XCOM 2

Yeah it would take a lot of time and elerium cores to get that many shredstorm cannons, I finished my game with 2 so I did 2 shredstorms until I started fielding a third war suit which was usually equipped with a blaster launcher.

TJT_sl said:

How did you manage 5 shredder cannons? Elerium Cores do come a lot slower and I've had to ration them pretty siginificantly. I stopped making heavy weapons after I kept getting fucking flamethrowers. I have 2 EXO, 1 WAR, 1 Wraith, 1 Spider and that's been fine the whole game for me.

Also: Exo/WAr suits look so fucking stupid. I don't get why 20 years later the tech used actually went down from what it was. The Lore note even said they designed the spider based off of prototypes from the old XCOM base they found.

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Leader ability for loot don't kill with explosives and a little luck, I think black market had a cache of them for intel but that may have been a "loot" mission.

In proving I only do experimental ammo--Ammo and Experimental armor (After you get predator) always return something extremely useful, I'll do experimental heavy only if I have a lot of extra cores (By the time you can do heavy weapons, you need cores for armor. =-/). Some grenades and heavy weapons are very powerful, but there are also mediocre things mixed in (Side grades from your base item). The worst upgrade from experimental ammo you can get early game is AP rounds (Bypass armor) but that's only because there are few armored enemies early--late game those rounds becomeverypowerful. However, tracer rounds, poison rounds, blue screen rounds, dragon rounds, Reaper rounds (On a ranger or sniper holy shit)? Allridiculouslypowerful.

I will say though that proving grounds tends to be better if you start in Asia, GTS tends to be better if you start in the U.S. The extra slot from Asia means you don't have to choose between grenades and special ammo, while the U.S. start allows you quick buy the GTS upgrades. (I really love how the start locations affect build order.)

Also, workshops I'm convinced are the most powerful mid game facility. They double 2 engineers to 4. Don't worry about building them in the center to make them adjacent to everything, just make sure they are adjacent to power and radio communications (Since both those can have 2 engineers each) or adjacent to one of those plus two other one engineer facilities. So you can have 2 engineers run those facilities at max, it takes a huge amount of pressure off your engineering pool. ALSO, work shop gremlins can excavate the spot below them; so even if you don't need your comms/power fully staffed right away, you can send them down to the third floor to dig it up for the first month the workshop is online. (So always build the workshop on the second floor.)

But all this goes out the window on legendary. I understand now why Beagle needed to do GTS/AWC and put off proving grounds. Your guys have one less HP, and the tolerance for grave wounded is lower AND the timers on wounds are 50% higher. Which means if they are hit at all, they are usually injured for 25-45 days.

However, that being said, it doesn't matter when you get AWC in terms of extra abilities. I found out your soldier gets his "extra" perk rolled the moment he levels the first time (You just don't get to use it until the AWC is built). The AWC gives it to him whenever he levels while the AWC is active, if he's reached the level where that ability can be given (So even as an extra the abilities are level locked.) So it isn't like Iron Will from the old game, you don't miss out if you didn't level up fully with an AWC active.

It's an ability sectoids have to create psi zombies, never knew it works on your own dead since I haven't had someone die. Working on a mimic beacon is pretty damn funny though.

Hatorade_sl said:

Leader ability for loot don't kill with explosives and a little luck, I think black market had a cache of them for intel but that may have been a "loot" mission.

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And the GTS vulture ability, an extra piece of loot every time really adds up, always has a chance to be a core.

Tenks_sl said:

When you guys get guerrilla ops missions which rewards do you generally lean towards? Originally I was doing either eng or sci depending on my count but I'm starting to think the supply rewards would be quite beneficial as well. The mission reward basically pays for a class of magnetic weapons for your squad.

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It really depends, purely on what you have built and your needs. If I've got a workshop, I'll sometimes forgo engineers for an extra scientist or supplies. Early game really pushes you to put off radio comms for a while, so mid game you are very often supply locked on upgrades, and you can't sell anything because you need bodies for upgrades. So early mid game if I've got a workshop and 3 scientists already, I start grabbing up supplies for a little bit and then go back to engineers. But yeah, supplies are a very viable choice, it isn't like EW, mid game. Early game it is engineers all the way unless there is an engineer you can buy from resistance HQ for less than 200 (Always check there, if that's the case, grab the supplies and buy the engineer.)

Do you ever buy sci/eng from the black market? Or is intel too important?

Tenks_sl said:

Do you ever buy sci/eng from the black market? Or is intel too important?

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It depends...If you think you'll have radio towers built, and areas to open that month (Or the next month), then no, the intel is too valuable. If not, because your radio comms are still a few weeks from being built and you need to set up towers, I'd take the gamble for an extra engineer early game. Not for a scientist unless I really got shit on by the RNG and don't have my second by that time. Otherwise, unlocking as the geoscape asap is more important because it will get you supplies and over the months you'll get more scientists/engineers that way. (The only reason I might take it for an engineer is actually because you need them to staff power/comms, to unlock the geoscape faster. heh.)

So, in a pinch I would. But if I felt somewhat comfortable, no. (This also does change on legendary, research times are doubled, scientists become a lot more valuable then, as valuable as engineering, since the Aliens roll in with their upgrades nearly as fast. That said, I'm doing Commander/Ironman to enjoy a play through before that ball busting again.)

TJT_sl said:

You've never had a dude die?

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I was still feeling the game out on normal. or whatever normal is called in this one and I played pretty conservatively. Plus I always took two grenadiers and plenty of shred so when I did activate more than one pod it wasn't very dangerous.

Long War Iron Man drills into your head the importance of not activating extra pods when it can be avoided.

Gavinmad_sl said:

Psi-Ops absolutely do not need to be nerfed considering how long it takes to train one, the fact that you can't use them during that long training process...

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You know you can take them out on missions while they are training and no progress is lost, right?

EDIT: After the initial period for training the first skill (Soul Fire)

No, I didn't know that. Granted, they still won't be very useful until they've unlocked the right powers which you can't control the order of, but yeah that definitely changes things. I assume leadership training is the same way. Yeah that changes things significantly, especially if you get the more desirable powers unlocked early on.

Lithose_sl said:

I will say though that proving grounds tends to be better if you start in Asia, GTS tends to be better if you start in the U.S. The extra slot from Asia means you don't have to choose between grenades and special ammo, while the U.S. start allows you quick buy the GTS upgrades. (I really love how the start locations affect build order.)

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Didn't know this until recently, but the continent bonuses are randomized and choose from a list of 14 or so, fromthis thread;

#01- Spy Ring ......................... ** (+25% for Intel rewards)
#02- Hidden Reserves ............... ** (+5 Power for the Avenger)
#03- To Serve Mankind ............. ** (Recruits only cost +10 Supplies)
#04- Lock and Load .................. ** (PCS & Weapon Upgrades may be re-used)
#05- Pursuit of Knowledge ......... ** (+20% discovery speed if you have a Research Lab facility)
#06- Spare Parts ...................... ** (-50% costs for all "Proving Grounds" projects)
#07- Armed to the Teeth ........... ** (All primary weapons gain an additional upgrade slot)
#08- Under the Table ............... ** (Black Market pays 33% more for items)
#09- Suit up! .......................... ** (All Armor & Vest experimental projects finish instantly)
#10- All In ............................... ** (Resistance sends 20% more resources)
#11- Quid Pro Quo .................... ** (Black Market Items cost 25% less Intel)
#12- Fire When Ready ............... ** (All Ammo, Grenade, and Weapon experimental finish instantly)
#13- Future Combat ................. ** (All GTS Tactic costs reduced by 50%)
#14- Helping Hand ................... ** (Workshops provide an additional Engineer when built)

See I thought the bonuses didn't look the same on my second playthrough, but my first one didn't get very far so I wasn't sure.

and yeah, I got armed to the teeth early on in my successful campaign and that third upgrade slot makes quite a bit of difference. Looks like that's the only bonus that directly affects combat too, the rest is all strategic layer stuff.

Gavinmad_sl said:

No, I didn't know that. Granted, they still won't be very useful until they've unlocked the right powers which you can't control the order of, but yeah that definitely changes things. I assume leadership training is the same way. Yeah that changes things significantly, especially if you get the more desirable powers unlocked early on.

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Yeah, the order is really the important part and sadly that is still a crap shoot. Can work in your favor though - I thought I had shot myself in the foot when I built the Psi Lab early on, but my first Psi Operative came out of the tank with Domination, Null Lance, Stasis, and Inspire in less than 2 months. I have a second one training now that got Domination on the first roll. I was running Ranger (Phantom), 2x Specialist, 2x Gunner, Sharpshooter (Sniper) on most missions and then replaced the 2nd Specialist with a Psi Op, may replace the 2nd Gunner with another Psi Op if the training works out.

Psi Op is the one class I would definitely recommend using the SMG on, since you spend almost no time shooting and the +3 mobility can put you in a position to save your team or yourself more easily.

Yeah I figured they were randomized since my first and second playthrough I started in NA and the bonus was different for the two. So I just assumed it drew the bonuses at random.

What I really like about this game is it plays very much like a tabletop boardgame. I could actually see it converted to being tabletop. It may actually be fun. Especially if you fleshed out the alien side and made it a 1v1 board game and the Aliens acted kind of like DM but had their own upgrade paths as well.

So, in EU I loved the combat but hated the strategic layer so much that it turned me off playing the game entirely. Any significant changes here or is 2 just more of the same in that regard?

It's not a facelift it's a transplant. This is what the Alien geoscape looked like during EU.