Dark Alliance (Drizzt and co in Icewind Dale)

Leviothan

Trakanon Raider
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That Monster Hunter vibe Brodhi is talking is what I want out of a game for doing missions with friends and accomplishing something together.

Its a shame this game attempted that and failed apparently. Anyway... I'm still going to play it when I get the chance.
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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That Monster Hunter vibe Brodhi is talking is what I want out of a game for doing missions with friends and accomplishing something together.

Its a shame this game attempted that and failed apparently. Anyway... I'm still going to play it when I get the chance.
of ALL the issues this game has, THAT isn't one of them.
 

Xerge

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The game functions like an 19 year old brunette. awkward, but It's a good time. The Marvel game loaded missions from the table didnt it? That game was still objectively trash. Poor design or not, if that's what you zero in on.. good fucking lord. I'm pretty sure vermintide has the same mechanic to starting a mission.

At least write a wall of f ucking text dedicated to the weird animation/combo system.
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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The game functions like an 19 year old brunette. awkward, but It's a good time. The Marvel game loaded missions from the table didnt it? That game was still objectively trash. Poor design or not, if that's what you zero in on.. good fucking lord. I'm pretty sure vermintide has the same mechanic to starting a mission.

At least write a wall of f ucking text dedicated to the weird animation/combo system.
100%, lol. great description.

but yeah. there are some definite things to criticize about this game, the map loading process is such an odd thing to grab on to. i mean, like on one hand you're right it's an odd gameplay decision, no doubt. on the other hand the impact that it has on the game itself is so utterly negligible that even bringing it up in the list of negatives just comes across like an insolent child.
 
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Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
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It really befuddles me how how hit and miss D&D games are. A good Drizzt game should be a license to print money.
 
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Nirgon

YOU HAVE NO POWER HERE
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It's like they designed this game from the ground up to be a shitty console port in an era when a game like this would feasibly be played on controllers even on PC.

The controls/movement in this game remind me of a claw-toy machine I used once that had two joysticks, one for forward-back, one for side-to-side. Only problem is it didn't go diagonal if you used both joysticks at once, it just stuttered and seized. At some point somebody designing that machine should have asked why not just have one joystick if you can't even use both at the same time, right?

Why have left-stick movement in permanent strafe mode, basically, requiring constant camera corrections with the right stick to 'aim' your direction running in the world and attacks. Especially when button presses are require for two of the three timing dependent actions, dodge and empowered strike (I think it's called, the one you have to hit right after an attack, that if you're hovering to hit the button you aren't aiming your attack well enough and will miss). But your thumb needs to be on the right stick 'aiming' your character for basic strikes because there isn't auto-target. And of course when you've manually target locked the game, it's also zoomed in shit.

I'm pretty sure at some point they had attacks on buttons and wanted a 'meaningful' aim-target style action combat like shit MMOs kept trying to do where you have to aim heals, and it wasn't working because testers said: "you know, having to use both sticks to control movement really makes it hard to aim attacks using the buttons. Solution: move the attacks and parry and dodge to trigger/finger buttons! Yeah, wait, but I'm used to zoom-in-aim being left trigger in shooters... Okay, leave that one left trigger! Great! Then later they added timed empowered strikes and dodge and now they just had too many buttons and not enough thumbs.

Why didn't they just make controlling your character all left stick, with occasionally right stick camera looking, like is pretty much standard for console/controller games these days that require 3 timed reaction inputs?

Why did they design movement such that it makes me think the dev team all play with controllers like and old person using their fingers instead of thumbs.

The aim for attacks not using target lock seems to suck, with a lot of attacks missing, or with animations that take you past the targets. Why not focus on a serviceable auto-target system, or at least a target-lock system that isn't zoomed in shit?


Actually, ignore all that, one of the shills just answer me this: Why the fuck have one part of the camp a 'map' where you select where you want to go, and then you have to run to another part of the camp to then auto-teleport to that location? Why? Muh immersion?? Can't have players just click a map and load, people will be confused because their character didn't run out of camp... so let's just have them run to a weird teleport pad. Worst of both worlds! It's not even like it LOOKS like you're running out of camp. It's literally you look at a map in one part of camp, select where you want to be auto-teleported to, and then for no reason the game makes you pointlessly run a little just cuz to get to where you're auto-teleported.

Could not a single member of the dev team come up with a better solution than select your auto-teleport location on one UI screen at one part of camp, then run across camp to actually auto-teleport? Nobody said 'why don't we just let people load from the map screen? Nobody said, why don't we at least make it look like you're running out of camp, and the background environment of where you run to load will change based on what region you selected on the map (the selected on the map and loading zone needing to be separate to load the background). Nobody said anything at at all to a system where you run to one part of the camp, click on something to pull up a map, click on the region of the map you want to go to, exit the map, run to another section of the camp to a spot where you just auto-load your mission from there? Not one dev was like 'this is pointless and doesn't add anything fun or interesting at all.

See also, you load the first mission, run in a weird, walled area (so only one way to run) approaching where the game/map obviously starts, then the game pauses, sorta loads again or at least just pauses to show you tutorial/tips/hints (even after you just did the tutorial), and then when you exit out of those, you run a little more to finally enter where the 'map' obviously begins. WHY!? Not one dev had a different solution to THAT? Why not just have loading screen tips on the loading screen? Nah, games load to fast now days. Why not just while it loads, have tips that it doesn't finish loading until they cycle through the tips? NAH! Lets have them load to a pre-area, run, then re-load the hints/tips, then when they cycle through those they can run more into the actual map area! BRILLIANT!

Let me guess, the only best response is "it's not that far to run" from people who are in co-dependent abusive relationships with bad game design. Hi, Nirgon Nirgon

I'm not struggling with it really. I just notice anything that divulges from being able to mouse spin at light speed while jumping and flinging attacks is considered "clunky". I heard this a lot with dota 2 and people's frustration with certain heavier characters being slower to turn.

You have to understand I favor immersive elements over arcadey Fortnite/WoW "ADD" style. Not that those are terrible or anything, they have their place and it's a matter of opinion and preference. They introduce their own elements of skill required. I wouldn't consider myself to be in an abusive relationship as much as I'd favor some realism to the character control.

I can see why this game is gonna rustle some button mashers. It's fun and not whats being portrayed (worst. game. ever. etc).
 
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Qhue

Trump's Staff
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The delta between 'I can't die' and 'I get killed in two hits' with this game is very small, at least at these first couple of levels. It also looks like every zone is on the same overall scale. So the first act of the first zone is level 1-2 at Challenge Rating 1 and the first act of all the other zones is also level 1-2 at Challenge Rating 1.

It can't be that you can beat the game in level 2 gear can it? That would be absurd...
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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The delta between 'I can't die' and 'I get killed in two hits' with this game is very small, at least at these first couple of levels. It also looks like every zone is on the same overall scale. So the first act of the first zone is level 1-2 at Challenge Rating 1 and the first act of all the other zones is also level 1-2 at Challenge Rating 1.

It can't be that you can beat the game in level 2 gear can it? That would be absurd...
i feel like THAT should be what reviewers are talking about if that's true... like that's pants on head... i watched chunks of that wolfheart stream that i posted yesterday and he never brought that up. he mentioned plenty of goofy AI and combat issues, but i never heard him say anything about not actually needing to upgrade your gear...
 
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popsicledeath

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100%, lol. great description.

but yeah. there are some definite things to criticize about this game, the map loading process is such an odd thing to grab on to. i mean, like on one hand you're right it's an odd gameplay decision, no doubt. on the other hand the impact that it has on the game itself is so utterly negligible that even bringing it up in the list of negatives just comes across like an insolent child.

This is how bad the game is. With a half hour of trying the game I came up with a handful of very noticeable flaws that are so fundamental and perplexing that it indicates foundational issues in game design and the mentality and/or abilities of developers. And instead of being able to defend the game, the most ardent shill will take that list of complaints/concerns and pluck out one, miss the stated reason it was a concern, and pretend it's just some petty quality of life gripe. And that it's absurd I'm only focusing on that one thing they've assigned as my only complaint. And of course that I'm personally just very upset and angry for some reason.

Fucking tone policing and reductive cognitive dissonance to white knight this steaming pile of shit video game. Phew lad. As I said, if we had a few ardent fanboys for this game at least the thread would still be interesting. But I didn't think it would escalate this quickly. Yikes.
 
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popsicledeath

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I'm not struggling with it really. I just notice anything that divulges from being able to mouse spin at light speed while jumping and flinging attacks is considered "clunky". I heard this a lot with dota 2 and people's frustration with certain heavier characters being slower to turn.

You have to understand I favor immersive elements over arcadey Fortnite/WoW "ADD" style. Not that those are terrible or anything, they have their place and it's a matter of opinion and preference. They introduce their own elements of skill required. I wouldn't consider myself to be in an abusive relationship as much as I'd favor some realism to the character control.

I can see why this game is gonna rustle some button mashers. It's fun and not whats being portrayed (worst. game. ever. etc).

Yes. Yes you're right. The real problem isn't movement controls are shit, targeting is shit, there are absurd animation locks and warping and movement/attack sync issues, and everything in the game generally feels sluggish and plodding.... the problem is actually that people in this thread are just expecting this game to have mouse spin light speed jump turn ranged attacks.

Why can't you just make a rational point? Why can't you provide some tips how to make the controls, movement and combat better? Are there options that need adjusted? No? No you can't provide anything but some hyperbolic strawman that if people think something in this game sucks, it's only because you can read their mind and know they want an unattainable, exaggerated standard you're assigning them?

This game is so bad, look at how flailing and irrational these fanboys are having to be to try to justify what a shit sandwich this game is.
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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This is how bad the game is. With a half hour of trying the game I came up with a handful of very noticeable flaws that are so fundamental and perplexing that it indicates foundational issues in game design and the mentality and/or abilities of developers. And instead of being able to defend the game, the most ardent shill will take that list of complaints/concerns and pluck out one, miss the stated reason it was a concern, and pretend it's just some petty quality of life gripe. And that it's absurd I'm only focusing on that one thing they've assigned as my only complaint. And of course that I'm personally just very upset and angry for some reason.

Fucking tone policing and reductive cognitive dissonance to white knight this steaming pile of shit video game. Phew lad. As I said, if we had a few ardent fanboys for this game at least the thread would still be interesting. But I didn't think it would escalate this quickly. Yikes.
you played it, you mentioned several valid issues, you don't like it. that's basically the end and that's obviously fine. no one is trying to convince you to change your mind. myself and a few others have said the same thing, that there are issues but we are still enjoying in despite those issues.

"Actually, ignore all that, one of the shills just answer me this: Why the fuck have one part of the camp a 'map' where you select where you want to go, and then you have to run to another part of the camp to then auto-teleport to that location?"

that's what you said. you wrote a wall of text, then told us all to ignore it, then told us to focus on the map mission stuff. the two main answers you got was "that's basically how other games do it like MH and vermintide" and "i don't know, it's a silly decision but fundamentally inconsequential to the overall game itself."

so like... if we misunderstood your call to focus on the map stuff, then my apologies. could you clarify your point?
 

Xerge

<Donor>
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sharing my keybind setup. Backslash is rebound to a third mouse button if anyone is wondering. Also when youre target locked i've noticed you can keep attacking continuously to next targets, but you stay zoomed in.

Is gearing important? The game makes it a big deal about fetching your mission's loot out of a box only after youre fucking done. This game has some jank mechanics.

1624383459740.png
 
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Nirgon

YOU HAVE NO POWER HERE
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Yes. Yes you're right. The real problem isn't movement controls are shit, targeting is shit, there are absurd animation locks and warping and movement/attack sync issues, and everything in the game generally feels sluggish and plodding.... the problem is actually that people in this thread are just expecting this game to have mouse spin light speed jump turn ranged attacks.

Why can't you just make a rational point? Why can't you provide some tips how to make the controls, movement and combat better? Are there options that need adjusted? No? No you can't provide anything but some hyperbolic strawman that if people think something in this game sucks, it's only because you can read their mind and know they want an unattainable, exaggerated standard you're assigning them?

This game is so bad, look at how flailing and irrational these fanboys are having to be to try to justify what a shit sandwich this game is.

I think I've made a number of coherent and rational points and you have a strong personal distaste for the game. Fine by me.
 
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popsicledeath

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you played it, you mentioned several valid issues, you don't like it. that's basically the end and that's obviously fine. no one is trying to convince you to change your mind. myself and a few others have said the same thing, that there are issues but we are still enjoying in despite those issues.

"Actually, ignore all that, one of the shills just answer me this: Why the fuck have one part of the camp a 'map' where you select where you want to go, and then you have to run to another part of the camp to then auto-teleport to that location?"

that's what you said. you wrote a wall of text, then told us all to ignore it, then told us to focus on the map mission stuff. the two main answers you got was "that's basically how other games do it like MH and vermintide" and "i don't know, it's a silly decision but fundamentally inconsequential to the overall game itself."

so like... if we misunderstood your call to focus on the map stuff, then my apologies. could you clarify your point?

No, no my apologies. Honestly didn't know you were neuroatypical and had a hard time deciphering casual conversation. I asked for an answer to one question. Does that mean I'm personally very angry and an insolent child and the one thing I wanted to see you try to defend is the only point I was making and that it was silly if that's my only complaint, when you just acknowledged it wasn't?

Also, consider the "map stuff" was presented by me, several times, as a concern about their ability to make sound developmental decisions. You're either intentionally obtuse or aspy and insist you can mind read my real point to be complaining there is pointless running. I even pre-butted that point, mockingly pointing out how shilltards would defend it by just saying it's only a little running and isn't a big deal. Even me providing the idiotic rationale ahead of time in a mocking way, you still couldn't help trying to defend the game using it. Sad.

As you point out, the responses to that one question highlight my point. So you know the point I was making. One initial game design element either indicates the game was half baked and not completed in a cohesive manner or is silly and pointless. Yeah, that's my point, as stated from the neginning, you fucking tool.

The fact you think it's fine to have such glaring design faceplant that clearly indicate issues with the ability of the dev crew or their mentality is precisely why we keep getting shit, poorly implemented, inexplicable shit sandwich games like this.

Literal "this is fine" meme. It's not fine. You only tell yourself that. Why? It's literally symptomatic of a co-dependent victim of abuse. You know that scene in Good Will Hunting where the shrink is saying "it's not your fault"? Well, here, it is your fault. Have some fucking self respect and stop enabling and defending shit games like this. You're fucking it up for those of us who want to play even medicore, but polished games.

I'm half expecting you to defend the game by saying "it's cheaper than going to the movies" as if that justifies throwing good money after shit, or "at least we have something to play" like a fucking whipped dog.
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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No, no my apologies. Honestly didn't know you were neuroatypical and had a hard time deciphering casual conversation. I asked for an answer to one question. Does that mean I'm personally very angry and an insolent child and the one thing I wanted to see you try to defend is the only point I was making and that it was silly if that's my only complaint, when you just acknowledged it wasn't?

Also, consider the "map stuff" was presented by me, several times, as a concern about their ability to make sound developmental decisions. You're either intentionally obtuse or aspy and insist you can mind read my real point to be complaining there is pointless running. I even pre-butted that point, mockingly pointing out how shilltards would defend it by just saying it's only a little running and isn't a big deal. Even me providing the idiotic rationale ahead of time in a mocking way, you still couldn't help trying to defend the game using it. Sad.

As you point out, the responses to that one question highlight my point. So you know the point I was making. One initial game design element either indicates the game was half baked and not completed in a cohesive manner or is silly and pointless. Yeah, that's my point, as stated from the neginning, you fucking tool.

The fact you think it's fine to have such glaring design faceplant that clearly indicate issues with the ability of the dev crew or their mentality is precisely why we keep getting shit, poorly implemented, inexplicable shit sandwich games like this.

Literal "this is fine" meme. It's not fine. You only tell yourself that. Why? It's literally symptomatic of a co-dependent victim of abuse. You know that scene in Good Will Hunting where the shrink is saying "it's not your fault"? Well, here, it is your fault. Have some fucking self respect and stop enabling and defending shit games like this. You're fucking it up for those of us who want to play even medicore, but polished games.

I'm half expecting you to defend the game by saying "it's cheaper than going to the movies" as if that justifies throwing good money after shit, or "at least we have something to play" like a fucking whipped dog.
Lol
 

popsicledeath

Potato del Grande
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sharing my keybind setup. Backslash is rebound to a third mouse button if anyone is wondering. Also when youre target locked i've noticed you can keep attacking continuously to next targets, but you stay zoomed in.

Is gearing important? The game makes it a big deal about fetching your mission's loot out of a box only after youre fucking done. This game has some jank mechanics.

View attachment 359409

Assuming the game is more smooth and playable on PC. I think it will be the main source of misunderstanding about reactions to the game. It's launching with what feels like a bad port on console. And for no reason because didn't someone say no crossplay? So they could have changed some mechanics for console/controller, they just decided to say fuck it and the game feels like a bad port because of it and is painful to play on console with a controller.
 

Xerge

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Did an online quick play. Once you jack up the mouse sensitivity setting I was able to swing my camera around okay. I was forced into using a non-drizz character in my match as I joined someone else who had already picked him and somehow ruled over me, lol. I went with the bow chick and the combat felt more floaty on this character. The empower mechanic is fun but the chick's combat just isn't tight enough and feels weird. Dark e lf dude is smooth to play, haven't tried the other two.

Deffinitely a half baked port - had to navigate a monster log with wasd, couldn't simply click on an entry. There's possible fun here though once they smooth out the combat; encountered lots of traps, mini boss with a poison bulb explosion mechanic, explosive shit, secrets with loot, optional locations. I will say the dungeon's objective were kinda boring, but wasn't just hallway>room>hallway either so maybe it was just a newbie thing.

Certainly wouldn't buy it or would have refunded if not for game pass.
 
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j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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i've seen a few people mention that there's no crossplay, but all the news sources are saying, yes, there is crossplay. or, mostly. i guess xbox and pc have crossplay (definitely gamepass, but no idea about steam) and crossplay between ps4 and ps5.

so no crossplay between playstation and pc/xbox
 

popsicledeath

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Console and PC crossplay is just going to reveal even more how shit this game is on console with a controller. They'd be smart to keep them separated at this point.

Are UI elements and windows opening/closing freezing the game for a few seconds on PC? Because being frozen for two seconds to be told I didn't have any trophies or loot yet was cool.