Sovereign Citizens

Screamfeeder

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The real "point" of soverign citizen is that as a citizen we DO HAVE RIGHTS that "being a cop" does not just magically destroy.
You have rights...IN A SYSTEM.

Tape that shit, document that shit, prepare that shit and then display that shit in a way that the judge can help you out. if these soverign citizens weren't such total dickbags, they could bring a lawsuit against a department or city and maybe get a little payout.

Instead they choose to be totally oblivious to their surroundings and how the actual law works.

Look I hate fucking cops and judges and lawyers. They are pieces of shit. But it's so fucking easy to NOT BE A DIPSHIT.
 
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mkopec

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Cops can also break into your house, knock your door down if they suspect you doing some wrong shit without a warrant as well at least im pretty sure they can. Say like you ran from the cops, they followed you home.

I cant believe you say without due cause, the dude had cause he was resisting an officer.
 
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Ambiturner

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Yes, and the guy was complying he was going to explain his stance - that is what he got out, his 3 ring binder of sovereign citizen sayings - the cop, if the guy is being peaceful and is compliant - and technically he was - should wait it out and as I said, give the last resort of detainment for the 24-48 hours - and when he says "am I being detained" he can say "yes" - that "am I being detained?!" line is a basis off of, if you do a simple transgression like, speeding or jaywalking it is a ticket, NOT a detainment and if THAT is the justification FOR detainment you can sue or seek damages as it is not legitimate.

The cop was 100% the aggressor ripping out the dudes window then pulling him out of his car and tazering him many times.

You have no idea what the fuck you're talking about.
 
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Siliconemelons

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Oh he should make a case, that is generally the point in doing all of that and being sure you video tape it etc.

He was complying - after he presented his item for ID or gave his speech about this that and the other - he did not really do anything to result in the amount of force dished out upon him. Usually the "ID" is a home made document stating some obscure law about "traveling" and whatever.

Yes this is all a bunch of bullshit to take time and frustrate the officer as much as he is frustrating the citizen. We all have rights, the cop should have been more patient with a non-aggressor - the cop never asked him to keep his hands were he could see them, or anything to give him "cause" that the guy going to get his binder was going for a gun, no one that is going to shoot a PO is going to film themselves, not even inventors are that dull (....are they?)

and yes, BOTH sides should be decided in court, NOT on the side of the road, a cop is not a judge and jury - until Dredd is out there that is.
 

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“Here Officer White, let me just totally obscure your view of me by shoving this piece of paper up against the window, what could go wrong!?”
 
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Sludig

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I hope that guy got a mad payout from the cops and that cop is no longer working and his pension stripped.

Sovereign citizen shit is shit, but there are certain states, counties etc. that have specific laws that do protect people from not having to have issues id, DL etc. etc. etc. The dude in the car was fine, the cop needed to let him do his stupid shit, say his scripted lines, quote his state and local statues - then the cop can just do the standard bull, give the ticket anyway or use his ability to detain him for 24hr or whatever.

70ish in a 45? yeah not cool... but breaking the dudes window- then tazing him for...what?

As a libertarian I am on the fence generally with this - there is a balance that is to be had... in this case, the cop was way way wrong.
I always knew you had a case of the dumbs.
 
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TJT

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I’ve been fascinated by sovereign dorks ever since I read this paper years ago:
Tenting, Toll, and Taxing
The author sets out to explain the ancient origins of taxation and the tldr is that, originally, a real sovereign is someone who claims ownership of land and then defends it by meeting any form of trespass with a threat of mortal combat. A tax is the money you pay to a sovereign in order to avoid him trying to literally murder you and is at the same time an acknowledgement that he is the one who owns the land even though you are standing on it, temperarily or otherwise.

So basically, the old adage of ‘’might makes right” is historically accurate. The sovereign is the sovereign because he can and will literally kill you. Nowadays sovereignties wield their putative might via police forces, laws, courts, etc. and the military but it’s really no different. The ONLY way some redneck incel is going to achieve sovereignty is by doing what the character Raven in Neal Stephenson’s novel Snow Crash did: hard wire a live nuke to their vitals such that if they die, there is a thermonuclear explosion. In the book, Raven is a true sovereign; He goes where he wants and does what he wants because he carries deadly force that’s effective against other sovereigns (every government’s foreign policy includes the dictum “Don’t fuck with Raven”).

If you want to be a real sovereign, start murdering anyone who disagrees with your claim. But even then, you’re probably not a sovereign until people who don’t know you start giving you money to be on your land in order to avoid getting murdered. Whining about the intent of the constitution to get out of a ticket will just get you tased.


Dude also carried said nuke in a motorcycle sidecar and had, "Poor Impulse Control" tattooed to his forehead. He also killed tons of people with glass knives and harpoons.

Behold. The True Sovereign Citizen.

Raven_800.jpg
 
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Ambiturner

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Oh he should make a case, that is generally the point in doing all of that and being sure you video tape it etc.

He was complying - after he presented his item for ID or gave his speech about this that and the other - he did not really do anything to result in the amount of force dished out upon him. Usually the "ID" is a home made document stating some obscure law about "traveling" and whatever.

Yes this is all a bunch of bullshit to take time and frustrate the officer as much as he is frustrating the citizen. We all have rights, the cop should have been more patient with a non-aggressor - the cop never asked him to keep his hands were he could see them, or anything to give him "cause" that the guy going to get his binder was going for a gun, no one that is going to shoot a PO is going to film themselves, not even inventors are that dull (....are they?)

and yes, BOTH sides should be decided in court, NOT on the side of the road, a cop is not a judge and jury - until Dredd is out there that is.

Holy shit you're fucking dumb.

I doubt anything happened to the officer and I'm sure the "traveler" got obstruction and/or resisting charges added on if anything. If an officer witnesses you committing a crime you legally have to identify yourself and anything you do to willfully hinder or delay an investigation is a separate crime you can be charged with. Saying they can't detain you because something is "just a ticket" means you're too dumb to be posting here. A citation is just a document saying that you will appear in court for the listed charges. You absolutely can be arrested for traffic offenses it's just standard practice not to as it's generally not worth the time and resources.

If you get pulled over and refuse to follow any instructions then roll up your window, then expect to get a busted window and to be dragged out of your vehicle.
 
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Ambiturner

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Cops can also break into your house, knock your door down if they suspect you doing some wrong shit without a warrant as well at least im pretty sure they can. Say like you ran from the cops, they followed you home.

I cant believe you say without due cause, the dude had cause he was resisting an officer.

Generally not, except for a few exceptions. SEVEN MAJOR EXCEPTIONS TO THE WARRANT REQUIR - Guides - Avvo

Kicking someone's door down without a warrant usually only happens under #6 and #7
 
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Sludig

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You car, well in florida at least, your car is considered your abode or something - that is why you can legally have a gun in your car all you want even with no carry permit. The cop destroyed his sovereign property - broke and forced entry and assaulted the occupant - with no due cause.

Unless we are being racist and saying that traveling while black is a crime.

now, never have I said that doing any of these things was wise, just saying- in that once case of that vid, the cop was 100% wrong IMO and could have done a million other things that didnt result in him shitting all over someones rights.

The real "point" of soverign citizen is that as a citizen we DO HAVE RIGHTS that "being a cop" does not just magically destroy.

Upgraded, not dumbs, flat out retard. Whether it's his abode or anything like that is irrelevant. The crime he commited was beyond a mere traffic citation, it's commonly a class 1 misdemeanor. Unless given a break, his ass would be towed and booked into jail.

And no, he was not complying. A lawful order does not come with it the caveat that you can discuss the fucking order roadside on a fucking misdemeanor 1 charge. You said day in court. Exactly, this shitbag can waste a judges time, not sitting his ass in his car trying to debate the officer on why his sov citizen ass is above the law.

You realize there are bulletins for any type of security/law enforcement all the time because of how dangerous this fuck heads are, so you are not going there entertaining them while they are doing god knows what with their hands.
 
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Siliconemelons

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oh you guys are so amusing. Many of you do not really like freedom.

I never said you "could not be arrested" for a ticket, it just wont hold up as to a valid reason for detainment for a period of time. I said many times this cop could have detained this dude peacefully for the 24-48k etc just because, and should have. You do not have to go to court for a ticket either, only if you contest it.

Lol you guys are going the way of thinking /I/ would actually do these things and not just a thought experiment in trying to understand their point of view.

Pisses my wife off almost as much as you guys when I play devils advocate, but it is a fun thought flex in trying to see different points of view.

I stand by the cop being way over forceful, and in the black guys point of view, as I stated, he was complying and doing everything asked of him - you saw how the judge handled that one guy - the Cop just has to do the same.. was this guy ever ordered out of his car? no? the cop was just like "fuck this, rage mode" - if he was ordered out of his car, or hands on the wheel or anything, sure fine he did not comply.
 

Siliconemelons

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oh, shitpost thursday is over, leaving work :-D till tomrrow if this is still going down hahah
 
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3301

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oh you guys are so amusing. Many of you do not really like freedom.

I never said you "could not be arrested" for a ticket, it just wont hold up as to a valid reason for detainment for a period of time. I said many times this cop could have detained this dude peacefully for the 24-48k etc just because, and should have. You do not have to go to court for a ticket either, only if you contest it.

Lol you guys are going the way of thinking /I/ would actually do these things and not just a thought experiment in trying to understand their point of view.

Pisses my wife off almost as much as you guys when I play devils advocate, but it is a fun thought flex in trying to see different points of view.

I stand by the cop being way over forceful, and in the black guys point of view, as I stated, he was complying and doing everything asked of him - you saw how the judge handled that one guy - the Cop just has to do the same.. was this guy ever ordered out of his car? no? the cop was just like "fuck this, rage mode" - if he was ordered out of his car, or hands on the wheel or anything, sure fine he did not comply.

9200B96D-F5EF-4032-995E-955B6831B23A.png
 
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Ambiturner

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oh you guys are so amusing. Many of you do not really like freedom.

I never said you "could not be arrested" for a ticket, it just wont hold up as to a valid reason for detainment for a period of time. I said many times this cop could have detained this dude peacefully for the 24-48k etc just because, and should have. You do not have to go to court for a ticket either, only if you contest it.

Lol you guys are going the way of thinking /I/ would actually do these things and not just a thought experiment in trying to understand their point of view.

Pisses my wife off almost as much as you guys when I play devils advocate, but it is a fun thought flex in trying to see different points of view.

I stand by the cop being way over forceful, and in the black guys point of view, as I stated, he was complying and doing everything asked of him - you saw how the judge handled that one guy - the Cop just has to do the same.. was this guy ever ordered out of his car? no? the cop was just like "fuck this, rage mode" - if he was ordered out of his car, or hands on the wheel or anything, sure fine he did not comply.

hqdefault.jpg


I don't think you know what the words: arrest, detain, or comply mean.
 
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Hoss

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Yes, and the guy was complying he was going to explain his stance - that is what he got out, his 3 ring binder of sovereign citizen sayings - the cop, if the guy is being peaceful and is compliant - and technically he was - should wait it out and as I said, give the last resort of detainment for the 24-48 hours - and when he says "am I being detained" he can say "yes" - that "am I being detained?!" line is a basis off of, if you do a simple transgression like, speeding or jaywalking it is a ticket, NOT a detainment and if THAT is the justification FOR detainment you can sue or seek damages as it is not legitimate.

The cop was 100% the aggressor ripping out the dudes window then pulling him out of his car and tazering him many times.

I get where you're coming from. Cop definitely looks like he went overboard, but it's a grey area, not a slam dunk life ruining level of overboard. It was dark. Dude was fidgeting around. He had a binder in his lap now which could have been hiding something. He was closing his window making the cop stick his ear up to it to hear what he said. He was shoving 8.5 x 11 paper in the window effectively blocking the cops view. Paper was even laminated which was reflecting the cops light back on him. I really don't think he was that far out of line to decide to end the bullshit. Screamfeeder could use all that shit in his next script where someone shoots a cop.

If the dude had stopped fucking with the windows and had his shit on 3x5 cards, I legitimately think the cop would have let him go on longer. Or if the cop had a partner or backup. There is no technicality where he was being compliant. Take a look at the definition of comply bro.

It takes a big set of nuts to be a black man and pull the sovereign citizen shit. I would expect them to get shot at a pretty high clip. Maybe this video was from before cops had the meeting where they decided to start killing all the darkies.
 
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Sludig

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I get where you're coming from. Cop definitely looks like he went overboard, but it's a grey area, not a slam dunk life ruining level of overboard. It was dark. Dude was fidgeting around. He had a binder in his lap now which could have been hiding something. He was closing his window making the cop stick his ear up to it to hear what he said. He was shoving 8.5 x 11 paper in the window effectively blocking the cops view. Paper was even laminated which was reflecting the cops light back on him. I really don't think he was that far out of line to decide to end the bullshit. Screamfeeder could use all that shit in his next script where someone shoots a cop.

If the dude had stopped fucking with the windows and had his shit on 3x5 cards, I legitimately think the cop would have let him go on longer. Or if the cop had a partner or backup. There is no technicality where he was being compliant. Take a look at the definition of comply bro.

It takes a big set of nuts to be a black man and pull the sovereign citizen shit. I would expect them to get shot at a pretty high clip. Maybe this video was from before cops had the meeting where they decided to start killing all the darkies.
Fuck you Xadion for making Hoss actually be one of the reasonable ones for a change and making me distribute a like.

You would have a better time finding legit examples of poor police choices in the cop thread. You'll even finding me harping on a few there rather than being a blind cops are always right kind of thing.
 
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Void

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oh you guys are so amusing. Many of you do not really like freedom.

I never said you "could not be arrested" for a ticket, it just wont hold up as to a valid reason for detainment for a period of time. I said many times this cop could have detained this dude peacefully for the 24-48k etc just because, and should have. You do not have to go to court for a ticket either, only if you contest it.

Lol you guys are going the way of thinking /I/ would actually do these things and not just a thought experiment in trying to understand their point of view.

Pisses my wife off almost as much as you guys when I play devils advocate, but it is a fun thought flex in trying to see different points of view.

I stand by the cop being way over forceful, and in the black guys point of view, as I stated, he was complying and doing everything asked of him - you saw how the judge handled that one guy - the Cop just has to do the same.. was this guy ever ordered out of his car? no? the cop was just like "fuck this, rage mode" - if he was ordered out of his car, or hands on the wheel or anything, sure fine he did not comply.
I'm just curious. How is the cop going to detain him for 24-48000 hours (you did say 48k) if he won't get out of his fucking car? Is he supposed to just sit there and watch him for that time?

In order to detain someone, you have to get them out of their fucking car, handcuff them, throw them in the back of your cruiser, and take them to the station. Plus a few other steps I'm probably not familiar with since I'm not a cop or a criminal. Like reading him his rights and shit. If he isn't getting out of the car, you have to break his fucking window to do it. Or did you think he had some sort of magic wand? Or that the guy was going to say, "Oh, you're just detaining me? Well shitfire, lemme get out of this car then! You should have said so earlier, officer!"
 
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Ambiturner

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In Nevada, if someone is detained for 1 hour it becomes a de facto arrest so a decision has to be made to arrest or not within that time frame. No idea what he's talking about with the 24-48hr nonsense as I'm sure every state has something similar.

We can remove someone from a vehicle during any traffic stop, it's just a courtesy to allow them to stay in the vehicle.

As far as miranda rights, they only have to be read if someone is in custody and are being asked incriminating questions. Its definitely not every time someone's arrested like on TV/movies.
 
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Jait

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As far as miranda rights, they only have to be read if someone is in custody and are being asked incriminating questions. Its definitely not every time someone's arrested like on TV/movies.

Bullshit. If you are in custody and your freedom of action is removed or restricted you MUST be read Miranda or it’s unlawful.

It’s also based on a Supreme Court decision so states have fuck all to do with it. It does not change.

Where the fuck are half of you getting your info? So much terrible the past two pages.
 
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