Archeage

Eidal

Eidal

Molten Core Raider
2,001
213
Wish Devs had been paying attention to what was good about DAOC (roaming small squad PVP) and what was lame (zergs, beating on doors) and would engineer around this. I can't fucking believe its 15 years later and large scale MMO PVP has evolved practically zero. I get the impression Tuco and the other non-glue eating PRX want something like an actual military campaign but jesus fucking christ is this not it. What I'd like to see is a game that requires command and control at a high level -- a general needs to be reacting to specific tactical changes in the battlefield, but instead of him wheeling his 100 man zerg around (ugh), he needs to issue orders all the way through a chain of command down to individual group level.

Tuco, what do you think of:

1) require players to achieve multiple objectives simultaneously AND,

2) ridiculously scaling AE abilities on players AND environment to discourage large groups in specific areas.

This seems like it'd pretty handily lead to the creation of standard military echelons and doctrine.
 
moontayle

moontayle

Golden Squire
4,302
165
Pretty much everything revolves around Labor. Labor regen is basically shit unless you're logged on, or unless you have a steady stream of Worker's Compensation potions, which give 1000 labor, and have a character-specific 12hr cooldown, and a bunch of alts to take advantage of that. Youcanget WC pots off the AH but the price at the moment (on Kyrios) is definitely less than optimal in terms of money out versus potential money in. So the alternative is off the marketplace.

Now, also take into account that past a certain point the best means to level is simply via crafting and this is especially true once you hit 50 and need to start leveling all your other classes. There's a potion that doubles exp gained via crafting for an hour, and again it can be bought off the AH but it stems from the marketplace. Crafting equipment is labor intensive. To even have achanceof getting to level 50 equipment requires nearly 2000 laborper piece. I'm sure you can draw your own conclusions from this point.

They'll never do anything about labor regen because WC pots are probably their #1 marketplace item and it's painfully obvious that you'll always be behind the curve unless you invest in some.
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
<Gold Donor>
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Eidal_sl said:
Wish Devs had been paying attention to what was good about DAOC (roaming small squad PVP) and what was lame (zergs, beating on doors) and would engineer around this. I can't fucking believe its 15 years later and large scale MMO PVP has evolved practically zero. I get the impression Tuco and the other non-glue eating PRX want something like an actual military campaign but jesus fucking christ is this not it. What I'd like to see is a game that requires command and control at a high level -- a general needs to be reacting to specific tactical changes in the battlefield, but instead of him wheeling his 100 man zerg around (ugh), he needs to issue orders all the way through a chain of command down to individual group level.

Tuco, what do you think of:

1) require players to achieve multiple objectives simultaneously AND,

2) ridiculously scaling AE abilities on players AND environment to discourage large groups in specific areas.

This seems like it'd pretty handily lead to the creation of standard military echelons and doctrine.
Click to expand...
I pretty much agree with everything you said more or less. Powerful AE is the #1 ability to cause players to disperse and while this game has some builds with good AE, the range on them and them being almost all PBAE isn't enough to really bring the dynamic that we saw in DAOC.

And as the person who spent a lot of time getting stuck with the shit bag that was coordinating many independent groups of players achieving many simultaneous goals in GW2 I can say that I personally want nothing more to do with that!
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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moontayle_sl said:
Pretty much everything revolves around Labor. Labor regen is basically shit unless you're logged on, or unless you have a steady stream of Worker's Compensation potions, which give 1000 labor, and have a character-specific 12hr cooldown, and a bunch of alts to take advantage of that. Youcanget WC pots off the AH but the price at the moment (on Kyrios) is definitely less than optimal in terms of money out versus potential money in. So the alternative is off the marketplace.

Now, also take into account that past a certain point the best means to level is simply via crafting and this is especially true once you hit 50 and need to start leveling all your other classes. There's a potion that doubles exp gained via crafting for an hour, and again it can be bought off the AH but it stems from the marketplace. Crafting equipment is labor intensive. To even have achanceof getting to level 50 equipment requires nearly 2000 laborper piece. I'm sure you can draw your own conclusions from this point.

They'll never do anything about labor regen because WC pots are probably their #1 marketplace item and it's painfully obvious that you'll always be behind the curve unless you invest in some.
Click to expand...
What you say is true, however if a player only attempts to earn gold via:
1. farming (legal or illegal)
2. Running trade packs (buying the mats off the AH or farming themselves)
3. Fishing
4. Farming purses
5. Piracy.

and that player only plays ~4 hours a day, labor generally isn't a massive problem. They can then use their $$$ to purchase items off the AH. Do they pay a premium for other people's labor? Yes, but the market is competitive enough that if you tabulate the odds of success * the cost of mats, the premium you're paying for other's labor is not that high.
 
K

koffin_sl

shitlord
24
0
Labor doesn't have to be a big deal, it just depends on how you like to make your money.
The other day I noticed carrots were 2.5 per. So for nearly no labor and 20ish minutes of growing time that isn't bad for f2p or sub'ed players that want to do minimal effort
 
Morsakin

Morsakin

Golden Knight of the Realm
384
119
I multi box thank christ so labor is never an issue anymore. Run 5 accounts currently; but this is sort of necessary given my olympic-sized shitbucket worth of playtime over the past few weeks, as I would otherwise run out of things to do aside from pirating at 5 in the morning.

Just sniped a bunch of 16's going up next to my main ranch; up to 10 16x16's and another 5 elsewhere. Made 1100g today just off yata mats (Downy Fur / Cashmere Thread / Merchant Cushions / 1 Mount) and taking advantage of some ridiculous spreads that opened up on small seed / viscous glossy oils which somehow lasted several hours before being closed.

I hear about all these problems on other servers; whether it's land bots / fubar'ed economics / land shortages etc. and I don't really see much of it aside from the latter-most, which is mostly relegated to extremely recent newcomers. Glad I rolled on Ezi.
 
Harkon

Harkon

Vyemm Raider
1,549
4,090
Morsakin_sl said:
I multi box thank christ so labor is never an issue anymore. Run 5 accounts currently; but this is sort of necessary given my olympic-sized shitbucket worth of playtime over the past few weeks, as I would otherwise run out of things to do aside from pirating at 5 in the morning.

Just sniped a bunch of 16's going up next to my main ranch; up to 10 16x16's and another 5 elsewhere. Made 1100g today just off yata mats (Downy Fur / Cashmere Thread / Merchant Cushions / 1 Mount) and taking advantage of some ridiculous spreads that opened up on small seed / viscous glossy oils which somehow lasted several hours before being closed.

I hear about all these problems on other servers; whether it's land bots / fubar'ed economics / land shortages etc. and I don't really see much of it aside from the latter-most, which is mostly relegated to extremely recent newcomers. Glad I rolled on Ezi.
Click to expand...
Wait does your name begin with Sam?
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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Sorry if you stated which server, but which server is this? On Kyrios land expirations are still hotly contested.
 
Morsakin

Morsakin

Golden Knight of the Realm
384
119
Harkon_sl said:
Wait does your name begin with Sam?
Click to expand...
Afraid I lack the required unkempt chest hair and pedophilia tendencies to acquire such a name. I only ever actually manage two instances of the game simultaneously, with the others just regenerating labor offline.

It all started when I realized there was a huge shortage of 50k+ carpenters on Ezi, and given the chances of getting to say, Delphinad, I wouldn't exactly be able to place my claim on their undivided labor to deal with the varied attempts necessary to satiate the RNG. So I made one for Carpentry. Then Mining. Then Alchemy. It's a vicious cycle, though the synergy created by the various proficiencies is starting to prove beneficial.

Also, who the hell designed the 50k proficiency title quests? Went from "Spend 13g on 100 Beef via AH" to "Spend 400g and 5000+ Labor to craft 5 Illustrious leather pieces".
 
Vandyn

Vandyn

Blackwing Lair Raider
3,656
1,382
I wonder how this game is going to deal with the inevitable server merges/character transfers since I would imagine some servers are going to be ghost towns sooner rather than later.
 
K

Kharza-kzad_sl

shitlord
1,080
0
Tuco_sl said:
Sorry if you stated which server, but which server is this? On Kyrios land expirations are still hotly contested.
Click to expand...
This was on Ollo, I have a house on Kyrios too, but the guild kinda died out there. Ollo seems active, see lots of wagons rolling around. Maybe people are just tired of losing on land grabs.
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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Yeah Ollo is a very active server.

There was a pretty big drop in activity 1-2 weeks ago when the apex dupe, tstruck trees in marketplace and the chest exploit happened close together and that caused a lot of serious players to quit, so I bet there's a lot of land being evicted atm.
 
Nija

Nija

<Silver Donator>
1,919
3,736
Morsakin_sl said:
I multi box thank christ so labor is never an issue anymore. Run 5 accounts currently; but this is sort of necessary given my olympic-sized shitbucket worth of playtime over the past few weeks, as I would otherwise run out of things to do aside from pirating at 5 in the morning.

Just sniped a bunch of 16's going up next to my main ranch; up to 10 16x16's and another 5 elsewhere. Made 1100g today just off yata mats (Downy Fur / Cashmere Thread / Merchant Cushions / 1 Mount) and taking advantage of some ridiculous spreads that opened up on small seed / viscous glossy oils which somehow lasted several hours before being closed.

I hear about all these problems on other servers; whether it's land bots / fubar'ed economics / land shortages etc. and I don't really see much of it aside from the latter-most, which is mostly relegated to extremely recent newcomers. Glad I rolled on Ezi.
Click to expand...
You should stop playing video games like that and create an IRL company instead. It'll be more rewarding.
 
Tuco

Tuco

I got Tuco'd!
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