World of Warcraft: Current Year

Top alliance 10 man guild on my server, been playing since vanilla beta...not veteran enough for WoD beta.

Meanwhile my friend who is a wrath baby and a terrible hunter gets an invite and she doesn't know the first thing about testing.

Just not veteran enough guys, sorry I can't give you any firsthand beta info.

Ao-_sl said:

Cloak is 616 fully upgraded...

Click to expand...

Derp, yeah it is. Was 608 forever in my mind!

Ao-_sl said:

Not sure if I posted this before or not.... but in the last pug I was in I got a bit bored waiting for some people to come back, so I checked out the list of people in the blizzard raid tool and almost all of the tanks had posted "looking for garrosh only" for flex 4. I get that, but is clearing the other fights that much of a pain in the ass?

Click to expand...

They've probably already killed the other 2 bosses and had a raid die off on Garrosh. Plus there are always tons of raids stuck on Garrosh to choose from. By Sunday, that's all that is left.

A lot of people keep Garrosh locks on alts and stuff just for the sole purpose of farming heirlooms. You see a lot of farm runs on Sunday and Monday on openraid.us

Bruman_sl said:

As has been kinda brought up before - all about supply and demand. The expansion is old, the content is old. Geared folks can be picky, they don't want to deal with newbies anymore, and simply put, they can be. Tanks especially are always high in demand, so they can be super picky.

Granted, you'll get some of this stuff no matter what point the expansion is in, but it just becomes more and more common as time goes on. People want someone to let them in at a reasonable iLevel, let them learn the fights, but once they know it, they don't want to suffer through that ever again. Just human nature. The only good solution to that is joining a raiding guild - but of course most progression oriented guilds have died out or are on hiatus at this point.

Click to expand...

Also, a lot of groups single tank it so you may get kicked as a tank.

Palum_sl said:

Also, a lot of groups single tank it so you may get kicked as a tank.

Click to expand...

Thats why its not out of the question to work on a DPS set as you go. No reason that a tank shouldnt have a DPS set. If my partner tank wanted to do thok solo, then by all means... have fun with that crazy random rang rang shit - Ill dps and be happy.

Ao-_sl said:

Not sure if I posted this before or not.... but in the last pug I was in I got a bit bored waiting for some people to come back, so I checked out the list of people in the blizzard raid tool and almost all of the tanks had posted "looking for garrosh only" for flex 4. I get that, but is clearing the other fights that much of a pain in the ass?

Click to expand...

Dealing with pug DPS is always painful. They're trying to minimize their exposure to it. I play a tank and at a mere ilvl 542 I am already beating half the pug DPS that joins these raids at dps while tanking.

While still generous, the enrage timers and mechanics in flex are such that there's no way you can compensate for your DPS pulling only an average of 80k per player. 130k gets you top DPS in the majority of flex raids, it's terrible. They know 4/5 flex groups can't kill Garrosh regardless due to no DPS, why would they want to sit through several bosses they don't need just to fail at the end.

Xequecal_sl said:

Dealing with pug DPS is always painful. They're trying to minimize their exposure to it. I play a tank and at a mere ilvl 542 I am already beating half the pug DPS that joins these raids at dps while tanking.

Click to expand...

Man I've seen the worst since I started running ToT LFR on my warrior tank for secrets. It was my first time as a tank in ToT and I still ended up in the top 10 dps.
Also had the proverbial huntard that pulls the boss before anyone did a readycheck and while people are still running / buffing.

543 currently and I hope to get into normals once I break 550 on him. No chance on my 563 warlock. Just too low for a DPS. Need 583 and 14/14H multikill XP.

My server - Blackhand EU - got merged today. There was a list of about 10 other servers below it so if all of those get merged into one I wonder how long the queue will be. Alliance population was nonexistant on Blackhand-EU though, maybe that will fresh things up a bit. Not that I'd mind, I play Horde.

The design of Vengeance throws off how well you are judged as a tank. Since you do really well in DPS, it gives everyone the false sense that you're a good tank. When the skills that are important to judge a tank by are easily over looked.

I can get into a big rant about DPS/Healers, cloaks and SoO not being designed around cloaks - But just take it this way, you dont need the cloak as a Tank to do well, they do. You would be surprised at how much lower DPS can be on Garrosh and still secure a win.

Daidraco_sl said:

The design of Vengeance throws off how well you are judged as a tank. Since you do really well in DPS, it gives everyone the false sense that you're a good tank. When the skills that are important to judge a tank by are easily over looked.

I can get into a big rant about DPS/Healers, cloaks and SoO not being designed around cloaks - But just take it this way, you dont need the cloak as a Tank to do well, they do. You would be surprised at how much lower DPS can be on Garrosh and still secure a win.

Click to expand...

I get that... but the cloak will push iLvl up by a fair bit.
And of course positioning and knowing when to use a cooldown is much more important than "guiz look my deeps is so l33t" ... at least I hope so. I'm always trying to be the best tank I can be. When I started tanking I had "tanking anxiety", made sure to know the fights well enough, talked to the other tank to make sure we're on the same page concerning when to swap etc.

Bruman_sl said:

Sorry, SoO normal runs now require 14/14 H.

Click to expand...

It's funny because when I was chilling in the lower ilvls, getting a garrosh kill seemed stupidly hard and all the groups were full of terrible players who wouldn't do the most basic shit. Now that I'm ~570 I just click the highest ilvl requirement on oqueue and we melt him down with almost no effort. Gotta kill garrosh to start killin garrosh.

It is an interesting dynamic that WoW has versus some other titles (notably Everquest and Everquest 2); that by the end of a given expansion everything is on 'melt' status. For other games the previous expansion content remains somewhat to quite challenging and lower guilds continue to progress through the old content boosted by the expansion power increase. I wonder if the existence of a cyclical stage of complete and utter raw devastation keeps players around? I will say that logging into dungeons currently on WoW Live is a very cathartic, if extremely brief, experience.

Can't compare the 2 since raids were non-instanced in EQ1. Starving the lower guilds = shittier gear = harder time doing content. I can attest to the fact that raids were EZ melt mode in EQ1 once people got geared...I mean shit, we got so bored we let a ranger tank NToV bosses once ;p

Ronaan_sl said:

Man I've seen the worst since I started running ToT LFR on my warrior tank for secrets. It was my first time as a tank in ToT and I still ended up in the top 10 dps.
Also had the proverbial huntard that pulls the boss before anyone did a readycheck and while people are still running / buffing.

543 currently and I hope to get into normals once I break 550 on him. No chance on my 563 warlock. Just too low for a DPS. Need 583 and 14/14H multikill XP.

My server - Blackhand EU - got merged today. There was a list of about 10 other servers below it so if all of those get merged into one I wonder how long the queue will be. Alliance population was nonexistant on Blackhand-EU though, maybe that will fresh things up a bit. Not that I'd mind, I play Horde.

Click to expand...

Lol, dude, you're running ToT LFR at iLevel 543. I'd hope you're in the top 10 DPS, even as a tank. A lot of people in ToT LFR are going to be alts that are unlocking later raids and people that never go past SoO LFR. That's not "the worst". You're just outgearing the hell out of it. Purely LFR geared people are going to barely be above 528 (takes a lot of valor upgrades to move past that).

eh, moving to Stormrage I think. I used to be all about pvp servers but world pvp is basically just level 90s ganking me at level 30 so lmao, I'm not playing with any friends anyways.

That said I'll miss my goldcapped druid and I'm too much of a jew to xfer it.

Bruman_sl said:

Lol, dude, you're running ToT LFR at iLevel 543. I'd hope you're in the top 10 DPS, even as a tank. A lot of people in ToT LFR are going to be alts that are unlocking later raids and people that never go past SoO LFR. That's not "the worst". You're just outgearing the hell out of it. Purely LFR geared people are going to barely be above 528 (takes a lot of valor upgrades to move past that).

Click to expand...

Oh "The worst" wasn't in regards to DPS really... it was because of people. The hunter that pulled bosses was 520+ for example. I really misworded that.

Those alts unlocking later raids also applies to me. Gotta unlock all wings eventually, might as well do it while stuff for the cloak drops.

Anyway, having fun, that's all that counts, right?

xzi_sl said:

eh, moving to Stormrage I think. I used to be all about pvp servers but world pvp is basically just level 90s ganking me at level 30 so lmao, I'm not playing with any friends anyways.

That said I'll miss my goldcapped druid and I'm too much of a jew to xfer it.

Click to expand...

Scout economy on server you moving to, buy something that you can resell to recoup costs, ez gold xfer

Ronaan_sl said:

Oh "The worst" wasn't in regards to DPS really... it was because of people. The hunter that pulled bosses was 520+ for example. I really misworded that.

Those alts unlocking later raids also applies to me. Gotta unlock all wings eventually, might as well do it while stuff for the cloak drops.

Anyway, having fun, that's all that counts, right?

Click to expand...

Ah gotcha - yeah, the huntard shit surprises noone, heh. We had a guy do that twice in one LFR and he got kicked. There's definitely some terrible players (nothing to do with gear) in LFR. Sometimes you get great runs though. Sometimes it makes no sense - last week I got thrown in at Garrosh (they hadn't pulled yet). Worst Garrosh attempt I've ever seen. The tank had them running around. DPS all puddled up behind the tank. Me and maybe 2 other people were killing the desecrated weapons. The left engineer guy didn't get killed in time. Someone kept yelling BUT WE HAVE NOONE ON THE RIGHT ENGI!!!!. Noone killed the wolf rider guy at all. It was an absolute cluster fuck.

Then I put some raid instructions in CAPSLOCK, and gave more CAPSLOCK instructions during the fight as adds / weapons came out, and he died. /shrug .

Some LFR terribleness is just..well, some people are terrible. Sometimes people just need a tiny bit of instruction and they go well. At least in LFR that is - as long as a decent amount of people are listening, bosses will die. There's always some jackass attacking Nazgrim during defensive, and there always will be (in LFR that is).

As a very casual player, I always appreciate when someone steps up and gives some brief instructions on the fight. I'll generally ask if no one does, but it seems like in most LFRs people don't ask (either out of not caring or shame) and people who DO know the fight get frustrated when Johnny casual doesn't stack during a certain phase or whatever.

I was in a flex norushen where they all stacked in one spot and didn't move out of the beam (two dead instantly), and I was the only person who clicked a yellow orb. He enraged. This was after immersius was seconds away from enrage due to several dps dying to the first swirl and, amazingly, a fairly smooth protectors with only one inferno blast suicide. Absolutely amazing.

Oh, and I walked in at 515/110k dps and walked out with a 540 fist and dagger. So you just never fucking know, heh. Now my rogue can do 150k+ autoattacking and kill anything in flex but nobody will know based on my ilevel and the "pug curve." (take potential dps, reduce by 75%)

Also, I learned that it's impossible to track Malk smashes as a rogue if no one is marking - once you kililng spree, you lose all orientation. But who gives a shit because COS negates it, hah. Only melee to live. Oh, and it didn't help that he was moving him all around during blood rage. Cheat death triggered on both. Rogue power.