Overwatch

Noodleface

A Mod Real Quick
37,961
14,508
When I play hammond I immediately dive snipers. They're so easy to take out.

I would guess Mei will be banned a lot. She makes games very frustrating.
 

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
10,244
7,593
Long Tigoles post

TLDR: Hero bans aren't coming, They do condone one-tricking, Balance patches are coming more often.


I’ve seen a lot of discussion about hero bans the past few days and I just wanted to offer some perspective on the topic. As always, the OW has a wide variety of opinions about the concept. Interestingly, we don’t have many people on the team vehemently arguing for the feature. More of us, including myself, are reluctant to add hero bans to Overwatch. As I’ve said before, we’re not of the mindset that we’re opposed to the idea entirely and will never add them. But overall, there are a number of issues that make us want to proceed carefully.

Coming at this from a game design focus, the number one thing we ask is, “what is the problem that we’re trying to solve?” We’re not fans of just adding ideas that are in other games “just because”. We call this bottom-up design. Sometimes the right design decision for one game, is a terrible decision for another game – even if the two games are very similar. For example, with World of Warcraft we did not impose forced grouping, a slow leveling curve and a punishing death penalty with level loss “just because” the other successful MMO’s had those features at the time. And as a player of those other MMO’s, I thought they were the correct decision for those games. But not for WoW.

When I hear why people want hero bans, the conversation usually revolves around a few reasons (I’m sure there are more):

 People do not like that the meta stagnates. They believe with hero bans, they will be able to “ban out” the meta heroes thus moving the meta. In general, the meta not moving is perceived by the player-base as bad
 People are frustrated with the balance of certain heroes. With hero bans, they feel like they can “ban out” the heroes they are frustrated with
 People do not like playing against certain heroes. With hero bans, they feel like they can “ban out” a hero they don’t want to play against

As a team, we agree with and understand that players want the meta to be more fluid and move more frequently. Even though the vast majority of players only experience the meta through OWL, feedback from GM’s, streamers and YouTubers, we get that the perception of a stale meta is not good for the game. We absolutely have plans to help move the meta more and we’ll be talking about these in an upcoming developer update. We get it. We agree. Make the meta move faster. Ok.

But just implementing hero bans does not mean the meta will move. Studying other games, the end result is usually a “ban meta”. The downside of a ban meta, is that players are often at odds with each other when someone on their team bans an “off-ban-meta” hero. The same frustrations that players experience with the meta exist in a ban meta. Hero bans are not a silver bullet solution to making the meta move. If the problem we are trying to solve is that the meta needs to change more, hero bans might actually make the problem worse, not better. We do a have a solution in mind – an actual system – that we’ll talk about (next week’s dev update) but it is not hero bans.

In regards to players wanting to ban for balance reasons, the way we plan to address this is with more frequent balance updates. The upcoming dev update will go in depth into the plan and shed light on how we’re going to accomplish this. So we agree that there are balance issues. We agree balancing needs to happen more frequently. We disagree that hero bans are a good solution to balance problems. To us, removing a hero from play because of balance reasons feels like a sledgehammer.

The other reason I listed was that people do not like playing against certain heroes. To this, I am going to give an answer that is not going to be very popular. Basically, it’s a PvP game. You don’t get to pick what the enemy team does. The challenge is overcoming the enemy team with teamwork, ingenuity and skill. It feels really off to me that the other team dictates how or what I play. So if your reason is that you don’t want to play against certain heroes, I think we’ll agree to disagree on this point. We’ve changed out minds in the past. But that’s where we’re at for now.

I hear a lot of people attack hero bans because they only want to play one hero, or “one trick”… To this, I think our stance is pretty clear. Overwatch is a game about mastering many heroes. We don’t expect you to master them all, but you should play a few of the characters. Now, we don’t explicitly prevent you from only playing one hero. But we also don’t encourage it. We think the game is more fun for everyone involved if you play at least a handful of the heroes. That’s how the game is designed. So defending “one tricking” does not factor in for us when it comes to our opinion on hero bans. We want the meta to move more and one tricking contributes to meta issues. Again, we’re not against one-tricking but we’re not going to overly enable or encourage it. That’s our stance.

There are a few other reasons, we’re reluctant to pursue hero bans at this time as well. We’ve been really pushing for faster match times (there’s a lot going on under the hood on this one). Our philosophy is the game is better if you have quicker matches. The sting of defeat is much less if the match took less time. We’re constantly talking about ways to speed up rounds of OW to allow you to play more. Introducing a “ban phase” to the start of every OW round would add significant time. Your overall time spent on an average night of OW actually shooting stuff would be less. This concerns us a lot. There is also a huge development cost to adding the feature as well (the time commitment would be significant). This last reason is not the one that’s driving our decision making. If we thought it was right for the game (like with Role Queue) we would absolutely make the investment.

I’m looking forward to sharing next week’s development update with you all… I think it will clarify things a bit. But in the meantime, I wanted to tell you where we’re at with hero bans specifically since so much misinformation is being spread right now. I hope those of you in favor of the system don’t go too “doomsday” over this news without having the full picture. Information will be available next week on the plan to balance faster and keep the meta moving. We agree on the problems. That’s the important thing.
 

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
10,244
7,593

RIP Orisa and SIgma. GGS

I'm glad I didn't spend my CP points on her gun.

A real Hanzo nerf finally too. I would say RIP to him, but plebs will still play him and throw with him.

Overwatch PTR Patch Notes – Jan 23, 2020
A new Overwatch patch is in development and now available for testing! To share your feedback or report any issues, please post in the PTR Feedback 30 or PTR Bug Report 11 forums.
Please note that the below patch notes only include changes currently available for testing on the PTR. While many of these changes may also be available on PlayStation 4 and Xbox One in a future patch, the PTR is PC-only and only reflects changes coming specifically to that platform.

HERO UPDATES

Hanzo
Storm Arrows
  • Damage reduced from 70 to 60
McCree
General
  • Base health increased from 200 to 250
Peacekeeper (Primary Fire)
  • Recovery time increased from 0.42 to 0.5 seconds
Deadeye
  • Firing Deadeye no longer locks the player’s aim
Reaper
The Reaping (Passive)
  • Healing amount reduced from 40% to 30% of damage dealt
Orisa
Fusion Driver (Primary Fire)
  • Damage reduced from 11 to 9
Fortify
  • Cooldown increased from 8 to 10 seconds
Halt!
  • Snare duration reduced from 1 to 0.65 seconds
Sigma
Hyperspheres (Primary Fire)
  • Range reduced from 22 to 20 meters
Gravitic Flux
  • Can now be interrupted before targets begin falling
  • Impact slow duration reduced from 0.9 to 0.6 seconds
Accretion
  • Explosion damage reduced from 60 to 40
Baptiste
Biotic Launcher (Primary Fire)
  • Recovery time increased from 0.36 to 0.45 sec
Biotic Launcher (Secondary Fire)
  • Heal explosion reduced from 60 to 50
 
Last edited:

Noodleface

A Mod Real Quick
37,961
14,508
Jeez at this point why even have sigma in the game. He's already hard to play if the other tank refuses to shield too
 

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
10,244
7,593
It's even worse for Orisa. When her shield goes down in two seconds she needs her fortify because her head is so freaking huge. She goes down like she is made of paper. They should just limit teams to one shield tank and that's it.

Oh well, the nerf brigade will move on to Hammond after the patch goes live.
 

Valderen

Space Pirate
<Bronze Donator>
4,450
2,621
Those are fairly significant changes, I'm curious to see how it'll play out.

It's pretty nice for me personally, as I don't play any of the nerfed heroes, and McCree is my 2nd most played DPS. Also might enable Winston now, which already started to be playable with the last patch...nerfs to Sigman, Orissa, Reaper, and Hanzo help him.
 

Blazin

Creative Title
<Nazi Janitors>
6,395
33,549
Seems they have made a decision that they want to speed the game up, faster deaths all around moving it back closer to the pacing at release.
 

SorrowsEnd

Trakanon Raider
1,453
756
I don't understand the constant nerfs to tanks when nobody wants to tank anyway.

Sigma is being gutted hard. Nerfing literally his entire kit when he can still get shut down instantly by a single mei walking straight at him.
 

Valderen

Space Pirate
<Bronze Donator>
4,450
2,621
Tanks have generally always dictated the meta. So making changes there is the easiest way to have the meta shift a bit. Especially when a meta is considered not fun, such as double barrier for most people.
 

Ravishing

Uninspiring Title
<Bronze Donator>
8,452
3,577
"Shield tanks" should be considered supports more than tanks.
OW seems to lack "DPS tanks"... basically just Roadhog.. maybe Dva.
I'm not sure where Hammond & Sigma fall exactly, they are a lot more interesting than the other tanks, just hard to play.

OW seems to avoid straight up "Tanks".

I'm talking Cho'Gath (LoL) type champion with tons of health, gets bigger/tankier, and does burst damage.

Tanks having to be played as "supports" really hurts the archetype, whereas in LoL there are a ton of tanks I don't mind playing.


LoL Tanks:
Alistar
Amumu
Braum
Cho'Gath
Galio
Gragas
Leona
Malphite
Maokai
Nautilus
Nunu
Ornn
Poppy
Rammus
Sejuani
Shen
Sion
Tahm Kench
Taric
Zac


I can easily see 90% of this list being converted to an OW hero and mostly fitting right in.
How they happened upon a majority of tanks being Supporty-Shield tanks is beyond me.

And the only reason I make this post is because the last sessions I played this game (a month ago), I basically tanked the entire time because of Queue times.
 

Noodleface

A Mod Real Quick
37,961
14,508
Hammond is a special role where he's basically a disruptor tank. He's sort of a mix between dva and winston, with more health/shields and mobility. He's hard to get into but once you do he's very fun. He also has a huge carry potential.
 

Araxen

Golden Baronet of the Realm
10,244
7,593
OWL is going to be YouTube exclusively this season. They won't be on Twitch.

Edit: The new Florida Mayhem colors make for sexy skins. I bought the Mei one(with afk farmed OWL tokens). lol
 
Last edited: