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Heh, good point. But I put up Trent Dilfer and his SuperBowl win with the Ravens as a counterpoint. No one will ever compare Dilfer to one of the greats. He was just good enough to not lose games, the rest of the team was responsible for their wins.

Again, I haven't worked in the industry since the late 90s. Everyone I knew well back then was local to San Diego. I probably met some of the people who work at Relic now at some industry things but I don't remember them. I met a lot of people back then I don't keep tabs on.

If he were the only one making the game then it would be an issue. It's a team effort, claiming otherwise is an insult to all the other talent who are also working on the game.

Heh, aye. If the game sucks then I think we all are vindictive assholes. Look at how many of us were burned by SWTOR. There was a pretty huge love fest for that game before it was released.

Lol, so you are saying that STO was a failure all because of one man..... riiiiight. I know that's the line you take in most of your arguments, but it is also the least credible.

What I experienced was very much a team effort. Our successes and failures had more to do with organization than anything else. Good teams produced because they worked well together, had well defined goals and solid management. Which is true in every endeavor.

Only people who are rooting for failure are giggling. Why you want this to fail so much says more about you than TESO.

Doesn't bother me in the least. Mmo's are a team effort. And much like sports teams, it is how the team works together that is important. Individual talent helps, but one person is not the sole cause of success or failure.

Star Trek Online is the only mmo I ever felt ripped off by. And supposedly even it's better now. It is very probable that I will buy TESO, haven't seen any reason not to yet. New mmo releases and leveling up with masses of people around is fun. I'll explore the game and get at least one toon...

Must... resist... temptatio... OOH LOOK! A new shiney! Where is my credit card? == The life of a mmo gamer.

You and Draegan are asking for a solution to a problem the industry doesn't think exists. The vast majority of mmos are hugely profitable, and for the suits that is success. SWTOR is the only recently "released" mmo that was a major disapointment to the stockholders. But apparently even it is...

Oooh.. soo tempting. Had a lot of fun in the first one.

Or actual proof.

I haven't seen anything that states their delivery date is set in stone. Maybe it is, perhaps someone could provide a link? And delivery dates change all the time in the industry. Especially this far out. I'm sure they would rather not change the date, but it can be done. It is also...

Flying mounts would be fine if they were attackable from the ground. Having npc's shooting you down in areas the devs don't want to trivialize and all that. Invisible walls suck.

It's too early to know if their release date is set in stone. In fact, it's way too early to be calling this game the disaster of the century, but I know that won't stop you from railing against TESO with your very unhealthy obsession. Carry on..

Yeah, from the sounds of it they still have a ton of work to do. When is WildStar supposed to release? I'm sure they don't want to step on each others toes.

I'm fine with his info. And watermarks would kill his access. The real test is open beta anyways. That is the only thing that will decide if the game is good or not to me. Not sure why you all are so worked up over something you've never played.

Interesting. If cc is truly resource intensive then that could be an effective way to keep it from overpowering the game. If their PvP RvR is anything like advertised (or even half assed), then it could still be better than the current alternatives. Wish they'd hurry up and test the PvP. This...

Soo.. did the Raptr thing and picked up the expansion. Didn't get the 30 days unfortunately, but decided to mess around with some low level toons to get the swing of things again until F2P. Looks like a lot of people are doing the same thing, plenty of players in the low level zones and the...

Is the game really due in November? I missed that part. Given the state of the game (as much as we know it), that seems a bit early. GW2 this time last year was getting ready for the weekend betas.

The mentality of mmo gamers is changing. F2P use to be a dirty word but now people expect it. There are so many good mmos out that are F2P that it is even effecting WoW's sub numbers. Blizzard has blamed much of their highly publicized million plus sub losses over the last 3 months on the...

That post wasn't directed at you per se, you just were the last one to call TESO a WoW clone. And Draegan I don't have a problem with WoW, I have a problem with hypocrites who say they hate WoW clones and then hump the biggest WoW clone of them all.

LOL, and yet the master of all WoW clones WildStar, gets hand jobs from this board. I really love the hypocrisy here. Actually made me laugh out loud when I read the last few posts. Like I said before, I'll just wait for a playable open beta before I judge. I have very little faith in the...

Yep, I would love a game like that too, and the mmo space could really use another one (modern EQ has eliminated most of the danger). But it would never match classic EQ's experience for me because of it being my first mmorpg. First girlfriend/mmorpg and all that.

Special case with TesoTester. He's not saying anything he didn't say before on BetaCake and I suspect Draegan thinks the entertainment value is worth it.

Same for me, plus an added dimension was that it was all so new. I had never played an rpg of any sort before, never played Dungeons and Dragons, etc. My online computer gaming experience was shooting rocket launchers at other people's avatars. That was glorious but EQ trumped it. So the...

There is tendency for some gaming posters to fill up space with wild accusations, hyperbole and personal attacks. Without posting facts to back up their claims. It really makes threads unreadable after a while. I suspect BetaCake just wants to keep the threads more informative and less cesspool...

Yep. I actually agree UT a lot more than he realizes. It's just he sometimes goes overboard.... way overboard heheh. But that is part of what makes him entertaining, so I try not to protest too much.

Hah, cool, do some shots for me!

Shills definitely exist but I don't think Blackwulf is one, nor is he tesotester. Their writing styles are totally different. Blackwulf just wants the game to succeed, much like many of the fans of WildStar do. That isn't a crime and it doens't make them shills. Your campaign against him or...

Uhh, that really doesn't prove anything. Somebody could have called him on it there or he might read this board. You really are going a bit off the deep end on all of this. You act like they baked your kids in an oven or something. Anyways, carry on. I wish there was something real from TESO...

Yep you nailed, except for the shutting down part. Even crappy mmo's make money and rarely shut down. Even if TESO is a disaster it will still pull in new players because of the IP and keep making money for years to come. It won't get WoW numbers but as all the other mmos have proven, you...

Yeah, I was wondering that too actually. I assumed they were independent, they would lose a lot of cred if they weren't. Then again maybe they are tired of the herd mentality that seems to have taken over in regards to TESO and WildStar. Rationality seems to have been lost in both of those...

Hmm, after reading the comments by the tester and the BetaCake mods, I'm not sure I can agree with UT and the rest of the pilers on. It may be a shill job but they come off as pretty legit. Not sure why BetaCake would want to lie about these things. I don't know whats going on behind the...

Hah, I logged into EQ the other day on one of my low level toons and he was by the chessboard. He's been parked there for years, have no idea why. What a memory trip. Killed a couple skeles while I was there and did bit of running around. Zone didn't age well but for whatever reason it still has...

Mmo's usually lay off a bunch of people after launch. It's a gypsy lifestyle.

Pretty much. I think the issue you are having is not understanding that while most of us may call mmos mediocre and uninspired, we still find them to be much better entertainment than other activities.

Lol. Aion's character builder can do most of what you asked for. Some people made really butt ugly toons in that game.

Lol, I play mmo's because they are entertaining. Don't play as much as I use to but that has more to do with RL obligations than the mmo's themselves. I assume everyone is pretty much the same way. Nobody plays mmos because they feel they have to. To even accuse people of that makes you sound...