Wolcen: Lords of Mayhem

Zindan

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Thats the problem when you release unbalanced buggy ass game like they did and let it float liek it did for as long as it did. People expect that power now. Im betting that getting to 187 rifts was supposed to be super fucking hard that only a few skilled builders and players ever got to. This is why loot essentially stops at like 110 or some shit. But the problem is now the cats out of the bag. I dont see how they contain this now without huge player backlash. They need to tread carefully here.

We all know that some of those skills are broken, players will automatically levitate to those skills. The problem with this game is there is like 2-3 good skills that do enough dmg at end game past a certain point, probably about Rift lv70 or so or so is when shits starts to hurt. Shit, Im hearing all around forums that people cant even beat act I, II, III bosses, let alone end game shit, lol.
Nah, there are "ethical" builds running 150+ currently, which will probably become stronger once the passive tree is fixed, but you're also right that the HP scaling on mobs at 150+ is a bit too extreme. I didn't touch Winter's Grasp til 115+ and even now in the 120's its only needed to make end boss fights faster. I wonder what they are going to do with Bulwark of Dawn though, it behaves oddly but its damage doesn't seem out of line with every other make skill.
 

Caliane

Avatar of War Slayer
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Nah, there are "ethical" builds running 150+ currently, which will probably become stronger once the passive tree is fixed, but you're also right that the HP scaling on mobs at 150+ is a bit too extreme. I didn't touch Winter's Grasp til 115+ and even now in the 120's its only needed to make end boss fights faster. I wonder what they are going to do with Bulwark of Dawn though, it behaves oddly but its damage doesn't seem out of line with every other make skill.
They could reduce its hits per second. not all periodic damage spells have the same hit rate. some are .2s, some .3, some .4, iirc.
in general, "fixing" bulwark of dawn, would require totally changing how added damage to spells works. The game needs "effectiveness of added damage".. as now, added damage applies equally to all spells. so spells that hit alot over short times win majorly.. and a spell like bulwark which is supposed to just have a small bit of damage, deals a crapton with added damage completely overweighing its base damage. So a skill that was supposed to do 10% of others skills damage, does 50-60% as much.
Although yeah, its really its healing that is crazy good.
 

Brahma

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No response from Steam on a refund. Kept playing. Was having a good time until Act 3. "Enter the Monolith". Can't enter the monolith. Straight can't complete the campaign after 21 hours in.
 

Brahma

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Not sure why people are having hard times with these bosses. As soon as you see what the "gotcha" is, it's cake. 1 shot act 1 boss. two shot act two boss, and that was because of a bug where everywhere was covered in the acid/blood for a whole series except one spot.
 
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Qhue

Trump's Staff
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Based on comments here I picked up Last Epoch and have been playing it some. It feels less slick than Wolcen, but that may be expected due to the lack of complex audio and polish that Wolcen applied as part of their final release. Of somewhat more concern is that I've ran the exact same build/skill for the first 25ish levels and have not had a compelling reason to do anything else. I'm just a Primalist-Shaman who spams the whirlwind-ability as my right-click and just run around beyblade style.
 

mkopec

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Based on comments here I picked up Last Epoch and have been playing it some. It feels less slick than Wolcen, but that may be expected due to the lack of complex audio and polish that Wolcen applied as part of their final release. Of somewhat more concern is that I've ran the exact same build/skill for the first 25ish levels and have not had a compelling reason to do anything else. I'm just a Primalist-Shaman who spams the whirlwind-ability as my right-click and just run around beyblade style.

I played it abotu a year ago back when they released the beta on steam for like $30 or some shit. I saw some of the streamers play it and I picked it up. Its definitely a good contender in the ARPG scene, but they really need to work on the graphics in that game, the game is dog shit ugly. And while this can be overlooked by its slick gameplay and skill/passive system by some, im afraid that it will never reach its full potential. I played through what they had as the "story" back then and it was ok, it definitely needed some more content and some skill trees were not fully implemented yet, and whole classes were missing still. But such as early release right?
 

Nola

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People are even having problem in story or normal mode? If they still can't kill the boss on story mode maybe it's them and they just suck that badly.
 

mkopec

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People are even having problem in story or normal mode? If they still can't kill the boss on story mode maybe it's them and they just suck that badly.

I think the last boss is bugged so that when hes changing forms and you attack him, it basically locks him and you cannot do dmg. I was too busy running my ass off for that to happen, lol. But also im sure there are stupid people that, you know, "stand in the fire" type knuckleheads and cant advance because they are bad. I think the boss fight in this game are done pretty good and all attacks are pretty much telegraphed a few sec ahead. Others dont realize that your dodge ability basically makes you invulnerable while in the animation.
 

j00t

Silver Baronet of the Realm
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act 1 boss is a pita SPECIFICALLY because everything before him is faceroll easy. i had to readjust my stats but once i beat him the first time, i haven't had any trouble with him with other characters. i haven't had any trouble with any other bosses, outside of act 3 boss freezing during transformation.

but again, some builds are currently significantly better than others. i've tried ferocity/toughness melee, ferocity/agi ranged, and wisdom/toughness caster and good lord, the ailments just melt things. it's a LITTLE slow at first, but i got unique drop at lvl 15 for a two-handed sword that let you use any lightning skill, so i just used thunderstrike as my main attack, and then the railgun to dump rage. that sped things up pretty dramatically until i had enough passives put into ailments.
 

Brikker

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I was using OP shield + pistol w/ bleeding edge but I managed to get the Finish act without dying achievement for each act
 

mkopec

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act 1 boss is a pita SPECIFICALLY because everything before him is faceroll easy. i had to readjust my stats but once i beat him the first time, i haven't had any trouble with him with other characters. i haven't had any trouble with any other bosses, outside of act 3 boss freezing during transformation.

but again, some builds are currently significantly better than others. i've tried ferocity/toughness melee, ferocity/agi ranged, and wisdom/toughness caster and good lord, the ailments just melt things. it's a LITTLE slow at first, but i got unique drop at lvl 15 for a two-handed sword that let you use any lightning skill, so i just used thunderstrike as my main attack, and then the railgun to dump rage. that sped things up pretty dramatically until i had enough passives put into ailments.

Yeah there is definitely a balance issue between skills, that for sure. But the game is set up in such a way that its is kinda up to you to test some of these skills out and use your judgment as to what to use. Shit even play melee for a while because its the strongest in the lower levels until you have enough points spent and can switch. I mean people do this all the time in PoE, they use leveling skills which are just easier to use with little to no investment early on. Now I know that some people are dead set in playing XXX with skill YYY and yeah this is where the balance issues come up for sure and they will struggle. For eample, any ranged build in the beginning kinda sucks. Comparing ranged to magic or melee they are worlds apart in strength in the beginning game.
 

a_skeleton_03

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I tried to reason with people in the official discord and that was a mistake.

The die hard fanboys all think that Bleeding Edge is on the other line of exploit territory and that you have to be abusing broken nodes to get it to be so powerful. They cannot fathom that the clear speed of it might not be too fast it's the other skills that aren't worth being slotted that need to be buffed.

If they nerf bleeding edge and winter grasp hard the game will see an insane decline the next day. There will be a clear speed power vacuum that opens up with nobody getting any benefit from it.
 
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mkopec

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I tried to reason with people in the official discord and that was a mistake.

The die hard fanboys all think that Bleeding Edge is on the other line of exploit territory and that you have to be abusing broken nodes to get it to be so powerful. They cannot fathom that the clear speed of it might not be too fast it's the other skills that aren't worth being slotted that need to be buffed.

If they nerf bleeding edge and winter grasp hard the game will see an insane decline the next day. There will be a clear speed power vacuum that opens up with nobody getting any benefit from it.

I was watching Dat Mods stream the other night and he took of all his other skills and just did bleeding edge with no support, buffs, etc, and he easily cleared 187. Then he got his 3 yr old nephew to get on and he cleared an entire wing by himself, thats how broken that skill is, lol.

Winters grasp is broken in another way. The skill itself is not OP, but what happens to the skill when you level it to 62 is the CD on it becomes instant, and you can cast it so fast that it breaks the willpower/rage regeneration, essentially getting all of your willpower back instantly because its like the game does not know WTF to do it happens so fast. THATS whats broken with winters grasp. Usually what would happen if the game was not broken is that you would have willpower generation problems insta casting this skill 10 times in a row in a second. All they need to do is set the minimum CD on it to .1 sec and its fixed.
 
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Deathwing

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So that's where you stop then. I've never gotten past level 96(out of 100) in PoE.
 
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Nola

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Beat the campaign, ran a few rifts and quit the game. These guys took parts from PoE and D3 to create a Frankenstein monster game. Gave it a good try but it's not for me. Just can't do it in it's current state.

Here's Quin69 review of the game if anyone is interested.

 

Zindan

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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They could reduce its hits per second. not all periodic damage spells have the same hit rate. some are .2s, some .3, some .4, iirc.
in general, "fixing" bulwark of dawn, would require totally changing how added damage to spells works. The game needs "effectiveness of added damage".. as now, added damage applies equally to all spells. so spells that hit alot over short times win majorly.. and a spell like bulwark which is supposed to just have a small bit of damage, deals a crapton with added damage completely overweighing its base damage. So a skill that was supposed to do 10% of others skills damage, does 50-60% as much.
Although yeah, its really its healing that is crazy good.
Never noticed a difference in tick rates for the various ground patches, but Bulwark does have a increase tick rate for healing mod, so that might be effecting dmg ticks as well. Issue I had/have with Bulwark is that it always applies Weakness, regardless of what its info page says (and even if I have zero added Sacred dmg).

I doubt the fixes going in for bleeding edge / winter's grasp is going have much of an impact on the playerbase, since people using those build would burn out quicker than anyone else. Same with dupers. =)
 

Zindan

Ahn'Qiraj Raider
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I was watching Dat Mods stream the other night and he took of all his other skills and just did bleeding edge with no support, buffs, etc, and he easily cleared 187. Then he got his 3 yr old nephew to get on and he cleared an entire wing by himself, thats how broken that skill is, lol.

Winters grasp is broken in another way. The skill itself is not OP, but what happens to the skill when you level it to 62 is the CD on it becomes instant, and you can cast it so fast that it breaks the willpower/rage regeneration, essentially getting all of your willpower back instantly because its like the game does not know WTF to do it happens so fast. THATS whats broken with winters grasp. Usually what would happen if the game was not broken is that you would have willpower generation problems insta casting this skill 10 times in a row in a second. All they need to do is set the minimum CD on it to .1 sec and its fixed.
Yea, just spamming WG will "use" around 3k or so Willpower before you stop spamming it. They can fix by removing the ability to cancel its cast animation by running, or as you mentioned.
 

mkopec

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I doubt the fixes going in for bleeding edge / winter's grasp is going have much of an impact on the playerbase, since people using those build would burn out quicker than anyone else. Same with dupers. =)

LoL, sure they will, unless they buff some of the other shitty skills, I mean WTF you gonna play? Spin to win with 1/10 the the dmg?
 
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