The Elder Scrolls Online

Abefroman

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
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Would it be great if you could queue for the regular server while in the overflow? Yeah. Zenimax is a horrible dev studio though, so they probably didn't even think about it or didn't bother coding it in because they're lazy as fuck.

I'm just surprised they have an overflow server. Not having a queue to the main is the least of my worries or things I want to pick on them for.
My problem with it is everyone is constantly talking about pve sucks and who cares about adventure zones because pvp is fun. Now you really don't have overflow as an option. Maybe they will get lucky and all the Teso fanboys will be more then happy to just quest and PVE and the pvpers will get fast queues. I don't think it could possibly be worse then that GW2 queue bullshit I went through.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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Not sure why people are confused about this. It's a pretty good system.
No, it's evidence of a failed implementation. The megaserver is designed to be elastic enough to support anywhere from 1000 to literally billions of players. It's just a matter of whether the core systems that drive that are capable of handling the load. They've found that's not the case in the previous betas so they are putting this bandaid overflow bullshit in last minute to remedy the problem.

Ukerric said it better than me:
That assumes their architecture is capable of doing that. They probably banked everything on the mega-server being the be-all-end-all, discovered there's an absolute cap, found out that they would need six months to rip and redo the intern's code, and cobbled together this overflow kludge.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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My problem with it is everyone is constantly talking about pve sucks and who cares about adventure zones because pvp is fun. Now you really don't have overflow as an option. Maybe they will get lucky and all the Teso fanboys will be more then happy to just quest and PVE and the pvpers will get fast queues. I don't think it could possibly be worse then that GW2 queue bullshit I went through.
The release GW2 queues were hilarious. At one point at release would be literally 10 people from each faction allowed in WvW.
rrr_img_63333.jpg

This was in the last beta where queues were working more or less properly. I remember in release you'd see lines of 50+ people at each portal. The other problem with the queues is that it was faster to constantly requeue than to wait in the queue. The only people reliably getting in were those who macro'd a queue request + cancel that ran at 10hz.


The big driver behind waiting in a queue instead of going out and experiencing the world is that we initially had one day WvW fights and were competitive to the point of wanting to go undefeated, which meant we had to be on the top of our game every hour of every day since we could never accrue a substantial lead. We ended up going 30-0.

TESO, with its 90 day campaigns won't have that initial demand, so I think even guilds like PRX will have a much more relaxed approach to queuing. I think in the first week given the choice between overflow and queue + chance for queuing to Cyrodiil it'd be preferred to go to overflow just to level and farm.
 

Nija

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Bots will exist in every game. I wrote my first bot for a MUD we played at the back of computer class as a freshman in high school, '94ish.

BNC Novell LAN, everything.

That was just a simple text parser, but monitoring areas of the screen for certain arrangements of pixels isn't much harder. You can use use AutoIT to script a bot for any wow clone in ~500 lines, give or take.

ESO isn't the exception. This move is just an excuse.
 

Furry

WoW Office
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I'm afraid I'm not technical enough to really continue this :3 EQ was just about the most hacked mmo, though, regardless. Macroquest and ShowEQ came in very easy to use packaged formulas that very rarely got anyone banned. Good modern game companies use intrusive shit like system scallers and .dll's (P99 uses something like this, it doesn't run all the time, but it's there to be activated when needed) which combined with the need for an internet connection can detect this shit pretty fast. Bots are rampant on WoW now, but only because Blizzard has declined to do anything about them (most still pay a sub).
Most bots are developed through a mixture of disassemble and memory editing. The concepts behind macroquest are exactly the same as concepts behind modern bots, and things like aimhacks in fps. If a player gets feedback of any form from the game over having connected a hit, someone with the two aforementioned tools can read that feedback and make a bot that responds to it. Pixel readers and stuff like that are honestly far more memory/effort intensive, and are rarely/never used in commercial bot farms. If anything, you want to do the exact opposite, and completely kill the graphics processing of a game if possible, to reduce its memory foot and increase efficiency.

Bots have no problem with elder scrolls.
 
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Most bots are developed through a mixture of disassemble and memory editing. The concepts behind macroquest are exactly the same as concepts behind modern bots, and things like aimhacks in fps. If a player gets feedback of any form from the game over having connected a hit, someone with the two aforementioned tools can read that feedback and make a bot that responds to it. Pixel readers and stuff like that are honestly far more memory/effort intensive, and are rarely/never used in commercial bot farms. If anything, you want to do the exact opposite, and completely kill the graphics processing of a game if possible, to reduce its memory foot and increase efficiency.

Bots have no problem with elder scrolls.
Are the bots reading the incoming and outgoing game packets for certain types of info? How do they do that?
 

Nija

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If you want to talk about disassembling and memory editing you're getting into the realm of outright cheating.

The second most impressive instance of that kind of thing, that I know about, was in SWG. A guy wrote a hook for the main exe that added functionality to the map screen. You'd simply mouse over an area on the map and press insert. This would mark it as your 'home' destination. You could then WARP there while in combat by pressing the HOME key.

If you wanted to just warp around on the map, you'd open up the map and mouseover a location and hit page up. The only limit to how fast you could warp was how quickly your PC could load in the assets.

If you played SWG early on and remembered those strange glitches that would warp huge packs of people to the 0,0 x,y locations of a planet - that was the inspiration for this modification. Basically their shitty hole opened up a whole new mode of travel.

I've got probably half a dozen more stories spanning half a dozen games, but this isn't really the time or the place to discuss those.
 

Heallun

Lord Nagafen Raider
1,100
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The release GW2 queues were hilarious. At one point at release would be literally 10 people from each faction allowed in WvW.
rrr_img_63333.jpg

This was in the last beta where queues were working more or less properly. I remember in release you'd see lines of 50+ people at each portal. The other problem with the queues is that it was faster to constantly requeue than to wait in the queue. The only people reliably getting in were those who macro'd a queue request + cancel that ran at 10hz.


The big driver behind waiting in a queue instead of going out and experiencing the world is that we initially had one day WvW fights and were competitive to the point of wanting to go undefeated, which meant we had to be on the top of our game every hour of every day since we could never accrue a substantial lead. We ended up going 30-0.
Godfuck I remember trying to queue up when the resets would happen. Missing the queue was brutal, and you know that some assholes were in there dolyak farming instead of fighting for gravy train exp. Hell, most of em.
 

Furry

WoW Office
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Are the bots reading the incoming and outgoing game packets for certain types of info? How do they do that?
you could, but generally you just read the computer's own memory, and reading/changing that memory is exactly what a bot is and how it works.

Of course it's cheating.
 

Heallun

Lord Nagafen Raider
1,100
1,073
Most bots are developed through a mixture of disassemble and memory editing. The concepts behind macroquest are exactly the same as concepts behind modern bots, and things like aimhacks in fps. If a player gets feedback of any form from the game over having connected a hit, someone with the two aforementioned tools can read that feedback and make a bot that responds to it. Pixel readers and stuff like that are honestly far more memory/effort intensive, and are rarely/never used in commercial bot farms. If anything, you want to do the exact opposite, and completely kill the graphics processing of a game if possible, to reduce its memory foot and increase efficiency.

Bots have no problem with elder scrolls.
Interesting info right here ^. I never knew much about them. First encountered it in PoP and was blown away by it.
 

selis

Molten Core Raider
24
0
Yeah the real census is what happened in the beta.... Aldmeri Dominion was by far the most popular of the three factions.
I wouldn't be surprised if this wasn't the case on release. I feel like the draw of the "good guys" (high elves, bright sunny realms) is going to be too appealing to folks who don't know that much about MMOs. Or subsequently are playing with someone who doesn't (e.g. my partner wants to play here). I've been trying to decide which faction to play on (I believe PRX is still going AD?) and now think Ebonheart might be the low man on the totem pole.
 

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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We're still going AD. From our research the other big PVP groups aren't going AD and that's usually the most important thing. I have no idea how the campaigns will play out but I feel like if we dominate our area and the guesting system works we'll probably spend a lot of time guesting to other servers and fighting the good fight.
 

Abefroman

Naxxramas 1.0 Raider
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We're still going AD. From our research the other big PVP groups aren't going AD and that's usually the most important thing. I have no idea how the campaigns will play out but I feel like if we dominate our area and the guesting system works we'll probably spend a lot of time guesting to other servers and fighting the good fight.
Mercs! Charge for that shit. The tears will be glorious.
 

Bondurant

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Is there somewhere any official ZOS stance about nameplates in PvP ? I can't find any, only "rumours" and idiots quoting random shit without links.
 

Itzena_sl

shitlord
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Bots will exist in every game. I wrote my first bot for a MUD we played at the back of computer class as a freshman in high school, '94ish.

BNC Novell LAN, everything.

That was just a simple text parser, but monitoring areas of the screen for certain arrangements of pixels isn't much harder. You can use use AutoIT to script a bot for any wow clone in ~500 lines, give or take.

ESO isn't the exception. This move is just an excuse.
Does anyone know if they stoppedsendingthe buff (etc). information to the client or if TESO still has it in the actual data stream & they just filter it out/ignore it client-side?
Because if it's the latter, I'd fully expect packet-sniffing UI replacements by launch. And bots, of course.