pharmakos
soʞɐɯɹɐɥd
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i think we just look for different things out of movies. or, at least, we expect different things from cheesy space operas.
Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017)
- Thread starter Miguex
- Start date
i think we just look for different things out of movies. or, at least, we expect different things from cheesy space operas.
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I don't think you're trolling, I think you're a moron. If you can't see the qualitative difference of picking apart all the shitty story elements, characterizations, and narrative structure of TLJ compared to the nitpicky criticisms of that piss-poor article you linked, you are undoubtedly a moron.
Star Wars was never just a "turn your brain off and enjoy the spectacle" movie. It had depth, it established a mythos, it inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and story tellers. A mindless action movie could never become the cultural phenomena that was Star Wars. A mindless popcorn action movie would be something like Pacific Rim. Sure it's a decent movie, there's even a sequel coming, but even someone as challenged as you can see that a movie like that could never inspire the following that is behind Star Wars.
I have a theory on this new movie, if not also TFA: These new movies are purely for women. They couldn't care less about pleasing the male members of their audience. Read the following in the voice of some spoiled idiot girl
I genuinely think this is the problem with these new movies. They've thrown out the hero's journey and replaced it with Disney Princess in Spaaaaaaace.
Star Wars was never just a "turn your brain off and enjoy the spectacle" movie. It had depth, it established a mythos, it inspired an entire generation of filmmakers and story tellers. A mindless action movie could never become the cultural phenomena that was Star Wars. A mindless popcorn action movie would be something like Pacific Rim. Sure it's a decent movie, there's even a sequel coming, but even someone as challenged as you can see that a movie like that could never inspire the following that is behind Star Wars.
I have a theory on this new movie, if not also TFA: These new movies are purely for women. They couldn't care less about pleasing the male members of their audience. Read the following in the voice of some spoiled idiot girl
The hero now is totes a badass woman.
The bad guy is an emo hunk and takes his shirt off. There's just something about those bad boys! /swoon
They finally have the right people in charge of the #resistance.
It's a good thing there were some women around to show those idiot men how to get things done. Just like at home, my husband/bf never knows how to sort the laundry!
The ugly guy who's doing bad things finally got killed. He was icky, and killed by the hot guy anyway. Yay!
Who cares if any of the action made sense? They hit me right in the feels, freed the pretty horse things that those mean rich people were ABUSING, and we have a new couple to ship on message boards (Finn/Rose), I LOVED IT!
The OT was the Hero's Journey. The Hero's Journey is the boy's journey to become a man in all the forms it takes. Women undergo no such trials and tribulations to become a woman, they are born as one and that's what they are.The bad guy is an emo hunk and takes his shirt off. There's just something about those bad boys! /swoon
They finally have the right people in charge of the #resistance.
It's a good thing there were some women around to show those idiot men how to get things done. Just like at home, my husband/bf never knows how to sort the laundry!
The ugly guy who's doing bad things finally got killed. He was icky, and killed by the hot guy anyway. Yay!
Who cares if any of the action made sense? They hit me right in the feels, freed the pretty horse things that those mean rich people were ABUSING, and we have a new couple to ship on message boards (Finn/Rose), I LOVED IT!
I genuinely think this is the problem with these new movies. They've thrown out the hero's journey and replaced it with Disney Princess in Spaaaaaaace.
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To put it into perspective my 16 year old daughter was legit throwing a fit about going to the movie. She came out of it loving it the most out of all 3 of us.
Those pouty lips on Kylo. The funny Poe guy. Does Finn and Hope get together? Those floppy ears on those kangaroo horses. The funny creatures whose wheelbarrow was smashed by Rey practicing.
Even she didn’t like the aggressive green milk drinking while staring at the camera though ....
Those pouty lips on Kylo. The funny Poe guy. Does Finn and Hope get together? Those floppy ears on those kangaroo horses. The funny creatures whose wheelbarrow was smashed by Rey practicing.
Even she didn’t like the aggressive green milk drinking while staring at the camera though ....
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Jive Turkey
Karen
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Am I the only one that didn't hate that? He's trying to be offputting to Rey by showing her how tough it is to stay on the island so she'll fuck off. And Hamill played it great
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pharmakos
soʞɐɯɹɐɥd
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largely through peripheral venues. a huge part of what we remember about the Star Wars mythos was created through merchandising after the films were released.
re: it being made for women, my girlfriend told me she wished they had gotten someone less ugly to play Kylo Ren. so perhaps you have a point, but it was poor execution if that was their goal.
i liked it.
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Just saw it today. Pretty much have the same feelings as many of you. Disappointed in the direction they went, but trying to hang onto the positives and enjoy it for what it was. That said, I need to vent about a few things just because I went into this with such high expectations. The final trailer was 10x better than the actual movie.
Hated the Princess Superwoman scene...like really, what the fuck? Suddenly, after doing ZERO force stuff in any other film, or in this film after that scene, Leia suddenly can do things that Luke, Yoda, Obi-Wan, Vader, etc etc would only dream of? Seemed so out of place and unnecessary. If she's going to survive floating out in space then they should have had HER fly the ship at lightspeed into Snoke's ship to save the rebellion. THAT would have been a proper sendoff for the character instead of whatever they decide to do in Ep 9 to write her out of the story.
Luke's death was a letdown too. He was a grumpy old man 99% of the movie, then finally becomes the Luke I grew up loving right at the end...only to find out he was not physically there and then just up and died from his force projection efforts? And what was up with him collapsing on the rock, then getting back up, contemplating the suns, then vanishing? All the other Jedi's who vanished actually died before they disappeared right? Why did Luke die then get back up before disappearing? Would have much rather had him go out in a blaze of glory giving the rebellion the time they needed to escape.
Poe was a wannabe the whole film
Rey didn't seem like the Rey from TFA...can't put my finger on it. Was it my imagination too or did she suddenly gain chubby cheeks about 1/2 way through the film? Maybe it was her different hairstyle or something.
Rose....ugh don't get me started. Didn't like her character at all and how in the world, in that final scene in the salt, did she peel off the path in her ship with the rest of them, swing around, and still hit Finn's ship broadside to save him, when he was going in a perfectly straight line at the First Order weapon at top speed?
The slow speed space chase...what was the reason they couldn't catch up again? They just plodded along behind and didn't want to send in any tie fighters to finish them off 16 hours faster because they were out of communication range if they did so? Those are a dime a dozen stormstroopers....just send in a few ships with orders not to come back until the rebel fleet is destroyed. Seemed like such a poorly done stretch to add one of the major story arcs.
Sad that the 3 main things from TFA I was hanging onto and so excited to see in TLJ were all hugely wasted: 1. Who were Rey's parents? (REALLY hoping Kylo was lying and her parents aren't just nobody junk dealers)
2. what's Luke going to say/do? (that big buildup to the final scene of TFA and within 10 seconds of talking to Rey in TLJ Luke throws the lightsaber off the cliff and stomps off...really?! Then the rest of his arc was disappointment after disappointment),
3.Who is Snoke? Oh here he is for 5 minutes and then dead with no revelation into ANYTHING about him.
Casino world was just odd and felt very un-star wars for some reason...or very prequelly.
Pretty much every tense scene, or scene that COULD have some good tension, had humor thrown in to pull me out of the moment.
The visuals in the movie were amazing though. It does have that going for it.
I really liked the whole Snoke, Rey, Kylo scene in the throme room though, aside from Snoke dying so abruptly, and the Luke Kylo fight on the salt world (when i thought Luke was really there). For a moment, I thought the credits were going to roll when they showed Luke walk out of the blaster smoke after all the ATATS fired at him for 30 seconds and Kylo's ship had landed for the 1 on 1 duel. That would have been a killer cliffhanger that I would have hated and loved at the same time. Now Im not sure what to be excited about for Ep 9 since they killed off all the story elements I was so pumped for.
With all this negative stuff said, I thought the rest, for the most part, was ok and I want to see it again on bluray in a few months to see if I feel any differently.
Luke's death was a letdown too. He was a grumpy old man 99% of the movie, then finally becomes the Luke I grew up loving right at the end...only to find out he was not physically there and then just up and died from his force projection efforts? And what was up with him collapsing on the rock, then getting back up, contemplating the suns, then vanishing? All the other Jedi's who vanished actually died before they disappeared right? Why did Luke die then get back up before disappearing? Would have much rather had him go out in a blaze of glory giving the rebellion the time they needed to escape.
Poe was a wannabe the whole film
Rey didn't seem like the Rey from TFA...can't put my finger on it. Was it my imagination too or did she suddenly gain chubby cheeks about 1/2 way through the film? Maybe it was her different hairstyle or something.
Rose....ugh don't get me started. Didn't like her character at all and how in the world, in that final scene in the salt, did she peel off the path in her ship with the rest of them, swing around, and still hit Finn's ship broadside to save him, when he was going in a perfectly straight line at the First Order weapon at top speed?
The slow speed space chase...what was the reason they couldn't catch up again? They just plodded along behind and didn't want to send in any tie fighters to finish them off 16 hours faster because they were out of communication range if they did so? Those are a dime a dozen stormstroopers....just send in a few ships with orders not to come back until the rebel fleet is destroyed. Seemed like such a poorly done stretch to add one of the major story arcs.
Sad that the 3 main things from TFA I was hanging onto and so excited to see in TLJ were all hugely wasted: 1. Who were Rey's parents? (REALLY hoping Kylo was lying and her parents aren't just nobody junk dealers)
2. what's Luke going to say/do? (that big buildup to the final scene of TFA and within 10 seconds of talking to Rey in TLJ Luke throws the lightsaber off the cliff and stomps off...really?! Then the rest of his arc was disappointment after disappointment),
3.Who is Snoke? Oh here he is for 5 minutes and then dead with no revelation into ANYTHING about him.
Casino world was just odd and felt very un-star wars for some reason...or very prequelly.
Pretty much every tense scene, or scene that COULD have some good tension, had humor thrown in to pull me out of the moment.
The visuals in the movie were amazing though. It does have that going for it.
I really liked the whole Snoke, Rey, Kylo scene in the throme room though, aside from Snoke dying so abruptly, and the Luke Kylo fight on the salt world (when i thought Luke was really there). For a moment, I thought the credits were going to roll when they showed Luke walk out of the blaster smoke after all the ATATS fired at him for 30 seconds and Kylo's ship had landed for the 1 on 1 duel. That would have been a killer cliffhanger that I would have hated and loved at the same time. Now Im not sure what to be excited about for Ep 9 since they killed off all the story elements I was so pumped for.
With all this negative stuff said, I thought the rest, for the most part, was ok and I want to see it again on bluray in a few months to see if I feel any differently.
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Jive Turkey
Karen
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He didn't die then get back up, he was physically drained, and I guess it took a second to actually die. Kylo foreshadows it the first time He and Rey are linked by the force. He says something along the lines of "You can't be doing this. The effort would kill you"
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Chris
Potato del Grande
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You can nitpick any movie including the original trilogy (especially with space magic and poorly defined tech involved), perhaps a lot of the complaints here are nitpicks.
But when a story satisfies you, you suspend disbelief. That's why it takes 40 years for a nerd to post an article asking why Luke didn't force pull his lightsaber more or Leia didn't cry for Alderaan.
This story was unsatisfying so the nitpicks are coming out as well as the serious story flaws.
Palpatine's death was satisfying and the climax of the movie, it chaged the balance of power in the universe. Snoke's wasn't any of those things, simple as that. It's even more of a tragedy when Snoke was actually portrayed REALLY well in terms of CGI and personality.
Too many things were set up with too little payoff. You can have a Bobba Fett/Phasma where a built up moment fizzles, but you can't have ALL the moments fizzle.
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ohkcrlho
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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To defend this crap, people point mistakes from the originals.
They did the same shit with prequels.
It's very simple: no movie is perfect. You can tear apart any movie if you really want too, it's not that difficult.
Still....the originals had bad stuff, it layed the foundations that the movies made afterwards should follow.
It's like alien 4 oy T5. Yeah they have aliens or terminators in it but looked like a parody of itself.
They did the same shit with prequels.
It's very simple: no movie is perfect. You can tear apart any movie if you really want too, it's not that difficult.
Still....the originals had bad stuff, it layed the foundations that the movies made afterwards should follow.
It's like alien 4 oy T5. Yeah they have aliens or terminators in it but looked like a parody of itself.
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Zapatta
Krugman's Fax Machine
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Sounds like this one was worse than the last one, which was pure garbage IMO. On paper its an impossible franchise to fuck up. Trying to inject current culture into this stuff is beyond retarded when they original was literally based in the oldest archetypes in all of human story telling. Maybe Screamfeeder really does write for Hollywood, it is apparently populated by talentless hacks whos ideal of great writing is a Geico commercial.
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The Edge
Lord Nagafen Raider
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The more I think about it, it seems like TFA was made by a fanboy that loved Star Wars, but didn't have any original ideas, so he just copied ANH.
TLJ feels like it was made by someone who hated Star Wars, and its characters, and was trying to show us how it should be done to teach us a lesson.
TLJ feels like it was made by someone who hated Star Wars, and its characters, and was trying to show us how it should be done to teach us a lesson.
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Zapatta
Krugman's Fax Machine
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Well they are killing off all the white males so everything can be replaced by women of color.
Have fun selling those action figures Disney.
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Merrith
Golden Baronet of the Realm
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Friend of mine saw this today. His review "The only thing I could think of, was Owen Wilson commenting on the major plot point for over half the movie, in the same voice when he asked Chaz about crashing a funeral: 'So they were chasing the space ship that was running out of gas?'"
Nirgon
YOU HAVE NO POWER HERE
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Really glad there wasn't a bunch of loud black people hooting in the theater whenever Finn bonked somebody this time around. Had that happen at the last one.
Luke doesn't actually show up to the fight... but still dies? Why not just actually show up and di... you know what I don't care. Lot of political crap too. THE RESISTANCE in the opening text, give me a fucking break.
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ohkcrlho
Silver Baronet of the Realm
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I didn't know that guy before but from now on, I'll use this video every time i want to explain why this movie is horrible.
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Royal
Connoisseur of Exotic Pictures
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lol have we really gotten to the point that people are bitching about the way they use the all caps in the opening crawl?
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Siliconemelons
Avatar of War Slayer
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WTF I love Canada now.
Of course my libcuck Co worker LLLOOOVVVEEDDD IT thought Luke was a bad ass etc etc
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