation plus(Starter pack) tried a couple games as the Mercy looking dude that can add shields and it is ok but was annoyed no one on my team was using the harvesters I built. That said the other team didn't use theirs either and stomped us so no idea how much of a difference they make.
 

Quaid

Trump's Staff
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Smite blows this out of the water on PS4.

Gameplay is sluggish. Abilities are boring and lack impactful feedback. UI is an abomination. Aiming is a chore.

Map is interesting and the graphics are pretty though.
 

Nirgon

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Ya its in early development and needs more chars, maybe a couple maps.

I think its really good but maybe I'm weird. The grind for a rank 10 char is immense but it probably should be.

Friends keep pulling me to other games but I'm glad I supported this. Their devs actually listen and respond a lot on their boards (not sure they should get this heavily invested with the "never pleaseds").


As far as the boring ability thing at first it seemed simple then I was blocking skill shots with grim's shield, lobbing extremely long range knock backs leading to kills and team praise, conserving mana by toggling his snare and playing the current dance in and out of combat with travel mode game which was actually rather engaging and fun.

It needs more how to guides from pros and a bigger community highlighting team comps and strats for sure. The free weekends are a good draw but i think this one is going to depend on word of mouth and how fast they can crank out more high quality champs and making more interesting cards and combos for build outs... which I trust Epic to do. Having this game find itself at major gaming tournaments when it is ready sure might help too. Pace is another thing they are constantly keeping an eye on and juggling.
 

Intrinsic

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Damn my last match was April 5th. Maybe this weekend I'll put some more time in. My Muriel was pretty beast. Haven't even kept up with any patch notes or additions.
 

turbo

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Smite blows this out of the water on PS4.

Gameplay is sluggish. Abilities are boring and lack impactful feedback. UI is an abomination. Aiming is a chore.

Map is interesting and the graphics are pretty though.
I really had hope this might be a transition from Smite which is my primary source of gaming at the moment but I just can't get into it after playing Smite. As mentioned, just really damn sluggish compared to Smite (granted i'm comparing PC versions). Seems there is such less capability to manuavuer. I can't handle point and click shit like LOL but this is a step back from maneuverability allowed in Smite . I'm not an FPS fan at all so i think i'm stuck with Smite being about the perfect speed for this cat.
 

Utnayan

I Love Utnayan he’s awesome
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I played this after downloading... Only played two games so far, solo vs AI. On PS4. I am playing Gideon. I am having a blast but that may change when I switch to full on PvP. We should get a team going.
 

bixxby

Molten Core Raider
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Smite blows this out of the water on PS4.

Gameplay is sluggish. Abilities are boring and lack impactful feedback. UI is an abomination. Aiming is a chore.

Map is interesting and the graphics are pretty though.
Same. Game was an instant turn off for me.