War Dogs PvPvP 100 Person Tactical Shooter

Xevy said:

Was actually thinking just this. I'd love a snow map so you could see Green team.

Watching that pilot dude play with shadows off pissed me off because it's like literally cheating how much easier you can see EVERYONE with those settings. And I know that dude's running a comp similar to mine so he had to manually edit his config to hide shadows since you're not allowed to run potato mode with medium+ GPU's detected.

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New maps and more variety would be very welcome. Also bigger CZ in my opinion. They have oddly limited the ranges of weapons in weird ways.

As to settings, hate to tell you but always has been, going all the way back to Counterstrike. You want the game to look beautiful, great. But your competitive people will always tune it for the most FPS with the clearest ability to pick out enemies. You can not like it, but it is widely accepted. I hate it just cause I don't want to have to figure out all the stupid settings each time I start a new game.

Mao said:

I have questions for Bulkhead, and while I think they are skilled developers, I firmly believe the 'attitude' and such is marketing PR and spin. IF you are a scrappy upstart, play the scrappy upstart and market it. Them paying streamers and such, lets be real. They're a company, don't buy the verbal garbage, lets see what they actually do.

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They're not really marketing themselves as an indie studio in any traditional sense, I wanna say they consider themselves somewhere around a AA studio. They advertise that they're a studio that has broken out of publisher jail after years of agonizing red tape and that they expected 5-10k playerbase at most for wardogs. I played Battalion 1944, I enjoyed it.. but insert all the problems that the game had, all the financial requirements they had to follow, iirc they deliberately limbo'd themselves due to a forced console release to get out of the contract and to move on.. Honestly, the fact they were able to make wardogs a success after how bad Battalion 1944 emploded on itself is crazy in by itself. I personally enjoyed the idea of a more peeled back CoD1/2, DoD, CS style shooter that was Battalion 44 and some of those elements translating into "shoot sandbox" has been phenomenal. The PR stunt of not wanting your money is fine, but I think there is still validity to it all when you consider how other FPS went on high promises and months of disaster and undelivered. That sorta trend of respect and sentiment to the consumer has been growing. Not that they're immune, just theyre refreshing imo. I think Joe Brammer could go in a similar hall of fame as Tigole and Nikita.. he's not particularly as memorable or meme'd yet, but "go fuck yourself" is pretty good.

As far as paying streamers, I haven't heard them say they're paying streamers nor streamers saying they get paid. While i'm sure there is a possibility of them getting paid to do stuff, but I haven't seen the #ad yet which could lead to legal trouble for bigger streamers if they were taking underhand deals.. ontop of they're harkining to PUBG and Tarkov, where clout is based off the feedback of streamers and the wordofmouth streamers give is rewarded by the developers platforming them.. aka showing up in podcasts, doing interviews, giving them early information/test, ect. A few tarkov streamerse have openly had the conversation about how BSG doesn't pay them specifically, but through initiatives like twitch drops, exclusive interviews, streamer items, sanctioned events; they get paid but its not from the bsg wallets. There was the whole controversy regarding Nioceguy a few years back that he basically charged a "meet n greet" tierd fee, which highest tier included hanging out with Nakita/BSG and Nioce.. the long and short was to help cover his travel costs to the convention and run a mini vegas event for his fans

Naive, sure w/e but doesn't really seem to be the case; but again I don't think they're sitting here trying to tout we're just 4 dudes in a garage. I vaguely recall hearing the budget for wardogs was in the 10mil~. The transparency is probably the companies best aspect, and while I can get the skeptism; it's nice to see the Tigole Bitties baton pass on Dev to Player interaction. Fake or not, I atleast understand more than whatever absolute fucks at some of these triple A's are trying to do to games like CoD, Marathon, Battlefield, ect.. feels far more human and connected. As a long time Counter-Strike player, we suffer updates in silence and it's a party at the smallest of window moved two inches to the left or couple lines of datamined code. Even Deadlock's Yoshi is pretty quiet, but man it is it great when you get the "Yoshi" ping from discord and a banger of an update drops.

Mao said:

Anyway... ATM the game really feels sorta like an FPS MMO. More heavily on the FPS side, but with the skills and gear unlocks actually having power advantages, it really does have shadows of MMO ilvl at work.

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I mean yeah, absolutely. Prog is incredibly important to the longevity of a game. The whole carrot on the a stick is what i'd say is normal for the average player to want to play the game.. while I don't have the specifics of the skills from my understanding is that they want it to be horizontal power.. you just do the thing better.. but I guess I don't really know.. The gear unlocks seem to be fading slightly, at least with the supposed 25% damage nerf to the .308.. I don't have all the math, but 25% of 60dmg unarmored from an FAL is 15? so 45dmg shots not counting the math on Armor Reducs, AP, or HP.. so at any given moment, 3 shots outright.. but at the same time, a .308 should feel inherently powerful; a 5.56 out damaging a 308 would be comical. I think the problem stims from a lack of content; We're getting a new caliber(ithink) which is nice, 6.8 which should make the Assault prog feel better.. but it is bewildering that we only got three that might as well have been 2 given the similarities between 5.56 and 5.45. Why did we not get a Galil ACE or AKM instead; 7.62x39 automatic rifle would have felt amazing and alleviated so many peoples problems; a solid inbetween 5.56 to .308.. Also with the whole meh letter box on T4, small arms are getting increased suppession effects.. so while its all just text, there may be a compounding effect happening.

To the XP trickle, while not exactly what you're saying; someone said it forever ago via yt and I don't remember who.. but was a review on the assault grind, and expanding what the assault gets xp from comparing it to the other roles that have otherways of gaining xp.. there might be a chance that the new xp/cash gained from hacking fobs, destroying fobs, and breaching doors be added specifically for assault.

Xevy said:

This isn't turning down the settings. This is altering the actual .ini with settings you're not supposed to adjust to force display changes that aren't allowed. It's like people deleting foliage/trees from other games. It's as close to being an exploit as you can get. In fact, it even culls most of the grass/bushes so if you ever get spotted in a bush from giga far away it's because it's not a bush for the guy that shot you.

Learned smoke grenades are client side as well. That's 100% exploitable once they figure out how to modify the local particle density because they didn't go for the server-side JPEG method like CS/Valorant use. It already occurs sometimes that smokes are there for some people and not for others and nearly always not 100% in the exact spot.

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I misunderstood. I didn't realize he was altering files to get outside of the in game parameters, my bad.

And as to marketing, I'm not saying they are indie or saying they are. What I am saying all the marketing is around them being 'rebel'. Lots of aggressive language. Lots of shit talking etc. To me, that is all marketing. The 'don't buy our game'. Combined with all the articles "This is the game the industry doesn't want" etc. I would bet money marbles or chalk that is all marketing strategy, and the pushed through channels its picked up by other creators cause riding the algorithm and off it goes.

The other is, as people have commented, streamers have personal relationships with the company's execs via phone calls etc. It might not be paid in hard money per se. But it is definitely a sphere where they both make money off each other. Again, I don't fault them for this. I would 100% be doing everything I could to get a game I was making in front of streamers that fit my demographic. What I will say is, don't buy the image as reality. There might be a root of truth to it, but it is also highly crafted.

Lastly, to my knowledge that have denied outright horizontal progression. They are 100% onboard with vertical gear progression and skill progression.

Oh, absolutely is a marketing strategy; they literally said it themselves.. their whole 100 for 100k campaign is a marketing campaign based EXACTLY on that premise to get people clip farming and sharing moments, potentially winning 100k usd and whatever consolation prizes; community knee jerk is that it's gonna go to the biggest streamer ect.. who knows who cares nobody is happy because it isn't them. It's very reminenscent of dearsomeone's PUBG highlights and ETFWTF's highlights but from the developers. I read paying streamers mb. I got into the same conversation for the #ad streamers recently, because "all streamers get paid thousands of dollars to stream their game" argument, when sometimes it's literally just a "play my game and stream it, here it is for free." Most times you can tell when it's shilled advertisement because they'll stay tightlip for their segmented time or is very dog and pony about it. minus the obvious #ad // #sponsored

I guess i'm saying its less fake, and more fuck it. Rebel absolutely, but being constrained by Square Enix for a time then Tencent, to then having to raise money to buy back the wardog ip from tencent because they abandoned you anyways will probably do that to a man. It's a very common development trend r/n that is very fuck the status quo, making the game I wanna make.. and it's doing pretty good. It comes off games made by gamers type of feeling.. thats devs actually play and/or enjoy the game they're producing, which is hard to say for the general industry over the last 10+ years. And in all fairness, I was one of the people holding the stick when Battalion 1944 was happening, asking is something gonna happen yet as it treaded waters into flopf2p.

As far as I understand, they haven't. What I understand about "vertical" is that of course the more powerful versions of a thing is at the latter end of the progression.. something something wow pvp power fantasy(p.sure literal comparison).. but that they're very keen on that there are the lesser ways to do the samething throughout, or should be; specifically using the IED as an example to taking out tanks. It's where the paperrockscissors more or less come from. As far as skills, without seeing them firsthand.. I guess you could be right, but atleast to me veritcal is power spikes and I have a feeling skills will be QoL.. or at the very most by doing the thing a lot, you do the thing better.

But I also just play the game. I don't have the tism that is having to unlock every fascet of the game, I have the i'll take a pistol into every fight and try to win.. so by doing, i get rewarded.. It's pretty cool, I like that system. I still pretty much only use the AK74, SV98, and sometimes a 20k Mosin kit that I thought was my "budget kit" despite having access to the .50, m4, pkm, and idk what else.. and have a hard time understanding "useless" when i'm still dropping pretty high scores while being apart of the deathball with a boltie.. but to humble; I do get checked too.

Kinda cool, bumped into airwing marine, I was chasing a sniper fire just outside of circle in a non drill tower, he comes running beside me and hose him. He says something and I recognize voice, has the streamer protection thing on. I rez him and we hunted down the guy w/ .50 we were after, I got him. Not that suprising since I was on the community server he plays on but..

Some dumb games, one where we never had fob, green team another time raced to 60 but then never had more than 10 capture points at a time rest of game. Looting an RFB guy I killed a minute before and his body disapeared as I was looting....

I went into some of the 50 on 50, 2 team servers. Felt a lot better. Community servers ofc, so lot more communication and active team work but it felt a let more epic than the normal modes. It was a slog though, but it felt an actual tactical game with team work, maneuver, bases of fire etc.

The current 3v3 just feels like Blue gets Eiffel Towered between Red and Green each time.

Mao said:

I went into some of the 50 on 50, 2 team servers. Felt a lot better. Community servers ofc, so lot more communication and active team work but it felt a let more epic than the normal modes. It was a slog though, but it felt an actual tactical game with team work, maneuver, bases of fire etc.

The current 3v3 just feels like Blue gets Eiffel Towered between Red and Green each time.

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Not sure what it is about the 2 servers I mainly play on, but blue wins a pretty decent amount of the time, like at least close to 1/3rd. Granted many of those were games where I could see 5 of the clan's people at the top of their leaderboard. Really doesn't take much of a good group to sway the game I think.

I've had rounds were i'm not spot whoring and also felt I havn't done that great, and yet I'm still in top 5. Like wtf is the rest of the team doing. You might have 2 sweaties or a helo wiping up then the rest are with my at 80-120k$.

I have twice now tried going truck hunting and wasted 10 minutes seeing shit. Feels like hardly anyone is running logi trucks etc after the initial rush and it transitions to all lakota's.

I've seen Blue win quite a few times, but it definitely feels map and helo dependent most times. On maps where Blue gets a good base, the Zest map being one commonly, where they can build inside hard structures is often a good one for blue. The other is if they have pilots. So much of the game seems to hinge on if you have good pilots/can keep good pilots off you. And a large part of the indestructible structure being necessary is cause of pilots. But pilots aren't particular to blue.

Pilots keep air cover off you, go deal with mortars and arty. IF you are blobbing the hotzone, having good pilots constantly strafing the enemy that try to come fight. A couple good pilots and base just gets deleted and there really isn't a whole lot you can do. I will say though, one match I think it was 5 talons were built by Blue on one of the edge drill platforms, and that was hilarious. The other teams kept flying in and they'd get 1 gun run in and just eat all the missiles. Ofc, that was the exception not the rule. It was pretty much a squad that was sick of helicopters and just said fuck it, we're killing all the flying things. Believe we still lost, but lots of helos died.

Edit to add.

Map design really seems a big deal in this game. I normally play Blue cause I think its hilarious, but take the Bakurani map. Red has the high castle and a tower 4 with good vision in the E/NE. Green generally has a good tower and a couple apartment complexes in the NW with good vision and fields of fire. Blue gets that one tower (5) and the castle to the S. The tower, I've seen wins there but its mostly a trap. It sits in a valley and most approaches to it have cover, concealment, and elevated positions. You either just have to out endurance the other teams coming at you, or you have to build out stations to cover it. There other is the natural flow of people from spawn into the zone puts Blue directly in the natural flow of both groups. So, blue ends up getting Eiffel towered between them. The N of Bakurani is almost always empty and a good place to go hide and spot/snipe.

Ozeti is better, and Zesta whatever as I said has some good buildings to hardpoint with good sight lines. So those maps are definitely improvements, but Bakurani is absolute shit to play as Blue. Zest is weird though, cause Red and Blue can harass each other at their natural build points, but Green is like, off in its own little world behind the train track ridge.

Mao said:

Map design really seems a big deal in this game. I normally play Blue cause I think its hilarious, but take the Bakurani map. Red has the high castle and a tower 4 with good vision in the E/NE. Green generally has a good tower and a couple apartment complexes in the NW with good vision and fields of fire. Blue gets that one tower (5) and the castle to the S. The tower, I've seen wins there but its mostly a trap. It sits in a valley and most approaches to it have cover, concealment, and elevated positions. You either just have to out endurance the other teams coming at you, or you have to build out stations to cover it. There other is the natural flow of people from spawn into the zone puts Blue directly in the natural flow of both groups. So, blue ends up getting Eiffel towered between them. The N of Bakurani is almost always empty and a good place to go hide and spot/snipe.

Ozeti is better, and Zesta whatever as I said has some good buildings to hardpoint with good sight lines

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I play blue goodbit, and truthfully bakurani is probably one of my favorites for "tower build" maps. The problem is, everybody wants to build at Tower 5. It's absolutely dogshit. You're surrounded by forest and ridges that have several peak-ins, and a lumber yard that you have oversight on; ain't nobody really walking through that... but Tower 1, you can see all the way into the poppy fields and overlook the shipment yard.. aswell as see both Red and Green tower. Having played Green and Red here too.. Red, I hadn't built on it but with Green I got a team to build and defend it; and it absolutely oppresses blue because you have a direct line of sight of their "main road." Red is fun because you can ignore the entire poppy field most of the time and you're constantly looking at the shipment yard, and that cliff face around Tower 5 as well as that church villa.. ontop of it being so high; its incredibly easy to defend against infiltrators. It's the same tower for Red on Zesta, but they can barely see the Green tower, just good sight into blue and oncoming from green up to the rail line that seperates.. as well as dominating any roof players facing your boys.


But for blue, the best build location is that southern castle/church area.. its a similar build to red's in the northeast but lower and tons of houses. The houses make good for your ability to fan your boys out without holding direct. The game I mentioned a guy went maniac on being a build commander and laying claymore in houses; that was the map.. on blue.. and I don't think I mentioned it here, but another game.. I was on red or green, idr.. another blue team in the same location took the time to sandbag and barbwire all the houses; it felt impossible to attack because you didn't know what fence you'd hop into barbwire, or where a laying LMG was.. it was nightmare fuel. Nades required

But yeah Tower 5 is a trap. I get so mad when blue builds there as a main; mortar base, sure.

gauze said:

I play blue goodbit, and truthfully bakurani is probably one of my favorites for "tower build" maps. The problem is, everybody wants to build at Tower 5. It's absolutely dogshit. You're surrounded by forest and ridges that have several peak-ins, and a lumber yard that you have oversight on; ain't nobody really walking through that... but Tower 1, you can see all the way into the poppy fields and overlook the shipment yard.. aswell as see both Red and Green tower. Having played Green and Red here too.. Red, I hadn't built on it but with Green I got a team to build and defend it; and it absolutely oppresses blue because you have a direct line of sight of their "main road." Red is fun because you can ignore the entire poppy field most of the time and you're constantly looking at the shipment yard, and that cliff face around Tower 5 as well as that church villa.. ontop of it being so high; its incredibly easy to defend against infiltrators. It's the same tower for Red on Zesta, but they can barely see the Green tower, just good sight into blue and oncoming from green up to the rail line that seperates.. as well as dominating any roof players facing your boys.


But for blue, the best build location is that southern castle/church area.. its a similar build to red's in the northeast but lower and tons of houses. The houses make good for your ability to fan your boys out without holding direct. The game I mentioned a guy went maniac on being a build commander and laying claymore in houses; that was the map.. on blue.. and I don't think I mentioned it here, but another game.. I was on red or green, idr.. another blue team in the same location took the time to sandbag and barbwire all the houses; it felt impossible to attack because you didn't know what fence you'd hop into barbwire, or where a laying LMG was.. it was nightmare fuel. Nades required

But yeah Tower 5 is a trap. I get so mad when blue builds there as a main; mortar base, sure.

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Alright self report time. Yall going on about these fine intricacies and I can't even ever remember map name, have no idea what map I'm on etc. I just vaguely recall Z whatever was a bit more trains/built up, but to me it's all just endless bush and tree's mixed in with either the church or a soccer field.

I miss more standard basic names not just bland foreign shit that I can't make the instant association of "Dam battlegrounds, Customs, Shoreline" etc. Though I also already bitched that just outside the major POI, they otherwise look/feel the same.

Sludig said:

Alright self report time. Yall going on about these fine intricacies and I can't even ever remember map name, have no idea what map I'm on etc. I just vaguely recall Z whatever was a bit more trains/built up, but to me it's all just endless bush and tree's mixed in with either the church or a soccer field.

I miss more standard basic names not just bland foreign shit that I can't make the instant association of "Dam battlegrounds, Customs, Shoreline" etc. Though I also already bitched that just outside the major POI, they otherwise look/feel the same.

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gimme dust2 and el alamein

tbh, same. in my group, maybe just me, calls bakurani the poppy map because the whole sunflower thing just came off as an opium field lol; plus the quick call out of hes in the poppies is easier than hes in the sunflowers.. ozet is the soccer map, and the zesto is the train map. I only know Bakurani because I was like iuno opium field middle eastern name /shrug but probably totally wrong.. ozet and zesto are always confused, even had to look it up typing.. I always ask is that the soccer map or the train map.

but I agree, the maps are pretty samesame, doesn't really matter outside of what to do and where to go. I'm sure there is statistical data that says otherwise, but trying to herd 30+ cats just ain't it for me. I just want to click heads the best I can.. and no individual team choice defines that. imo. the power of the team though fluxiates what I can and can't get away with.

My strategy is generally the same on all maps.. usually solo.. run around like a rogue, finding the sorta perpendicular position on the team rotating or where two teams are fighting and pick off as many kills as I can before it gets too hot, and rotate backwards. I'm the asshole you'd generally as yourself why the fuck is he there. I was doing tarkov rotates on a team abit ago, bout 6 of em until they started feeding out of their base to find me.. each one of them had something very nice to say to me as i threw all their gear on the ground and kept it moving. Even hunted a couple of people who were on my friends list that were either close friends from back in the day, or we had played a game together at some point and sent them a screenshot of me killing them lol.