My father-in-law (70, chinese), is a goddamn menace on the road. Self-driving ubers can't roll out fast enough.
Marriage and the Power of Divorce
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My father-in-law (70, chinese), is a goddamn menace on the road. Self-driving ubers can't roll out fast enough.
Hoss
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You'd think. But then why did my daughter hate us and stay locked in her room all the time? At various times the wife and I were both ready to cut off the internet. Just never at the same time.
One of my wife's nieces is a drug addict and didn't drive till she was in her late 30's. We all thought that was probably best since she was usually high. Single mom with 3 kids and can't drive. Don't have to think too hard to figure out how she got along. I think she only finally got her license because her looks were fading fast.
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Zaara
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So we've hit a certain impasse in our relationship.
After a lot of consideration , I'm pretty sure I don't want to have any kids (think I wrote as much a while back.) In sum/short it is because I am an intensely selfish person, put a premium on my freedom to do what I like, and have a tendency to become resentful/pissy when I'm forced to do what I don't want to. I've been told your feelings change when it's your own Mini-Me, but I am almost certain I would be an impatient and easily-frustrated mother.
Admittedly, some of the reason I feel this way is due to the experiences I've had caring for/being around my family's children. I babysat my niece and nephew quite a lot when they were younger, the former of which has ADHD and anxiety that made him an absolute terror to my sister. Through school/medication/review he has begun to grow into a tremendously smart and fun kid, but I remember the years of pain he put my sister through.
For supplementary income during my job training this last two years, I also helped babysit my cousin's 4 kids. I don't enjoy it much at all. The moments where you can sit and play and enjoy a kid's company 1 on 1 is vastly outweighed by all the bullshit you have to put up with, the constant screaming and meltdowns and fights. Five children out of our generation (my cousins/their kids) have been diagnosed with ADHD. In conversation it occurred to me I've developed a very cynical and negative view of children. I don't buy the concept that babies are angels and inherently good. Far as I can see it their 'love' is the only currency they can barter with, and that's all a child is about: getting what they want through manipulation of their environment. We don't teach children to lie, it is one of the first things they figure out to do themselves. I was told this is a very unhealthy way to look at things, but in the end I'm becoming convinced that I'm not meant to be a mother. I read now about post-partum depression being accepted as 'just part of the motherhood experience' and I laugh. How many people had to sign away their autonomy, their careers, their freedom for the sake of becoming a 'good parent.' How many of them just said 'fuck it' and did it because that's what we're expected to do. Fuck, make more of us, then die. Being sold the 'joys of parenthood' by the companies that make billions off the mouths to feed and the shitty diapers that need to be swapped out.
So we've talked about it. Thing is, he tells me it's "okay" that I feel this way...and I'm not sure that it actually is. I've never actually met a man in a serious relationship (gay bros excluded) who was okay with the idea of never having children. When I was on the fence he would talk about having time, but not too much time, because neither of us want to be 40 when we're having a kid. Fair enough.
It's been a long road up. Life circumstances and jobs dictated we got by and had some money left over to burn, but barely. Now that we have both settled into careers for the long haul, ones that we are happy with, more of the world is starting to open up to us. Sucks that it all boils down to finance, but there's an incredible sense of relief and excitement in being able to start doing the things you really want to do in life. We talk about buying a house, a place of our own, and it's not just a pipe dream anymore. We'll be able to go away on vacations and see all the places we want to see. He'll be able to afford the bomb-ass fucking car he's always wanted. The home movie system and nice digs for a superlative Netflix and chill experience.
If I have a kid now or even three years down the line, it'll fuck it all up. We'd have to settle, sacrifice on the behalf of the child. I would drop out of my job for months, just when my career is still in its fledging stage. I wouldn't be able to come home from work at 10pm every day as I do now. There aren't many places in the country where the cost of living/real estate is higher relative to income. Instead of paying the mortgage for a good house out in the sticks with some land, we'll have to settle in some suburban postage-stamp shitbox, some 1600/mo cardboard box condo. Instead of his car, my husband can have pediatrician bills and diapers and food and school tuition and everything else. Instead of being able to go to the Smithsonian or hike in Maine or fly back to his home in Puerto Rico whenever the fuck we feel like, we can stay home and take care of the 3,860,560th baby born in the US that particular year. We can lie to ourselves about getting what we want after the kid's gone, when we're pushing 60 and busted ass for 18 years for the sake of hugs, kisses, and sometimes being told the person you made loves you. Of course they do. They have to.
Maybe I'll feel differently, somehow, but it weighs on my mind. I want to make him happy. Of course a man takes joy in his children. But all I can see is the negatives. One kind of happiness being traded for the idea of another happiness, because of biological imperative.
After a lot of consideration , I'm pretty sure I don't want to have any kids (think I wrote as much a while back.) In sum/short it is because I am an intensely selfish person, put a premium on my freedom to do what I like, and have a tendency to become resentful/pissy when I'm forced to do what I don't want to. I've been told your feelings change when it's your own Mini-Me, but I am almost certain I would be an impatient and easily-frustrated mother.
Admittedly, some of the reason I feel this way is due to the experiences I've had caring for/being around my family's children. I babysat my niece and nephew quite a lot when they were younger, the former of which has ADHD and anxiety that made him an absolute terror to my sister. Through school/medication/review he has begun to grow into a tremendously smart and fun kid, but I remember the years of pain he put my sister through.
For supplementary income during my job training this last two years, I also helped babysit my cousin's 4 kids. I don't enjoy it much at all. The moments where you can sit and play and enjoy a kid's company 1 on 1 is vastly outweighed by all the bullshit you have to put up with, the constant screaming and meltdowns and fights. Five children out of our generation (my cousins/their kids) have been diagnosed with ADHD. In conversation it occurred to me I've developed a very cynical and negative view of children. I don't buy the concept that babies are angels and inherently good. Far as I can see it their 'love' is the only currency they can barter with, and that's all a child is about: getting what they want through manipulation of their environment. We don't teach children to lie, it is one of the first things they figure out to do themselves. I was told this is a very unhealthy way to look at things, but in the end I'm becoming convinced that I'm not meant to be a mother. I read now about post-partum depression being accepted as 'just part of the motherhood experience' and I laugh. How many people had to sign away their autonomy, their careers, their freedom for the sake of becoming a 'good parent.' How many of them just said 'fuck it' and did it because that's what we're expected to do. Fuck, make more of us, then die. Being sold the 'joys of parenthood' by the companies that make billions off the mouths to feed and the shitty diapers that need to be swapped out.
So we've talked about it. Thing is, he tells me it's "okay" that I feel this way...and I'm not sure that it actually is. I've never actually met a man in a serious relationship (gay bros excluded) who was okay with the idea of never having children. When I was on the fence he would talk about having time, but not too much time, because neither of us want to be 40 when we're having a kid. Fair enough.
It's been a long road up. Life circumstances and jobs dictated we got by and had some money left over to burn, but barely. Now that we have both settled into careers for the long haul, ones that we are happy with, more of the world is starting to open up to us. Sucks that it all boils down to finance, but there's an incredible sense of relief and excitement in being able to start doing the things you really want to do in life. We talk about buying a house, a place of our own, and it's not just a pipe dream anymore. We'll be able to go away on vacations and see all the places we want to see. He'll be able to afford the bomb-ass fucking car he's always wanted. The home movie system and nice digs for a superlative Netflix and chill experience.
If I have a kid now or even three years down the line, it'll fuck it all up. We'd have to settle, sacrifice on the behalf of the child. I would drop out of my job for months, just when my career is still in its fledging stage. I wouldn't be able to come home from work at 10pm every day as I do now. There aren't many places in the country where the cost of living/real estate is higher relative to income. Instead of paying the mortgage for a good house out in the sticks with some land, we'll have to settle in some suburban postage-stamp shitbox, some 1600/mo cardboard box condo. Instead of his car, my husband can have pediatrician bills and diapers and food and school tuition and everything else. Instead of being able to go to the Smithsonian or hike in Maine or fly back to his home in Puerto Rico whenever the fuck we feel like, we can stay home and take care of the 3,860,560th baby born in the US that particular year. We can lie to ourselves about getting what we want after the kid's gone, when we're pushing 60 and busted ass for 18 years for the sake of hugs, kisses, and sometimes being told the person you made loves you. Of course they do. They have to.
Maybe I'll feel differently, somehow, but it weighs on my mind. I want to make him happy. Of course a man takes joy in his children. But all I can see is the negatives. One kind of happiness being traded for the idea of another happiness, because of biological imperative.
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Khane
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Doesn't seem like there's much more to think about. If you don't want kids and don't believe you'll be a good parent then don't have them. You've obviously thought about it, probably much more than most people. Seems like you're wrestling guilt about what other people may think about your decision more than actually pondering having children.
Lanx
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Soygen
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If you don't think you want kids, don't have them. Better you're selfish and not make kids than make them and still be selfish. I wanted kids and still find it hard, losing my free time to them. I waited until I was 41 to have my daughter, though I've been involved in my step son's life since he was 3(he's 10 now). You will lose a big part of your freedom, especially in those early days. It can seriously suck. That said, I am glad I waited until I'm 40, though we'll see how I feel when I'm dealing with a teenager in my late 50s.
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iannis
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It's possible he's fine with not having kids, too, and you don't have to second guess him.
If he's told you that directly he's made a choice about it. Zaara with no kids, or not zaara with kids. That's the choice, zaara with kids isn't on the table.
I mean he's rican so the culture is different. But not THAT different. If a standard issue white guy told you that you could trust his word.
If he's told you that directly he's made a choice about it. Zaara with no kids, or not zaara with kids. That's the choice, zaara with kids isn't on the table.
I mean he's rican so the culture is different. But not THAT different. If a standard issue white guy told you that you could trust his word.
Uh, because he's a legally independent adult with his own car and insurance? I can express my disapproval, but it's ultimately not my call.
Zaara
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Noodleface
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You probably want to have a long sit down and be like " I don't want kids. Ever. "
He might think you'll grow out of it, and maybe you will or maybe you won't, but he has to live with the fact that you don't want them ever. To some people that is a deal breaker. Maybe he needs to come to terms with it.
My sister is the prime example of someone who shouldn't have a kid. I'd like to post all the reasons why, but it would be a wall of text.
He might think you'll grow out of it, and maybe you will or maybe you won't, but he has to live with the fact that you don't want them ever. To some people that is a deal breaker. Maybe he needs to come to terms with it.
My sister is the prime example of someone who shouldn't have a kid. I'd like to post all the reasons why, but it would be a wall of text.
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Gurgeh
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The problem is that if he feels that way at 30, beeing with zaara outweight having kids, but he has interest in having kids, there's not telling how it will be in 15 years, when he can still have kids. So I think you don't want it to be that way, it has to be "I don't want kids either, period", imo.
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Hoss
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Well if you don't hear your biological clock ticking by now, then you just don't have that imperative. This is how we make idiocracy into a true story, BTW. If you do change your mind later, there's always adoption. I wouldn't worry too much about him, guys may want kids to pass on knowledge to, but that's easily achieved with nephews or neighbor kids. We're not like girls where the kid must be of our flesh or it's somehow not real.
The thing that sucks for you is that there's no answer where you won't regret it. If you don't have kids, there will come a point when you will look at how great your husband is and get weepy that you didn't help him pass on his genes. You've already mentioned the regrets on the other side of that coin. You just have to decide which regret will be worse.
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iannis
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Maybe so, I dunno the guy.
I lived with a woman for a few years, we thought about marriage and kids in the span of that time. She was a firm "maybe probably not" and I was a firm "I don't really care".
And I meant it. If she'd wanted to get married have kids and do that thing, I was up for it. But it wasn't my burning desire. It didn't end badly either. It just... ended.
Obviously "I don't really care" isn't a prime feature you look for in a potential father. But... I really don't care. It wasn't a dealbreaker either way if that makes sense.
He may be thinking that she'll grow out of it. Or he may be thinking that he doesn't really care but for whatever cultural reason isn't comfortable admitting that. If you come from a big family it's weird not creating a big family, and that's just true as well as the reverse.
And hoss is right, either way you choose you'll have moments in life where you wonder what the other choice would have been like. That's how you know the choice is an important one. Not every choice in life is like that, but some of them are. It will never come writ from god across the clouds.
I lived with a woman for a few years, we thought about marriage and kids in the span of that time. She was a firm "maybe probably not" and I was a firm "I don't really care".
And I meant it. If she'd wanted to get married have kids and do that thing, I was up for it. But it wasn't my burning desire. It didn't end badly either. It just... ended.
Obviously "I don't really care" isn't a prime feature you look for in a potential father. But... I really don't care. It wasn't a dealbreaker either way if that makes sense.
He may be thinking that she'll grow out of it. Or he may be thinking that he doesn't really care but for whatever cultural reason isn't comfortable admitting that. If you come from a big family it's weird not creating a big family, and that's just true as well as the reverse.
And hoss is right, either way you choose you'll have moments in life where you wonder what the other choice would have been like. That's how you know the choice is an important one. Not every choice in life is like that, but some of them are. It will never come writ from god across the clouds.
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chaos
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Your attitude towards kids does seem super cynical. That doesn't mean it isn't at least partially warranted, anyone with kids who doesn't admit to thinking what life would be like if they hadn't gone down that path is probably a liar, shit is often hard and doesn't ever end. There's a lot of positive aspects to it as well. Just not as much fun to bitch about.
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Noodleface
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I once read a story where your daughter puked in your mouth. If that isn't birth control
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Gurgeh
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It's probably very difficult to get that message over to a woman... You probably need that diplomacy skill maxed....
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Hoss
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I'd also like to add that we're all selfish when we start out. Don't think you're special in that way. That's why sex has to be so awesome that we get pregnant on accident. What's new is that some people are finally getting smart enough to prevent surprise pregnancies.
Gavinmad
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