Elerion
N00b
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World of Warcraft: Current Year
- Thread starter hodj
- Start date
Vulg
Golden Knight of the Realm
- 245
- 173
How is "stretching out content longer than ever before" consistent with the comparison to T14 vs. T17?
You're absolutely right, T14 had 16 bosses, T17 has 17. T14 stretched over the holidays, as does T17. Will, Empress and Sha released on the each other's heels, just like Impregnator and Blackhand are about to.
So the only way your claim makes sense is if they dramatically shorten their xpac lifecycle or jam more raid content into the same ~2 year period.
Given their track record, I'd lean heavily towards them screwing up the pacing again, but we'll see.
Gorehack
Lord Nagafen Raider
- 1,534
- 40
Well it's ain't as much as prot pallies were doing...but it was an 8k buff to my prot dps.
Last week Heroic Butcher
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
This week Heroic Butcher
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
Hah, just noticed I did exactly 8k higher on Twin Ogron heroic too. Only 4k difference on Mythic though. Dat whirlwind.
Last week Heroic Butcher
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
This week Heroic Butcher
Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft
Hah, just noticed I did exactly 8k higher on Twin Ogron heroic too. Only 4k difference on Mythic though. Dat whirlwind.
Ukerric
Bearded Ape
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Which is funny, because they're preparing for 6.1 PTR. PTR lasts 6 to 8 weeks, so that means 6.1 (and presumably the Iron Dock raid) should hit just after the last LFR boss.
Dandai
<WoW Guild Officer>
- 5,907
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MSV opened October 2, 2012
HoF opened October 30, 2012
ToES opened Nov 13, 2012
Final LFR opened Nov 20, 2012
So the entire raid tier, all difficulties, was opened up in 7 weeks.
We have 8 weeks alone between Normal Highmaul and Normal Foundry, with all difficulties (all bosses), taking 16 weeks to open up.
16 > 7 = "stretching out content longer than ever before"
Qhue
Tranny Chaser
- 7,480
- 4,424
By the end of BaRF Blackhand will presumably be dead so that is him and Kargath killed off in raids plus Garrosh finally biting it before the end of the levelling story.
That still leaves Ner'Zhul (he gets defeated in Shadowmoon Burial Ground but doesn't seem to actually die), Gul'Dan, Kilrogg and Grom Hellscream.
I'm guessing that we take out Kilrogg whenever Tanaan Jungle opens up for daily / Garrsion questing at the end of a multi-week event ala the Pandaria Islands. Grom probably gets taken out like a bitch before it leads into the final raid tier which involves Gul'Dan and the Burning Legion. The conclusion of that content will have an epilogue about the impending Big Battle that requires everyone to journey to Argus and take on the Legion directly, probably involving Wrathion showing up for some exposition pointing to the next expansion...
But they will make another plot-pivot and instead the next expansion will be about Dwarves to prove they can do more than just Orcs (oh and Dark Iron Dwarves will become a Horde race while Alliance get High Elves)
That still leaves Ner'Zhul (he gets defeated in Shadowmoon Burial Ground but doesn't seem to actually die), Gul'Dan, Kilrogg and Grom Hellscream.
I'm guessing that we take out Kilrogg whenever Tanaan Jungle opens up for daily / Garrsion questing at the end of a multi-week event ala the Pandaria Islands. Grom probably gets taken out like a bitch before it leads into the final raid tier which involves Gul'Dan and the Burning Legion. The conclusion of that content will have an epilogue about the impending Big Battle that requires everyone to journey to Argus and take on the Legion directly, probably involving Wrathion showing up for some exposition pointing to the next expansion...
But they will make another plot-pivot and instead the next expansion will be about Dwarves to prove they can do more than just Orcs (oh and Dark Iron Dwarves will become a Horde race while Alliance get High Elves)
Eidal
Molten Core Raider
- 2,001
- 213
Mind if I ask why you're using Mastery? All the theorycraft I read indicates Crit is better for us at this ilvl for both dps (obviously) and mitigation (via parry). I'll grab a fresh log soon and throw it on warcraft logs, but it looks like you're substantially better geared than me but doing only 20 percent more DPS (you have a 670 1h and I have a 645) and actually taking more damage.
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How is crit the obvious choice for DPS when mastery increases AP by quite a bit? The stat priorities I've seen rank mastery = crit for DPS even considering the free hero strikes you get. Is there a breaking point here where Crit becomes > to mastery?
Do you have a link to said theorycrafting? I wanna see the math behind crit > Mastery for mitigation. I don't doubt it, but it's not what I've read so far and i'm curious.
Eidal
Molten Core Raider
- 2,001
- 213
I'm not sure, actually, how the math works for DPS... but for mitigation: the gist of it is that maximum mitigation is achieved by increasing parry and block at the same rate. However, we have no means of increasing parry aside from CS... AND, Warriors spend a substantial amount of time with hugely increased block via our active. So -- max mitigation is achieved by increasing Parry via CS as we can.
[6.0.3] Protection - The Dauntless Sentinel - Warrior - Icy Veins Forums
This guy seems like he knows what he is talking about. I doubt there is a substantial difference for overall tanking ability, but I feel like at 19 percent unbuffed crit (+1535) that I absolutely demolish prot warriors of similiar ilvl.
Eidal 661 Ilvl: 24.6% Mastery, +927 // 19% Crit, +1535
Gorehack 677 Ilvl: 26.6% Mastery, +1071 // 12% Crit, +768
Eidal:Combat Log - Ask Mr. Robot - World of Warcraft(114k TMI // 81k Effective TMI)
Gorehack:Warcraft Logs - Combat Analysis for Warcraft(146k TMI // 82k Effective TMI)
This may be explained by AMR/Warcraftlog parsing discrepency, so I'll try to get logs up on Warcraftlogs to make a better comparison.
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This is heroic or Mythic? Cause shit hits harder in heroic the more people you have in there, could be part of the discrepancy if you run a 10 man and he runs a 30. Log sites are blocked from work so I have no idea what your raid comp is, fight length, number of people etc.
A lot of factors at play here if you want to side by side damage taken on 2 tanks.
A lot of factors at play here if you want to side by side damage taken on 2 tanks.
Eidal
Molten Core Raider
- 2,001
- 213
Ahh, yea, raid size is not even remotely similar (23 to 11). Are you certain that boss damage output scales with amount of people? I understand raid-wide healing requirement is higher but I didn't know that the Butcher would actually hit the tanks harder.
bixxby
Molten Core Raider
- 2,750
- 47
Wrathion becomes the lich king and is the new big bad. We ain't ever going to Argus.
Gorehack
Lord Nagafen Raider
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According to the log....the average hit for his raid size is 10,332...mine is 37,340. My fight was also 50 seconds shorter.
Anyway, I kind of mix and match where I choose to take my information from on warrior tanking. My favorite resource isWoD Protection Warrior Guidefrom Grafarion in Method.
He makes the statement on page 2: "Stat priorities are a tricky thing currently. After bonus armor there are two schools of thought, one which rates mastery above crit and another that rates crit above mastery. Both options are completely viable. Empirically in a vacuum crit gives slightly higher total physical damage reduction however because of masteries interaction with shield block and the nature of encounters/tank assignments/strategy mastery can perform quite well. Many also believe with how low warrior damage is relative to other tanks skewing towards crit may prop your DPS up slightly. Unless the damage is elemental, periodic, or un-avoidable/blockable I would not rate versatility above either. "
Also, your gear is better itemized than mine. I am a lazy fuck though, so I take the 645 to 685 upgrade ever time even if the stacks suck. You have 8% more crit than I do, I have 8% more haste...etc etc etc.
Little hard for us to compare on anything other than mythic though. Raid size fucks with everything. We'll be able to get a better feel for how mastery plays out with crit after people get more into number crunching after the buff to damage we had on Monday though. That and the stats on raid gear won't suck so much dick.
Eidal
Molten Core Raider
- 2,001
- 213
I saw the same thing and I'm wondering if its AMR reporting this incorrectly. I went perusing through AMR for prot warriors in 20+ man raid but the numbers are all over the place; hard to tell what they're doing with their active mitigation. I'm seeing a LOT of tanks taking a drastically different amount of damage from Heavy Handed / Melee which indicates they aren't using AM when they aren't the target... which is wrong.
Gonna read that guide you linked now.
Gorehack
Lord Nagafen Raider
- 1,534
- 40
Also to be fair, on our heroic clears save for Ko'Ragh and Imperator I was going for pretty much maximum dps spam and only hitting defensives when I felt like I needed to. We outgear that shit so much it really doesn't matter. Which is probably part of the reason why my damage taken was so high. You used 23 defensive abilities on H Butcher and I used 6...4 if you don't include enraged regen.
We try to cram as many people (including friends and fam) into heroic as possible to increase the loot drops per boss.