12 year olds stab friend to prove Slender Man is real

Iannis_sl said:

It is. But at the same time that goes to their mental development. A 12 year olds concept of murder is so far removed from what murder actually is that I hesitate to commit to saying the word-symbol represents the same thing.

They probably will go to juvenille court.

If they were 16 I'd have no trouble with it whatsoever. If they were 14/15 I'd be iffy about it.

At 12 years old there is just the physical fact of pre-frontal development that you need to consider. That's what juvie is supposedly for, to make those sort of considerations.

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Are you fucking kidding me dude? Have you been around many tweens/teens? They are plenty cognitively developed enough to know not to fucking stab people. Even if they were four or five it would at least speak to some major fucking problems going on. They likely won't get incarcerated as adults, but they aren't just going to get slapped on the wrist for attempted murder with half the country seeing the story on Facebook, that jurisdiction wasn't risking such fallout.

supertouch_sl said:

I have no issue with their being charged as adults. Thecapacityfor empathy develops long before the age of 12 and these are the types of people who would drown their children or poison their husbands.

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I honestly don't think these kids should be charged as adults. One of them, in her statement to the police, sounded like she was surprised that they were really going through with it. It sounded like she didn't actually believe that their "plans" were more serious than when kids "plan" to marry Justin Beiber. Another point that I think is pretty important is that bold word: capacity. I don't know if there have been any studies done on the subject, but I don't believe that most people would spontaneously develop a sense of empathy by the age of 12 if their parents hadn't gone out of their way to teach it and reinforce it in a meaningful way. And I don't think that modern American parents failing to teach their children empathy is something that's very uncommon either (see black culture for millions of examples).

I think that a 12 year old children, as a rule, still have enough plasticity to learn that stabbing someone to death is a really shitty thing to do, and that society frowns on that kind of thing and takes it very seriously.

Famm_sl said:

Are you fucking kidding me dude? Have you been around many tweens/teens? They are plenty cognitively developed enough to know not to fucking stab people. Even if they were four or five it would at least speak to some major fucking problems going on. They likely won't get incarcerated as adults, but they aren't just going to get slapped on the wrist for attempted murder with half the country seeing the story on Facebook, that jurisdiction wasn't risking such fallout.

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Sure.

But I don't think "throw them in a pit with all the rapists" is exactly fixing anything either. That's just straight up vengeance.

They simply are less developed. That's a truth that all the moral outrage we can muster will not change. Obviously they shouldn't be stabbing people, and they obviously know that. That they were commiting an evil act, and intentionally doing so, isn't a question. The consideration is in what to DO about it.

And seeing as that they are, in actual fact, children I feel it fitting that the answer to that question be considered by those specifically designated to answer that question when it comes to children.

Or I suppose we can continue down this path of zero tolerance and zero understanding. It seems to me to be leading to places we'd rather avoid, though.

Mist_sl said:

They couldn't have been very serious, for-realzies stabs, or else the girl would have been dead or certainly unable to crawl away for help. They probably weren't actually trying to murder her.

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Read post #8 by kaid. They're 12 year old girls. They probably couldn't punch through the bones.

Hell, I'm a decent sized man and I have a bitch of a time getting through the breastbone when breaking down a chicken.

Elurin_sl said:

Read post #8 by kaid. They're 12 year old girls. They probably couldn't punch through the bones.

Hell, I'm a decent sized man and I have a bitch of a time getting through the breastbone when breaking down a chicken.

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because you're doing it wrong.

Going to side on not charging as adults. They're 12. They're neither socially nor cognitively developed enough to really understand their actions and consequences outside of the "it's wrong to kill people" that's been drilled into their heads - but they don't know why it's wrong yet. Like Iannis said, if they were 16, charge as an adult in most situations. A 16 year-old would have chosen a victim they really hated, though, not their friend to prove a monster real.

That being said, those pictures of the kids are pretty children-of-the-corn looking.

LiveLeak.com - Teen stabbed 300 times in Satanic sex ritual
Teen stabbed 300 times by 2 women and lived years back. This happens all the time. As long as they don't hit main critical organs or main blood flow cuts are really not that dangerous short term outside of bleeding. Bullets kill people so much better cause they shatter bone and bounce around often into a person turning the body into a frag grenade.

Still fuck that, those girls need to spend at least 6 years behind bars until adulthood, maybe forever.

Maester Chuk_sl said:

because you're doing it wrong.

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This thread is now about "How many 12 year old girls could you take out if you were armed with a knife?"

BoldW_sl said:

Going to side on not charging as adults. They're 12. They're neither socially nor cognitively developed enough to really understand their actions and consequences outside of the "it's wrong to kill people" that's been drilled into their heads - but they don't know why it's wrong yet. Like Iannis said, if they were 16, charge as an adult in most situations. A 16 year-old would have chosen a victim they really hated, though, not their friend to prove a monster real.

That being said, those pictures of the kids are pretty children-of-the-corn looking.

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Most children have poor impulse control and lack of foresight, but this is an entirely different matter. If you're committing cold, calculated murders at 12, you're not gonna turn into a compassionate human being a few years later.

From the quotes of the girls in the articles I've been reading, it certainly sounds (to me) that they knew what they were doing; i.e., acknowledging that they were trying to kill her and not feeling any remorse about it.

I remember when I was around that age I heard about how some teenagers dropped a big rock on a swan or duck or something and killed it, just for fun. I remember thinking how fucked up that was, and couldn't imagine myself ever able to do something like that. I certainly knew at that age what it meant to kill a living thing.

If these girls don't spend the rest of their lives in jail (which I doubt they will), one of them is going to end up hurting/killing someone later in life. They're clearly fucked up in the head. I feel sorry for the poor sap who marries one of these psychos in 15 - 20 years not knowing that she's attempted murder before.

She should be sent to an adult male prison.

Every time my state is in the news it's something retarded.

At least they weren't drunk at the time.

Dude,everybodycheeses up here.

I'm betting ADHD meds or some kind of SRI depression drug like Zoloft. I knew a girl who's yippie parents had her on lithium and Zoloft from the age of 10, most genuinely crazy fucking person I've ever known. Always talking about ghosts and demons following her around and stealing her keys or stabbing her with needles and shit.

Loosely related (re charging as adults or juveniles).

So is Jail better than Psychological help here? I guess that's my beef with charging her as an adult.
Dude, this 12 year old has issues and tried to kill a friend - we need to send her to adult prison for most of her life - that will fix her and keep her away from any other malevolent influences.