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Cybsled

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I would agree on that point (they need to spend $$$$$ to harden facilities to account for these types of events). Ultimately that will potentially safe guard against future repeats. Point 1 was mostly to highlight the fact they're essentially on an island in terms of a power grid.
 

Borzak

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You can only shift power so far. The adjacent states are in the same shape but it doesn't make news because they are a much smaller state. OK was -17F. LA lost major sections of power they are still working on. The nuclear plant outside New Orleans, River Bend just north of Baton Rouge, and the Port Gibson nuclear plant in MS announced they were already running at max capacity. Not sure where they think they were going to get power from nearby.

Entergy (provider in LA) made a shift 20+ years ago to not shift power to the east so that power could be shifted domino up the east coast when they had power drains in hot weather. That used to be common in the summer because their contract agreement called for it. They ended that and the summer blackouts stopped.

Under Obama the federal government tried to regulat the ogranization that oversaw the powergrid into merging with the west so CA could get power. Good luck with that.
 
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Aychamo BanBan

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You can only shift power so far. The adjacent states are in the same shape but it doesn't make news because they are a much smaller state. OK was -17F. LA lost major sections of power they are still working on. The nuclear plant outside New Orleans, River Bend just north of Baton Rouge, and the Port Gibson nuclear plant in MS announced they were already running at max capacity. Not sure where they think they were going to get power from nearby.

Entergy (provider in LA) made a shift 20+ years ago to not shift power to the east so that power could be shifted domino up the east coast when they had power drains in hot weather. That used to be common in the summer because their contract agreement called for it. They ended that and the summer blackouts stopped.

Under Obama the federal government tried to regulat the ogranization that oversaw the powergrid into merging with the west so CA could get power. Good luck with that.

How the fuck do you know all this????
 
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lurkingdirk

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Burns

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Still wondering about the co-op power in TX works. Two different people on two different co-ops had a total outage of 20 minutes total. I had co-op when I lived there. The good part about it was the office/yard for all the workers and repair stuff was 15 minutes away.

I am on co-op power in the DFW area and had zero minutes of outage, but the co-op outage map was showing up to 30% of their customers (residences) were without power. I watched the map on Monday, and it looked like they were pretty good about cycling people every 2 hours.

If I was to guess why this particular neighborhood stayed online, I would surmise that we are on the same grid as some emergency building. I think the main Police Station and 911 call center may be on the same "block" as us.

It may be the case, for co-ops in general, they they were better prepared with diverse hedges on where they sourced power from, whereas other companies, like Centerpoint, tried to use Wind and Solar as their primary/only hedge.

Internet was down for most of the area from Monday at 8 am to Wed at 5 pm, which clogged up the cell tower traffic even worse (since people w/o power were on their cell, while sitting in their car to keep it charged & them warm). So work from home was screwed for most everyone, regardless.

P.S. All the numbers of "people" without power are actually residences without power. So, you can at least double that number if not triple it, to get close to the true amount of people that were w/o power.
 
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Furry

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I am on co-op power in the DFW area and had zero minutes of outage, but the co-op outage map was showing up to 30% of their customers (residences) were without power. I watched the map on Monday, and it looked like they were pretty good about cycling people every 2 hours.

Some places were reporting outages that didn't exist. Because wink wink they are following the rules.
 

Burns

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Some places were reporting outages that didn't exist. Because wink wink they are following the rules.

According to nextdoor and other sources, there were a bunch of people on the same Co-op that were getting blackouts (some for over 12 hours). That said, there was a huge discrepancy between what the companies website was reporting (30,000+), and what poweroutage.us was reporting (less than 1000).
 

Furry

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According to nextdoor and other sources, there were a bunch of people on the same Co-op that were getting blackouts (some for over 12 hours). That said, there was a huge discrepancy between what the companies website was reporting (30,000+), and what poweroutage.us was reporting (less than 1000).
Oh there's some going that way too. This whole thing has been a clusterfuck. Driving out this morning I saw a few sheets of black ice coming from houses, so you know their pipes bust. Gonna be a whole shitstorm when things really start to thaw.
 

Borzak

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He's worked in the Petrochem Industry for his entire life lol.
And the last 15 years servicing the power plant industry along with the petro chem industry. I should spoiler and post the ginourmous long post I sent to someone I knew this morning it's very very long. Just the shit I run into with power plants and the shit that happens to them and gets idled as new and such. And I'm not even on the management/regulation end AT ALL. Death by a 1,000 paper cuts.

Grandmother on Deep East Texas Co-op has had power almost the entire time. Short outage and who knows that could have been from a tree since it's all along timber company land and national forest. They have a very small customer base. I'm not sure how many, only 6k in the entire county.

The land lines and cell coverage is down there now. AT&T cell. Who knows battery backup on the cell towers might have run down.
 
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TJT

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And the last 15 years servicing the power plant industry along with the petro chem industry. I should spoiler and post the ginourmous long post I sent to someone I knew this morning it's very very long. Just the shit I run into with power plants and the shit that happens to them and gets idled as new and such. And I'm not even on the management/regulation end AT ALL. Death by a 1,000 paper cuts.
Could you please? That sounds like an interesting read.
 
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Borzak

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How the fuck do you know all this????
All that in that post was released in the news either at the time or as of late. I'm in MS now and the nuclear plant power was on the news giving an update on what they were doing. We've had one outage of less than an hour. All 3 within 1-1/2 hours of here.

The contract was a big deal with Entergy after a few summers of heat and them sending power from the 3 nuclear plants on the grid to the east so power could be shifted domino like up the east coast. Lot of ticked off people.
 

Borzak

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Could you please? That sounds like an interesting read.

Not all of it focused on Texas. Some LA, MS and the coal industry as a whole. I rambled on for someone that asked when I was up all night trying to get the pain to pass. I posted much of it before. Death by a 1,000 cuts. I can't even imagine on the regulation and management side. I'm just on the fabrication side. Lot of opinion but I don't give a shit. Only from what I can see.

From an outsider looking in power needs a top down "plan" much like nuclear did during the OPEC squeeze days. But that would require planning past 4 or 8 years which will never happen as it has to line up with the term of a president which is all the country can plan for nowdays. Not mentioned below, a lot of the companies that can build and maintain power plants are also the same ones that build chemical plants and refineries. Well since the oil industry appears to be on the block if you decide to build a new power plant shit takes time. Once a business or industry goes under you can't flip a switch and magically the next day have a staff of people with experience from office workers to shop workers and people in the field.

My VERY VERY LONG rant on power supplies in TX since it's in the news. How I get into this stuff no idea. Where I lived was on co-op power and they did ok so far, same for the one north of there. There's only a few left. In case you haven't noticed I write a LOT when I'm up hurting.

Power is under a tremendous amount of pressure from a thousand different angles.

Exxon in BR sells its excess power back to the grid. They generate power using a HRSG (Heat Recovery Steam Generator) to recover power from all the steam they produce that runs everything and the steam off the cooling stuff. The industry that makes HRSG also makes tubrines use in natural gas power plants. That entire industry has left the country. For those in the petrochemical industry they normally require US rolled steel. The steel is bought and shipped to Corpus Christi and shipped to places like the Phillipines. Fabricated and shipped back to the US. Then reall really long giant multi trailers long semis hault it to be installed. I toured a place that did it in Thailand as a stop on the way back from Tokyo. They literally weld in shorts, short sleeves, and flip flops. OSHA has never been heard of. But it's cheaper to send off around the world and ship it back.

The place I worked at in San Antonio (precipitators and such for the coal industry) had OSHA lock our gate till we installed forced air respirators for our welders on high nickel content steel. San Antonio not the coolest place in the world. But in the shade with fans in the shop it's bearable. Add leather welding suit AND a respirator that seals off your head....we tried cooling suits and instead we had two shops adjacent to each other. The welders switched off daily welding where they needed the respirators and where they didn't to keep from dwindling away from weight loss. It all adds up.

Southern company built a new experimental clean coal plant in north MS that was to feed Memphis and such. Initial cost $1 Billion. Regulations and l/being dragged out to meet them eventually final cost was $7 billion. The plant was 100% finished, ready to fire. New regulations and a fight over who would pay it, been sitting idle now for 7 years and Southern Company moved on. We did the steel.

Southern company is now finishing two nuclear reators expansion on an existing coal plant. As far as I know (and I'm not 100% sure) no other permits for a new nuclear reactor are applied for. Shaw had one, possibly two but they pulled them then sold their nuclear division to Toshiba when they sold out to Chicago Bridge and Iron.

In northeast TX there's a coal plant that uses strip mining to extract coal. They built a lake that Texas Parks and Wildlife turned into a state park. The plant has gone downhill due to regulations, age and not knowing how much a future is ahead so why spend on maintenance over the last 10 years. I sat in on a public "discussion" and the company made it quite clear. If they were forced to shut down they would fill in the lake and just leave. This plant also feeds part of Dallas and possibly where a friend of mine lives that has gone withouth power for days. I got in on the reclemation of land part while working for the US Forest Service.

The UK built multiple pellet mills in GA and MS. They buy timber and produce wood pellets out of it. The ones in Gloster, MS are shipped to Baton Rouge. Cross the new bridge and on the Port Allen side just north of the bridge is a giant dome. It's used to store the pellets. Then they are loaded on a freighter and shipped to England. They burn the wood in their old coal plants for power. They plant trees in the US and cut them down at 7 years of age. One after another after another. It's raping the land so the UK can't get away from burning coal. I got in this one from the forestry end and the building of the pellet mills.

Just outside Houston is one of the largest coal plant polluters in the US only behind one in PA I think. US taxpayers (EPA) paid for $1 Billion carbon capture expansion. I was PM/PC on this and why I went to Tokyo as Misubishi Heavy Industries were the engineers. It required 30m long beams (100 feet give or take). Those had to be imported from Japan as the US no longer rolls beams that long. The carbon capture last 5ish years and was shut down. To break even the liquid they used to capture the carbon was pumped into the ground. Then it was sold to hydraulic frackers that needed it and it sequestered the carbon below ground. Fracking pressure is mounting and the lockdown killed that off. So they could no longer continue the carbon capture on the plant. Also meaning it would no longer pass emissions.

Can't make this stuff up. I wish I was. I never wanted in on any of this crap. I literally just wanted to sit on my computer and draw little lines.
But it all adds up, death by a 1,000 cuts. These are just the ones I've dealt with and am familiar with. Someone with knowlege I'm sure knows much much more.

Only 3 companies in the US still build the large steel plate structures used for coal plant pollution control. Precipitators and such. One outside Pensacola which I worked for. They took a massive hit cause their big customer was the paper mill industry. Canada killed some of that off, and demand dropped a lot so they are seriously scaled back in thier ability.

One in Anacortes, WA which I worked for. Their biggest customer was a refinery which is closing down. That and their staff is killing themselces with heroin.

One just outside San Antonio. They are merging/moving together with their sister company in Waco which is 100% dependent on the petrochemical industry. We'll see how that goes but does't look good.
 
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Borzak

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Heat wave now. Went out and smoked a cigar. Had to come in and pee twice the ice and snow melting louder than a 2" rain storm.
 

Guurn

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That's about my favorite weather. Snow on the ground and warm enough not to wear a coat. It's awesome.