Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Tannlin_sl said:

Definitely have a limited load.

Also, if you're going to have stat modifiers on gear, it allows players to build with gear and skills. For example, "+fire damage on gear" for a wizard class, who them 'loads up' spells that do Fire Damage, and dropping Arcane or Water spells.

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Yes. Look to ARPGs for itemization. So much cool stuff you can do when you can have things like +skills and +% elemental damage.

Kreugen_sl said:

If you have 100 spells and can only mem 8 you'll wind up with a dozen spell sets that you are constantly swapping between.

A better system would be limitedcombatspells but no limitations on out of combat abilities. This solves the annoyance of needing to swap buffs or out of combat utility spells in and out. Also, a lot of those abilities could be passive slots. This gives players more choices to make without adding buttons to smash.

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8 anything buttons. 2 for melee/ranged auto attack. And an AA for buffers that gives them 1-4 additional hot buttons just for buffs.

should probably start at 6 buttons and increase to 10 as you level.

Soygen_sl said:

I agree with this. Make the 'load out' for when you're in combat only, but have access to all your utility stuff when not in combat.

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It would be interesting to see an MMO that doesn't use in combat mechanics ( not sure if there us one that does this). Certain normal out if combat abilities would be disabled for a minute if you attacked something, but only for 20 seconds if you were hit by something. Would add some
interesting combat options. Keep the healer from being hit for 20 secs so he can cast a Rez type of stuff. You would have to have smart AI to address healers healing out of group... I think that would keep things more fluid rather than living in and out of combat.

You guys are thinking so last gen. I want voice commands.

LIGHTNING BOLT

Limited load out here also , 10'ish.

Also with Merlin on the grouping bit , instant port group finders immediately destroys the world feel.

Last for now , Brad's post about assuming you will have mmo experience etc is another great one to read. It's great to know this won't be hand holding 101 mmo.

Limited slots.

I would advocate for a game with no autoattacks, but a series of abilities that synergize with each other that you use in specific situations. This way you can spend more time playing the game, moving around and less time mashing keys.

Need threat? Hit your 1-2-3 combo. Need to defend hit your A-B combo and maybe the B and the 2 are the same ability. But you knock off those combos every 5-10 seconds during combat as needed. DPSing? Ready up a decent combo, pull it off and go back to positioning and looking for openings.

Aradune_sl said:

What do you guys feel about a spell/ability system where you have a fixed number of slots, so even if you know 100 spells, you can only mem a few at a time. Or, do you prefer the 'as long as I have mana' I can cast what I want?

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Fixed slots, made players somewhat unique before we had talent trees and such.

Draegan_sl said:

I would advocate for a game with no autoattacks, but a series of abilities that synergize with each other that you use in specific situations. This way you can spend more time playing the game, moving around and less time mashing keys.

Need threat? Hit your 1-2-3 combo. Need to defend hit your A-B combo and maybe the B and the 2 are the same ability. But you knock off those combos every 5-10 seconds during combat as needed. DPSing? Ready up a decent combo, pull it off and go back to positioning and looking for openings.

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There are a bunch of mmos with no auto attack and spazzy combat existing or coming out soon I don't think we need another.

tad10_sl said:

There are a bunch of mmos with no auto attack and spazzy combat existing or coming out soon I don't think we need another.

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Which ones have no auto attack?

If I'm going to be following a group around all day I'd rather have as much auto-attack as possible.

WoW might as well have no auto attack at this point since active abilities have taken over like 95% of the damage you do.

Draegan_sl said:

Which ones have no auto attack?

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dcuo, eqnext, I thought wildstar too. Others I'm forgetting (aoc?)

I prefer a system like EQ with a large amount of spells/abilities per class but limited set of usable spells where most of those spells offer utility like Kreugen suggests. I think 10-15 is a good number. Each class is going to have core skills no matter what (Rogue backstab, Shaman slow, Cleric heals etc) that everyone will always have ready, but what defines a player should be how they use their utility skills. A game feels deeper to me when I have to strategize depending on the encounters I'm about to face. There should be a good marriage of strategy (which abilities to have on the ready based on what will happen over the entirety of a dungeon) and tactics (using those spells during individual combat encounters effectively). It's what separates a good player from a bad one.

I shouldn't have to have lightning quick reflexes or own a g13 to excel at my class in an MMO. Nothing is more frustrating than missing a skill because I hit h instead of j while trying to reach halfway across my keyboard in the .5 second window I was allotted by the developers. I prefer a system where a player is defined by his character management as much as his raw skill at reacting to a battle and part of that is knowing what skills are good in which scenarios and knowing how to prioritize.

Inevitably when you have dozens of skills for each class and each class can use all those skills anytime they want the developers design encounters around a player always having everything. It's not too dissimilar to the initial TBC raid design. It was designed around needing every single consumable in the game simply because they were available. Instead, with a limited load out I feel developers can design around small nuances. Didn't mem your silence and instead memmed your mana tap? Your tank is going take big nuke damage, but that's ok if your wizard memmed his limited duration spell shield. If he didn't you're dead but if he did your group can defeat this encounter in a different way than another group might have.

Gnomedolf_sl said:

One thing I loved about EQ was that the faction/religion you chose for your character mattered. It affected how NPC's and quest givers interacted with you. It dictated where you could and could not go. That adds a ton of Flavor(tm) to the game.

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YUP... this!

Draegan_sl said:

There are plenty of ways to do things easily enough. Flag abilities as combat and non combat and set aside UI space for both. Utility based spells can be placed in an unlimited space while combat spells are limited to some fashion. I love deck building mechanics and the strategy of prepping for fights. Keeps the UI bloat down as well for the most part.

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Yeah this works too. Though I wouldn't go unlimited.

Gnomedolf_sl said:

One thing I loved about EQ was that the faction/religion you chose for your character mattered. It affected how NPC's and quest givers interacted with you. It dictated where you could and could not go. That adds a ton of Flavor(tm) to the game.

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Yes, this adds to immersion greatly and makes decisions count more.