GoT - Is Over, Post Your Drogon Sightings

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I liked the dialog from the book because it really showed that these kingsguard guys were total unapologetic badasses. The matter of fact way they state that they would have pushed Ned's shit in had they been there is awesome. And "Our knees do not bend easily." Maybe thats a rehash from 300, but it was cool when I read it. And "the Kingsguard does not flee". That shit is just cool, it displays some moral absolutism that you don't see much. Jamie killed the king because it seemed like the thing to do at the time. The thing for these guys to do is to surrender. But they're going to go down fighting because they swore a vow. They honored their vow, even if they weren't on the right side of the conflict. It gives you a lot of respect for them, and it makes the scene a lot more poignant and sad because you know they have to kill the "good" guys even though they're on the "bad" side, and doing whats right.

But I think you guys are right in that none of that would really have come across on the show, because nobody is going to know the history of what happened there or who these guys are. So ideally, yes I would have liked to see the scene. Realistically I can see why they chopped it.
 
Lenas

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My problem with the TOJ scene dialogue, aside from the sad shortening of it, is that they also made it way too obvious with the rewrite. The line about being ordered to stay there I thought was too heavy-handed toward, "LOL JON TARG JUST GOT BORN" as if the shit wasn't obvious enough already.
 
D

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Cad_sl said:
But I think you guys are right in that none of that would really have come across on the show, because nobody is going to know the history of what happened there or who these guys are. So ideally, yes I would have liked to see the scene. Realistically I can see why they chopped it.
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To me, its a tip of the cap to the book readers and, even if the show watchers don't understand it all, illustrates just how strange a decision it would be to leave several of the key defenders of the realm back from the battles in the North. I am not sure that if I hadn't read the books, I would feel the same crazy desire to understand WTF was happening in that tower.
 
Gavinmad

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Yeah the only plausible reason for them to still be guarding Lyanna after Rhaegar is dead is if he ordered them to protect his child under the (correct) assumption that Robert would have had the baby killed. I can't think of any other order he would have given them that would still cause them to guard the place after his death.
 
Chukzombi

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in the books, bran calls to somebody that was near the weirwood tree in winterfell. was it theon? he also thought he heard something.
 
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I think the scene as a whole was done well outside of the casting for young Ned. It had a cool fight scene and I was pissed that they blue balled me by not showing me in the tower. And like they said in the behind-the-scenes thing afterwards these flashbacks give a great insight into revisionist history where the story goes Ned won in single combat. But he actually lost a 4v1.
 
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Tenks_sl said:
I think the scene as a whole was done well outside of the casting for young Ned. It had a cool fight scene and I was pissed that they blue balled me by not showing me in the tower. And like they said in the behind-the-scenes thing afterwards these flashbacks give a great insight into revisionist history where the story goes Ned won in single combat. But he actually lost a 4v1.
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The book never said how the battle went though, did it? It just said Ned and Howland were the only ones standing at the end. It does seem to imply that Ned "won" but doesn't say so. I thought it was pretty cool how the show did it, because I was like, if this guy just cut down 4 guys 5v1, how the fuck does Ned beat him 1v1 when he lost 5v1? Well, he doesn't, thats how.

Ned was always portrayed as competent in combat but lacked the accolades of the others.
 
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Cad_sl said:
The book never said how the battle went though, did it? It just said Ned and Howland were the only ones standing at the end. It does seem to imply that Ned "won" but doesn't say so. I thought it was pretty cool how the show did it, because I was like, if this guy just cut down 4 guys 5v1, how the fuck does Ned beat him 1v1 when he lost 5v1? Well, he doesn't, thats how.

Ned was always portrayed as competent in combat but lacked the accolades of the others.
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I don't recall anyone recanting the tell exactly but in the behind the scenes the producer said that is pretty common knowledge in Westerosi lore that Ned won 1v1. I doubt Ned said he won 1v1 (because he didn't) but people just put 2 and 2 together since Ned was unscathed, all the Kingsguard were dead and Howland took a wound which would prevent him from engaging in combat.
 
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Tenks_sl said:
I don't recall anyone recanting the tell exactly but in the behind the scenes the producer said that is pretty common knowledge in Westerosi lore that Ned won 1v1. I doubt Ned said he won 1v1 (because he didn't) but people just put 2 and 2 together since Ned was unscathed, all the Kingsguard were dead and Howland took a wound which would prevent him from engaging in combat.
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Ok. I just don't remember it in the book. Wonder if the producer read something we didn't (GRRM's notes?) or he just thought thats how people perceived it and wanted to break that.
 
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I did a bit of digging and Ned has straight said that Howland saved him and he couldn't defeat Dayne in 1v1 combat. However it isn't like facts are always obeyed when the masses have latched onto a story.
 
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Tenks_sl said:
I did a bit of digging and Ned has straight said that Howland saved him and he couldn't defeat Dayne in 1v1 combat. However it isn't like facts are always obeyed when the masses have latched onto a story.
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Good info, thanks
 
uncognito

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when ned was down on one knee about to get killed, I saw a horse in the backround and was like "woohoo hodor/horse about to save the day!"
 
Gravel

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Soygen_sl said:
Seriously, you fucking dorks nitpick the shit out of this show. There are some lame things, no doubt, but I feel they handledthatdialogue just fine for the show.
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I agree.

I didn't read Game of Thrones; I started reading the series after watching the first season and never went back for the first book. I'm not super gay about wanting to see the ToJ scene, since I only really knew of it from descriptions. I thought the show was fine outside of telegraphing the fact that they're going to draw this shit out all season.

Edit: I also want to point out that I in no way gleaned from that scene that they were members of the Kingsguard. Maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention, or maybe they just didn't have enough dialogue to harp on it.
 
DickTrickle

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Debase_sl said:
This. Here is the dialogue from the book:



How many more seconds would that have taken to show? A minute? Cut that stupid scene with Tyrion before Varys arrives from the interrogation to the small council.
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I think that scene would have worked great even if you didn't read the book. It reads very dramatically. We know who Viserys is, we know there was a rebellion, we obviously know Jaime and his acts. Everything else can be inferred or serve as background. I read the books a very long time ago and didn't remember this exchange but I think it works great with the information present in the show. A shame it was cut down.

Also, could someone refresh my memory, in the books, didn't it seem like Jaime was moving away from Cersei's influence? I remember feeling like he was on a redemptive arc. On the show, though, he's definitely doubled down with Cersei so far.
 
Shonuff

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So...doesn't a hanging seem a bit out of Ned's moral code? I thought a quick decapitation with their magic sword of head chopping +1 was their way? Ned taught them that since they were kids. Hanging can take 30+ minutes, and is banned in the US for being cruel and unusual punishment. Furthermore, why did he hang them and then leave? If his oath was complete when he died, it seems petty and vindictive to kill them, and then drop the mic and GTFO.

What I am getting at, is are we seeing a more vicious Jon Snow, now that he's died and come back? Maybe a book reader can elaborate. Is hanging a Night's Watch thing, or did Jon do it because he thought it would be rad? Is this a less kindler and gentler Jon Snow?
 
SimSimSalabim

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Elurin_sl said:
Edit: I also want to point out that I in no way gleaned from that scene that they were members of the Kingsguard. Maybe I wasn't paying close enough attention, or maybe they just didn't have enough dialogue to harp on it.
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Information that they are Kingsguard is given by their armor, specifically (for me at least) when Dayne puts on his helmet it is very recognizable as the style we often see the Kingsguard wear.

Just regarding the dialogue, though, Ned references that Dayne's King and Prince are dead and he wasn't there protecting them.
 
Chanur

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Probably because it's easier to hang 4 people at once then behead them one at a time.
 
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