Convo
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO
- Thread starter gogojira_sl
- Start date
Muligan
Trakanon Raider
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Since someone mentioned it... can we please have pulling as part of the game again. I never really liked playing a monk personally but in group and raid situations, it really immersed me further into the game know those guys were really using some skill to make it happen. Not to say that Monks were the only pulling classes but I have an appreciation for that aspect of the game.
*typo
*typo
Tuco
I got Tuco'd!
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That's kind of weird, here I am just having fun posting about MMO design because this community is knowledgeable and has good ideas to bounce off of.
popsicledeath
Potato del Grande
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Quineloe
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Why even have a cap? EQ raiding worked fine without a cap. Did people just zerg down cutting edge content? no.
Laura
Lord Nagafen Raider
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I really hope Brad adapts EQ combat system and with that combat system we'll get back all these amazing group-mechanics where pulling actually make sense, CC make sense, debuffing make sense. I so want pulling to be part of the game and all these really fun mechanics that are long gone like necro twitching clerics, bards playing mana songs, wizards evaccuating, and rangers dying.
Slow paced combat which encourages "efficiency" as in how good your puller is keeping your XP group busy while at the same time how good your cleric is keeping up with healing and not going OOM (resource management). I'd play this kind of game any day over any action-oriented, whack-a-mole play-the-action-bar bullshit.
Tuco
I got Tuco'd!
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tad10
Elisha Dushku
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I don't remember. Did you play VG? Basically a lot of the need for this kind of specing went away with classes build around OT/DT combat such as the Bloodmage or Disciple or VG Paladin or etc. Before I'm attacked by ex VG Warriors - I'll admit that the particular class you're talkinga bout (Warrior) was gimped in VG (IIRC) but that was a design problem specific to that class that could have been fixed if launch hadn't been such a disaster.
This is why I think the most important design decision for Pantheon is for Brad & Co. to bring back the OT/DT combat system.
@Bilbo - if you get to level 50 as a tank and decide you'd rather be pure DPS then you need to reroll a Rogue or Ranger or whatever.
tad10
Elisha Dushku
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I think this will remain the biggest bone of contention on these boards: VG Combat vs. EQ Combat. You can't do both. I'd play with EQ Combat, but I'd be missing VG Combat.
tad10
Elisha Dushku
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You seem to have a serious misunderstanding as to the purpose of, and what is normal for, an Internet discussion board concerned with gaming.
Very , very much with you on this. I'm filthy casual now , but still a decent player knowing how to conserve mana , heal when needed accordingly and so on. But I have never once cared if my dps was 200.006 per second or 200.020 per second as some seem to live and die by, nor have I cared if others in the group were. I would get much more fun out of open , large scale EQ style raids where you bring the whole crew, making sure to have your good tank and healers and come one come all for the rest.
I just don't care if a friend or stranger gets "carried" somewhat , it's just fun to be in the virtual fantasy world killing a lich demi-god.
Laura
Lord Nagafen Raider
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I like the OT/DT from VG that should definitely be in (it would be a shame if it's not included).
But I honestly didn't like most of Vanguard combat. I remember my Dread Knight having lots of "reactive" and "chain" skills. I'm not a big fan of that system. It wouldn't make me disregard the game though. If the game is really group focused and achieved to do 80% of what we expect of it I can see myself actually enjoying the combat if the resources matter (HP/Mana/Energy take time to regenerate in which encourage grouping and class interdependency in my opinion).
Quineloe
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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I'm not aware of any examples, which raid bosses were zerged down when by a massive force, say 80+, of unskilled players while they were the current top content of the latest expansion. I know of one guild that zerged down Derakor the Vindicator with 108, but that one hardly counts as cutting edge content of velious.
Cabales
Trakanon Raider
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I agree with this to a point. I'd like the option to bring 72 people again, but I don't want the devs to feel that every encounter has to be tuned to be challenging for a 72 man raid. In EQ the option was there to take down content with a smaller more skilled group or to throw numbers at it if you're skill level and teamwork were not so good. The downside to zerging everything with sheer numbers was that the amount of loot dropped did not increase just because you brought more people, so it took longer to gear up the folks in your raid force.
I think the primary things that I'd like to see in Brad's MMO are:
Fewer but more meaningful loot upgrades. I want to look forward to the pieces of loot I get and I want the hunt for them to be memorable. If I'm going to replace that new piece of gear two more times in this play session then I don;t care about it.
I aslo want to see end game content remain relevant for several expansions. I hate the gear reset with every expansion, and now every patch, in WoW. I'm not saying it should never become irrelevant, but it should last longer then a single expansion.
BilboFaggins
N00b
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God no. I wouldn't give up the money I make in financial software development to go make games and live with 7 other dudes in a one bedroom apartment
Glad I'm not the only one who feels this way. These 24 man raids are so exclusionary. Having your "A Team" raiding squad is great, of course you want your best players raiding, but when your cutting out 50% of your guild from raiding isn't that defying the entire point? I miss hearing a raid announced and fucking EVERYONE could show up, including recruits. "Just stand in the corner, don't move, and don't do anything stupid". Their class leaders tell em what the fuck is going on so when they are geared up and ready, they know what the fuck they are doing.
That and just having a guild of actual friends. Seems like guilds are not friends anymore, just a collection of good players. You join a guild based on your "ranking" so to speak. Last raiding guild I was in, I barely knew anyone's name and really didn't care. The way MMO's are designed now, why should anyone care? You don't really need anyone outside of raiding. You show up at 7, raid, then everyone goes their separate ways. I miss the family aspect of guilds. Shit back in EQ, I had a list of everyones home phone number! I knew who they were, what they did, I knew their family members.....In the race to make every single game like WOW, they have gutted the very reasons people played MMO's to began with.
Lambourne
Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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Hope Brad can work his magic and get the game back in the game world instead of on the user interface. Camp breaking, pulling, kiting, mob positioning and all that good stuff. Not "5 seconds left, press X to not die" flashing on the screen. "In combat" can go away as well, interface is there for me to interact with the game world, not to hinder me in doing so.
This is what made me love EQ and why a monk with 4 hotkeys was more fun to play than many other game's classes with 40.
This is what made me love EQ and why a monk with 4 hotkeys was more fun to play than many other game's classes with 40.
tad10
Elisha Dushku
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I agree about the overuse of reactive and chain skills in VG - it all got a bit much.
The most fun I ever had with a class in any MMO to date is probably EQ bard. It felt so weird and experimental compared to most classes in MMOs afterwards, and was so interesting to play. I hated twisting after awhile, but pulling with lulls/FM, being able to switch out cool group buffs, and having a ton of utility was so fun. I hope to see neat classes like bard, disciple, and blood mage in addition to the usual suspects.
No I'm with you on that. In short I played EQ to enjoy the fantasy world , text chat IRC style , and enjoy the experience overall both socializing with random strangers , guild mates , and real life friends on the same server. In an almost relaxing style. At the time , if I got the itch to play "competitive" I fired up Tribes and grabbed the laser rifle to see how many pilots I could snipe , or Myth The Fallen Lords tournaments and so on.
EQ , and mmo's in general , were my relaxing "escape" , where I would spend a night with my high level druid buffing level 8's in the east commons and enjoy the simple thanks and "hey I remember you helping me before" , all the while getting zero xps/AA's , but still enjoying it as much as "progressing". I can't stand the fucking idea of showing a spec sheet , equip check before being allowed to be in a group.