Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

B

bolok

Trakanon Raider
1,399
788
mkopec said:
Look, they can make whatever the fuck game they wanna make. Its their shit. But we can also discuss it here. and people are not going to play their game all special snowflake like they want. People will get on and rush to end game like they have been doing since 2000. And then they willl bitch and moan there is no end game...Blah blah blah..... It is what it is and what mmorpg will always be. Youre not going to change the behavior of the vast majority of mmorpg players.
Click to expand...
People are free to shoot themselves in the dick all they want. I don't think it gives anyone the right to complain that the game isn't mario kart when literally everything about the game explains that hey... this isn't mario kart.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
mkopec

mkopec

<Gold Donor>
28,126
44,253
bolok said:
People are free to shoot themselves in the dick all they want. I don't think it gives anyone the right to complain that the game isn't mario kart when literally everything about the game explains that hey... this isn't mario kart.
Click to expand...
People are not going to read their bullshit descriptions. They will see "Hey a new mmorog! Buy it and play it. Then they will just quit and you guys will be left with 400 RPers to play with. Like Pantheon is right now.
 
Last edited:
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
mkopec

mkopec

<Gold Donor>
28,126
44,253
Mrniceguy said:
You honestly fell for that shit? No, they can, they choose not to.



Adding instances removes so many chance for emergent gameplay. No thx.
Click to expand...
Yeah such awesome emergent gameplay, sitting in a fucking corner pulling same 4 mobs over and over. Then someone trains your ass and takes your camp. No thx.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
Mrniceguy

Mrniceguy

Blackwing Lair Raider
961
510
"THeRe IsN'T GoING TO BE ENouGH MoBS!!!!"
"SomEBoDY iIZ GOinG TO TraIN Me WiTh The MoBZ thAt Don'T exist"

IDK man i guess just go cry moar.
 
moonarchia

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord
<Bronze Donator>
29,901
58,134
Grim1 said:
First thing I learned to do when playing EQ was training the zone at Blackburrow on my lvl 6 rogue while running for my life. First time I did that I zoned back in and there were corpses everywhere. I laughed and kept doing it until a GM told me that wasn't cool. I thought it was part of the design, was such a noob.

Still one of my favorite gaming experiences ever.

I rerolled a SK and learned how to FD my trains on other groups to get their camps. That was a ton of fun. Then joined a guild at the endgame who were grade a jerks and we destroyed anyone who tried to take our dragons. Eventually the GMs stepped in and made us rotate a boss schedule with the other top guilds. That is when EQ became less fun. Still played it for years though.

I hear you about not ruining other peoples fun. But if you carebear everything then the game will be extremely boring. Instancing is the ultimate carebear trap. People will create problems no matter how much you try to isolate them. So give them a space to do that, but keep out the extremes. Besides, the flame wars on the forums in early EQ were almost as fun to read as playing the game.
Click to expand...
The vast majority of players are carebears. Always been that way. That's why you have to keep that in mind when designing any MMO. If you don't, they aren't going to stay and pay. If there were enough PVP players to support a game, then there would be MMOs that succeeded that way. EVE is the only one in 30 years. I enjoyed the hell out of Warhammer Online, but even that died after a few years.

It is just another issue that leads back to why people play games. Everyone wants to be the hero. No one wants to be the zero. The biggest reason why instancing is needed is rooted in just that. Everyone who pays a sub deserves to be able to play every part of the game. You can't do that with camps being a thing in an open world game. You can blend things a bit, let everyone who hits a mob get loot and kill credit.
 
  • 1Like
Reactions: 1 user
B

bolok

Trakanon Raider
1,399
788
Kirun said:
Why would it not be in a big companies' interest but it would be in MnM's?
Click to expand...
Volume mostly. You can handwave all kinds of stuff when you numbers get big enough. Nameless bots and scammers look just as good on the big boys bottom line and their impact on "actual" customers is assuaged by posts saying they banned x many accounts. They can get by with ignoring it all doing a pr post and maybe sucking up some obvious candidates via some automated tooling. Paying actual people- nah. It's counter productive to the line go up on a quarterly report. I had plenty of GM tickets on wow just get closed. I and most of guild ended up quitting because the game got aids, but none of them ever quit after Blizz "the small indy company" completely botched or ignored their ticket/report.

Now i expect that the m&m population will be actually be small enough at the start that customer service can't be just a line item. It's telling that they've been talking up their CS dashboards and tools for a bit now. That's going to have an outsized influence early on. Especially if they mean to enforce their ingame camp rules etc.

Not that I particularly expect it to happen, but on the off chance it is a huge success- scaling that is going to be rough.
 
B

bolok

Trakanon Raider
1,399
788
moonarchia said:
The vast majority of players are carebears. Always been that way. That's why you have to keep that in mind when designing any MMO. If you don't, they aren't going to stay and pay. If there were enough PVP players to support a game, then there would be MMOs that succeeded that way. EVE is the only one in 30 years. I enjoyed the hell out of Warhammer Online, but even that died after a few years.

It is just another issue that leads back to why people play games. Everyone wants to be the hero. No one wants to be the zero. The biggest reason why instancing is needed is rooted in just that. Everyone who pays a sub deserves to be able to play every part of the game. You can't do that with camps being a thing in an open world game. You can blend things a bit, let everyone who hits a mob get loot and kill credit.
Click to expand...
I've done that. I've done that soo many times. There are 100s of games that provide that. There will be 100s more that believe in this weird everyone gets a shot commie utopia. I have zero interest in paying for everyone gets a wack at it again. You cannot be the hero tier if you didn't struggle for it. If you cannot fail the challenge is insulting. Therefore i'm willing to pay for this game for a change.

*i'm not that motivated really, but just instance it bro makes my motivation to even try negative.
 
moonarchia

moonarchia

The Scientific Shitlord
<Bronze Donator>
29,901
58,134
bolok said:
I've done that. I've done that soo many times. There are 100s of games that provide that. There will be 100s more that believe in this weird everyone gets a shot commie utopia. I have zero interest in paying for everyone gets a wack at it again. You cannot be the hero tier if you didn't struggle for it. If you cannot fail the challenge is insulting. Therefore i'm willing to pay for this game for a change.

*i'm not that motivated really, but just instance it bro makes my motivation to even try negative.
Click to expand...
If there are better ways to get rid of soft pvp and allow everyone to take part in the game, I would love to see them. Adding instances doesn't regulate anything other than making the content accessible. You can make a grindy as fuck game while having instances. FFXIV top tier raiding is like this, and a lot of mog maxxing in that game as well.

The hero fantasy is the major driving force in MMOs, so you do have to make most of that available. Everyone wants to slay the dragons. Everyone wants to explore the world. Etc. Etc. Good game design enables that instead of hindering it.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.