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Still think VG had incredible world design, the different environments and areas were all very interesting and there were so many opportunities for leveling/content and it wasn't a "line em up and knock them down" design... it felt real and it felt like a world, with some danger and not...

Well shit, he is the only one in the last what 10 years that has designed and actually went live with such an animal... yes the animal was a bit wounded, but no other game has even freakin tried.... so ya... perhaps that is where it comes from or ? or perhaps the market is so saturated with the...

Vanguard had a rough implementation for sure, however I have not seen an MMO with better dungeons, world design, classes. ( crafting almost but swg wins that for me ) since well do the math.... But yes the stairs sucked ! and yes the Bloodmage was my favorite class, of all time in ANY MMO so...

want: Vanguard classes - unique, all different gameplay styles, all add something to a grp ( buffs, util, CC, heals ) other than DPS Vanguard combat with better animations Group based pvp ( like eq2 where tanks are tanks ) Group based content either ALL or a high percentage. Content be...

Some will learn eventually. You can't expect newer gamers to know the old ways all they see is the 30 day MMO slot machine experience that was introduced by all the non gamer suits who were going after casuals and numbers. But even those casuals will want something deeper someday. The good...

The last 2 times in the last say 6 years or so I said i will play X game over and over to the death because it is so worth my time ( even with flaws ) were: 1. Skyrim to this day 2 Vanguard on and off from launch just sayin.

pretty standard mechanism get there once you are set.

thanks for update !

/agree

Interesting you mention SWG here because SWG had some of the best socialization of any MMO just because of the non combat things they had ( doc buffs, entertainer buffs, crafting, towns etc, early jedi etc etc. )... Some combat socialization however ( grouping some dungeons, raids, and bounty...

people will always go with the easy path and if solo is it ( which it has been ) that's where most people go. Even as an outgoing and "social" person there is not much of a community created if most of the players are not socializing you know.

This conversation has been had 1000 times over.. games have changed and this is a thread on socialization I thought and I was talking about ways to return socialization to MMOs. Do you have any ideas or are you just claiming that we don't need to make a change. Stop the personal attacking and...

Let's hope by then something comes along other than WoW that can change folks minds

Bullshit. What the fuck do you talk about with guildmates when most MMOs today are solo experiences 90% of the way? My point was I like talking about game mechanics with people of all backgrounds and in the past this was a necessity to complete content... even trash mobs took teamwork...Duh...

Chaos makes sense in a world for sure ! /signed

Interestingly this is what i originally liked about MMOs. I would spend time with people I normally wouldn't yet all the socialization was channeled around gameplay and mechanics and server drama ( for the most part )... I think now games are so simplistic and so few require socialization so...

There was something special about teamwork in online games from grouping to raiding... I enjoyed that socialization and the community that developed around it. The current model has removed that completely in part due to the conveniences you seem to cherish... I get it and I like games where I...

Levels do not bother me as long as they are eventful... what do i mean ? Leveling rapid fire with no new abilities and character progression sucks. I want old school LONG ass levels with meaningful leveling points. i.e. in vangaurd there are no talent points, just stats you allocate which was...

yes sir... must have this gap in market filled... then laugh when it is doing better than eqnext... oops let cat out of bag. j/k

Yes, i was referring to the mouseover of this thread in the thread list... and yes i always laugh when i hear/see that.

We don't need them.... we can have our niche MMO and they can have the rest... its not like we are looking for 2 old school MMOs with modern tech, just 1.

Every time I go back to this thread i wonder "will there still be poopsocking ?"

Vanguard had it right ( solo vs group ). All of the premium content that you had to see was group, yet the leveling curve early on was such that soloing or duoing during times in between was great to have. Point is, no one considered soloing to cap in vanguard because well all of the best...

Been true of late !

There is a market gap currently, its not black and white. Once publishers milk the casual crowd and numbers stop climbing ( and they will ) they will have to do something else and I think you will see complexity come back in some ways.

This quote could not be more wrong... EQ2 had contested content through raiding and both solo and group content and from a PVP perspective it was amazing experience. Sure there were your occasional A-holes but pvp was the great equalizer for that ( bounties on players etc ). This also promotes...

Exactly, gear score and instant dungeons accross realms do not promote socialization in my opinion... in the past reputation from grouping got you invites.. and reputation is based on socialization..

I don't think WoW killed it honestly. The WoW clones did. In vanilla i remember standing in ironforge selling enchantments ! And there was quite a bit of socialization in Vanilla WoW. That said, it goes way beyond just combat. But yes, group combat by a "combined arms" team if you will is...

I would say any game mechanic that promotes interaction between 2 or more players. Outside of the obvious ( pvp ).

Mind boggling conclusion there... or times have really changed.

So i would like to ask... what games post 2005 have introduced mechanics that promoted social interaction... perhaps we can start there ?

To those observing Trion - Be sure to observe the market as well and be aware of the major MMO releases incoming

perhaps it is time to break down and try the Korean versionAnyone know of english resource packs for it ? I had heard they existed at some point...

Has anyone heard any status on the NA version of this ? Seems Trion has been pretty quiet for 6 months on it.

Off topic, @Draegan have you heard anything about ArchAge NA out of trion ? I have heard nothing in a while...

There is room for both types of games... my complaint is that most MMOs since the 04 era have been designed from a solo centric + Lobby + instance ( pvp or dungeon ) + action oriented design. I like those, they are fun at times but I do miss the staple MMO of a world I just want to be in...

The first raid zone of RIFT was horrible, it was one re-configurable room. The encounters were OK especially greenscale ( the rabbit one I think was rabbit was a gimmick), but the one that made me leave was the 12 man after that, it was terrible.... Because there was a time where skill did...

are any of you playing guilded ? I am wondering if there is a good "returning players guild" most of my chars were in twilight song but i logged in and the guild seemed near death... thoughts ?

That is good to hear about WoW. WOTLK really turned me off with the collect and AE method of doing dungeons and raiding didn't feel much different.

I was in a top raiding guild in RIFT. I am referring to the raid encounters with dodge this and dodge that... most of the "complexity" of RIFT raiding was around dodging or positioning, it had little to do with "i can play my class this well/not".. I left before HK though perhaps they moved away...