First EverQuest, 3 screenshots

mkopec

mkopec

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Wtf you talking about. Eq back in the day was mapped, pretty much all spawns were plotted, all items or most were discovered and who and where dropped them. This was 1999/2000 and internet was thriving. Not 1986. There were several dedicated spoiler sites like allakhazam that had all the infos you ever needed about EQ.
 
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TJT

TJT

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Add-ons and the complexity they're allowed to have will be the biggest thing. No add-ons at all should be allowed outside of rearranging the UI for personal preference.

It's one thing to go to mapping sites where other players drew out zone maps and recorded drops. It is another to have built in mapquest that real time shows your position and all objects of interest in the zone. Points you to them, tracks your loot and all kinds of other information.

1601887608279.png
 
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Cybsled

Cybsled

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mkopec said:
Wtf you talking about. Eq back in the day was mapped, pretty much all spawns were plotted, all items or most were discovered and who and where dropped them. This was 1999/2000 and internet was thriving. Not 1986. There were several dedicated spoiler sites like allakhazam that had all the infos you ever needed about EQ.
Click to expand...

Most of that was player driven submissions, though, and acquired through the old fashioned method of finding it, then sharing it. It's not like MMOChampion where they would data mine items from the game files and post a shitload of datamined images. Places like Allakahazam relied on actual players looting an item, then submitting a screenshot to their site of said item. Plus, shit like ShowEQ helped in locating specific spawn locations and the like (every damn end game guild had someone using that program).

The point is the rate at which shit would be uncovered would be far higher than it was back in the day. If we had to make a comparison, in era of EQ1 you were dealing with garage tinkerers and in the modern era, you're dealing with a corporation. People pining for the days of "mystery mmo where we dont know what anything does" are deluding themselves into thinking most of that shit wouldn't be cracked within a few weeks. There is actual monetary stakes for the gaming population. First guy who starts posting Youtube videos or whatever with legit "need to know" information gets the big following and those sweet ad dollars.
 
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Grizzlebeard

Grizzlebeard

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Alla/Illia had info on random mobs but any progression strategy was a closely guarded secret. Guilds wouldn't share shit ordinarily which is why people hopping between competing guilds were gold-dust. Some random monk who got salty because he didn't get a drop would skip to the next top guild and cough up all he knew.
 
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V

velk

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Cybsled said:
Most of that was player driven submissions, though, and acquired through the old fashioned method of finding it, then sharing it. It's not like MMOChampion where they would data mine items from the game files and post a shitload of datamined images. Places like Allakahazam relied on actual players looting an item, then submitting a screenshot to their site of said item. Plus, shit like ShowEQ helped in locating specific spawn locations and the like (every damn end game guild had someone using that program).
Click to expand...

Yeah, there was some data mining going on, I data mined and maintained a list of item haste values because they were too stubborn to put important shit like that in tooltips.

I agree completely that you aren't going to end up in that situation these days unless noone gives a shit about your game.
 
T

Tide27

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Grizzlebeard said:
Alla/Illia had info on random mobs but any progression strategy was a closely guarded secret. Guilds wouldn't share shit ordinarily which is why people hopping between competing guilds were gold-dust. Some random monk who got salty because he didn't get a drop would skip to the next top guild and cough up all he knew.
Click to expand...
I played in the top raiding guilds on my server from Classic to GoD. With the exception to the Rathe Council and the first phases of Time ( where the raid had to be split for the first time in EQ history that I can remember ) , the only strat was to have enough clerics on a cHeal rotation. 99% of all boss encounters were a tank would wall a boss in a corner while clerics jusr cHealed and dps spammed 1,1,1,1,1.
 
Jackie Treehorn

Jackie Treehorn

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Dang. I had probably thousands of screenshots from 2000-2003 Bristlebane but long gone in a hard drive crash probably 15 years ago.
 
Ikkan

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Tide27 said:
I played in the top raiding guilds on my server from Classic to GoD. With the exception to the Rathe Council and the first phases of Time ( where the raid had to be split for the first time in EQ history that I can remember ) , the only strat was to have enough clerics on a cHeal rotation. 99% of all boss encounters were a tank would wall a boss in a corner while clerics jusr cHealed and dps spammed 1,1,1,1,1.
Click to expand...
While there were certainly more complex encounters than that, most of the time they could really just be broken down into independent groups doing their own thing. The Emperor Ssraeshza encounter is a good example. While there is more going on than just CH rot on the tank(and rune for the 4K dd), the other parts(which were knights offtanking snakes or enchanters keeping snakes mezzed) could act entirely apart from the rest of the raid. While it wasn't some ridiculously complex strategy, it did give at least a bit of variety to what is otherwise an overwhelmingly straightforward raiding experience.

A follow up to that, specifically aimed at people who played during the most straightforward and simple years of EQ - would you want to play a game like that nowadays, or are you looking for something more complex in an MMO? Do you want to feel like you always have to be doing something, or are you looking for more of a "chat room while gaming and having a beer" experience in 2020?
 
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TJT

TJT

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I am sure there is a fine line between year 2000 EQ Combat, which was just visual MUD, and DDR don't misstep your 10 key rotation WOW.

The goal should be to encourage social interaction over twitch-game complexity. That is what an MMO is. The steady treadmill of character advancement. You want to be able to carry some retards who actually want to play but are not excellent at video games. Housewife Sally can heal, collect mats and other shit that helps the guild do whatever. While you have a handful of people who actually know how to do shit with any actual depth that lead the charge.
 
Louis

Louis

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Cybsled said:
Most of that was player driven submissions, though, and acquired through the old fashioned method of finding it, then sharing it. It's not like MMOChampion where they would data mine items from the game files and post a shitload of datamined images. Places like Allakahazam relied on actual players looting an item, then submitting a screenshot to their site of said item. Plus, shit like ShowEQ helped in locating specific spawn locations and the like (every damn end game guild had someone using that program).

The point is the rate at which shit would be uncovered would be far higher than it was back in the day. If we had to make a comparison, in era of EQ1 you were dealing with garage tinkerers and in the modern era, you're dealing with a corporation. People pining for the days of "mystery mmo where we dont know what anything does" are deluding themselves into thinking most of that shit wouldn't be cracked within a few weeks. There is actual monetary stakes for the gaming population. First guy who starts posting Youtube videos or whatever with legit "need to know" information gets the big following and those sweet ad dollars.
Click to expand...
Yeah there definitely wasnt some knowall repository like he is referring to back then. A majority of the playerbase wasnt on the bleeding edge and most weren't willingly sharing information for the masses. Combine that with ultra rare spawns and drops it ended up taking a while for the knowledge to become mainstream and then somewhat verified. The same comments are still there with people posting crazy theories and wrong assumptions on allah.

Even to this day, 21 years later, I still have to do research using multiple sources to make sure I am on the right path for some quests because the theory posted by Kruk, the 48th season warrior, posted in 2004 seems Sus.
 
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Cybsled

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Tide27 said:
I played in the top raiding guilds on my server from Classic to GoD. With the exception to the Rathe Council and the first phases of Time ( where the raid had to be split for the first time in EQ history that I can remember ) , the only strat was to have enough clerics on a cHeal rotation. 99% of all boss encounters were a tank would wall a boss in a corner while clerics jusr cHealed and dps spammed 1,1,1,1,1.
Click to expand...

To a large degree, ya. Most fights were variations on that, with tank swaps to account for death touch bullshit. Later on there was a lot more LOS the AoE shit. Ventani the Warder was unique in that you pretty much had to do ranged only (I remember spamming shurikens that entire fight as a monk). It mostly came down to safe spots, Removing adds without getting the boss, accounting for cheap mechanics like DT, and dodging mega AoE by hiding.
 
TomServo

TomServo

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Ikkan said:
While there were certainly more complex encounters than that, most of the time they could really just be broken down into independent groups doing their own thing. The Emperor Ssraeshza encounter is a good example. While there is more going on than just CH rot on the tank(and rune for the 4K dd), the other parts(which were knights offtanking snakes or enchanters keeping snakes mezzed) could act entirely apart from the rest of the raid. While it wasn't some ridiculously complex strategy, it did give at least a bit of variety to what is otherwise an overwhelmingly straightforward raiding experience.

A follow up to that, specifically aimed at people who played during the most straightforward and simple years of EQ - would you want to play a game like that nowadays, or are you looking for something more complex in an MMO? Do you want to feel like you always have to be doing something, or are you looking for more of a "chat room while gaming and having a beer" experience in 2020?
Click to expand...
Meh being a shaman on the fight once they added the disease slow that could be used on emp, my guild asked me to full heal the offtank group of paladins and shadow knights while slowing emp and the adds through the entire encounter. Fucking maximum cani dancing.
 
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Xexx

Xexx

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Everytime i see this thread i get my hopes up - i should just blank out the thought of ever getting an EQ3..
 
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ShakyJake

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I don't think we'll be getting any more good MMOs for the foreseeable future. Not until some massive technological leap is made.
 
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ZyyzYzzy

ZyyzYzzy

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ShakyJake said:
I don't think we'll be getting any more good MMOs for the foreseeable future. Not until some massive technological leap is made.
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We need true VR, experiencing all senses, for the ultimate MMO. I want to feel the pain when I slip and become one of the fall'en
 
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Sadre Spinegnawer

Sadre Spinegnawer

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Cybsled said:
The point is the rate at which shit would be uncovered would be far higher than it was back in the day. If we had to make a comparison, in era of EQ1 you were dealing with garage tinkerers and in the modern era, you're dealing with a corporation.
Click to expand...

The above is a true statement, followed by a depressingly apt analogy.

love the vintage screenies. The only thing I can boast of is an intact Magelo from when I last played live:

Sadre Spinegnawer - 70 Dark Elf Enchanter [Povar]

Profile of Sadre Spinegnawer - 70 Dark Elf Enchanter [Povar]
eq.magelo.com

Wraith on Quellious was straight DKP, and well, this is what happens when only the MT gets first dibs. I got the second one. Which is, retarded.
Screenshot_2020-10-13 Sadre Spinegnawer - 70 Dark Elf Enchanter [Povar].png
 
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Nirgon

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mkopec said:
Wtf you talking about. Eq back in the day was mapped, pretty much all spawns were plotted, all items or most were discovered and who and where dropped them. This was 1999/2000 and internet was thriving. Not 1986. There were several dedicated spoiler sites like allakhazam that had all the infos you ever needed about EQ.
Click to expand...

Some of the epics took a lot longer than others to figure out. Everything now is day 1 spoiled.
 
Cybsled

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The EQ1 epics were also heavily brute forced because quest design was shit in that game. You'd find step #5 before you ever found steps 1-4.

I got fucked out of server first monk epic because my ISP had an outage for 3 days ;/
 
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