ZyyzYzzy
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Marriage and the Power of Divorce
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BrutulTM
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You're getting a bit far out to pasture here. I'm not saying you have to tell your kids that being fat is just awesome, all I'm saying is that fat people should be respected as human beings that have a certain weakness that they are paying a large price for and as such don't deserve to be referred to as a "hambeast piece of shit" for it. It's not black and white by any means, but I think any reasonable person would agree that the kind of abusive language being used in this thread is not a reasonable way for adults to behave towards one another. You guys are setting up a strawman where we either have to have a fat pride parade or treat fat people as less than human. There may exist some person whose doctor told them to lose weight and they ran to a forum and whined about fat shaming but that person is delusional and does not represent most people. The vast majority of fat people are ashamed and unhappy with their situation and want to change but for whatever reason fail to do so. This is their concern and not yours.
Eidal
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And I'm explaining to you why I feel that it ought to be everyone's concern. Look at the rising rate of obesity; its nowhere even close to leveling off. Half my college classes are obese with a handful of morbidly obese (Georgia). These are kids. They're looking to their peer groups and their family and if all they see are people that look just like them, then what kind of message are we sending? This is not a personal problem to be dealt with or neglected in a vacuum; similar to how society changed its tune on smoking a few decades ago, that same social change needs to occur now. Acting like its a personal problem not to be mentioned nor discussed is denying the impact we all have on one another and the means that a social species uses to decide what is proper and what is not.
Your claim that all humans deserve respect is... idealistic? I do agree that internet anonymity tends to bring out the worse in language choice. I get the impression you're a hard working decent man that is fat. I don't think you're a hambeast piece of shit. Now; if I saw you running through multiple drive-throughs so you can gorge yourself on 3k calories of fast food I'd call that a miserable piece of shit habit. I wouldn't say anything at all were this in person, obviously. If I saw you raising a family of obese 12 year old kids I'd also call that miserable piece of shit behavior.
I can empathize with your struggle, acknowledge that you're an overall good human being and a net plus for the world; but I can also staunchly refuse to condone addictive and self destructive behavior OR support society turning a blind eye and referring to it as a personal problem.
BrutulTM
Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
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I am the only person who has provided any data in this discussion. If you have some more relevant study that shows the opposite then feel free to post it. Everyone dies of something and if it's not a bullet to the head or a car wreck, they probably spend a lot of money trying to keep you alive first. Heart disease and diabetes are not particularly more expensive to die from than any other disease. If you think that health care costs increasing as you get older is a controversial idea then you are just ignorant.
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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This is exactly what I mean. You just accept that "it happens to everyone" when they get old, so you don't question her doctors. When it very well could be she didn't need them and her doctor is a crook.
Now I'm not saying your grandmother in particular didn't need these things done, but not a single one of my grandparents or great grandparents has ever gotten a joint replacement. What exactly does giving a 90 year old a shoulder replacement accomplish?
Also, obesity causes a lot more health problems than just diabetes and heart disease. And the very joint replacement surgeries you mentioned are far more likely to be needed for overweight people than healthy individuals.
ZyyzYzzy
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You don't seem to grasp the fact that being unhealthy and obese has a cascading effect. Also you "info" was picked apart and shown taken out of context.
Show me proof that the majority of elderly need joint replacements.
ZyyzYzzy
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More medical care does not mean the majority of people need major surgery for joint replacement as you claim
BrutulTM
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Khane
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I think you're missing the point. Nobody is claiming people don't need more medical care as they get older. We're saying doctors aren't puritanically ethical people by default. Many corrupt physicians exist, and our privatized healthcare system enables them. A lot of healthcare can be passed off as "necessary" when it's not even close to necessary. A very elderly woman going in for joint replacement surgeries seems very suspect.
My dad's side grandmother was in the doctor's office like 3 times a week with made up shit and they'd gladly run whatever tests she wanted because they saw her as a walking payday. I think half the time she did it just because she was lonely and it would force my parents to pick her up, drive her there and she'd then interact with the doctor for a while. My other grandmother who is in a nursing home goes to the doctor far, far less.
BrutulTM
Good, bad, I'm the guy with the gun.
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Why is it suspect? Do you know anyone who has gotten a joint replacement? I know lots of people that have had them and it is a life changing surgery. It will take you from being in constant pain and being barely able to use a limb to having full use of the joint again. I don't doubt that some doctors do unnecessary procedures and tests to make money but I will promise you that none of my grandmother's joint replacements were taken lightly by her or her doctors, and the hip was done because she broke it. Also, her doctor actually talked her out of having heart surgery because he didn't feel that the extra time it might buy her was worth the pain that the recovery would require. Coming back from surgery at that age is a brutal process.
Frenzied Wombat
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I would think that performing superfluous tests on the elderly would be anything but a "payday" since it all gets paid by medicare, and my understanding is that doctors want to do the minimum amount of medicare related work because it pays shit.
Cad
scientia potentia est
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Fast Facts: Economic Costs of Obesity: The State of Obesity
Obesity Now Costs Americans More In HealthCare Spending Than Smoking - Forbes
Obesity and the Rising Cost of Healthcare in America | Fair Food Network
Direct medical cost of overweight and obesity in the United States: a quantitative systematic review
http://www.reuters.com/article/2012/...83T0C820120430
Khane
Got something right about marriage
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Plenty of elderly people still have private insurance. And they do strictly because doctors are more apt to want medicare and medicaid patients out of their office ASAP. You're right, they won't treat medicare patients as a payday.
Mures
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But when its the only thing you got...I work in the auto industry and mechanics bitch about doing warranty/insurance work because it pays "shit", but if there is nothing else to do, it is better than nothing.
ZyyzYzzy
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Nester
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^^^Lets get back on topic here, we're getting a bit far from the whole married/divorced stuff.
