Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

Convo_sl said:

not for nothing... but Kyn told me that Brad needed to take more of the money because he was used to a certain kind of lifestyle. Sorry Kyn, that was a bonehead comment and some out there rationalization.

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I really don't recall ever saying that. It sounds out of context if I did. As far as his pay is concerned, being as he is an executive of the company, founder, etc, one would expect that his pay would be greater than other employees or contractors. Isn't that how it usually works? I'm not saying I agree with paying oneself so much in relation to how much was actually available, but its not my place to judge.

Assuming all the money is spent and gone....next tax season is going to be interesting.

Kyndread-Pantheon_sl said:

As to your question, I guess I stick with it because I believe that it will see the light of day. If I thought that there was no chance at all that the game would ever be released then I don?t think I would be involved anymore with it. I also don?t agree with your assessment that Brad doesn?t do any work and is snapping up all the cash. I may not have a crystal ball that allows me to watch what he is doing every second of every day, but he does seem active in the ways that I mentioned in a previous post. He may be in charge of the accounts to which the money goes, but who else would be being as he is the only employee of the company?

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Thats cool you have faith, but seriously, Brad himself admitted it will take $12-15 million to complete. The best his KS did was $400k? Forgot and to lazy to look it up. He routed everyone to his website to directly donate (which was a fucking retarded decision and we told him as much prior to the end of the KS) effectively ending any chance he had at another KS, and now disappears for long periods of time which people like yourself....do something I'm sure, just not sure what. At least you had the balls to come here, thats more then Brad will do. Once things became questionable he ran and hid from us like a coward.
This game will never see the light of day. It stands NO chance and your wasting your time. No investor, epically in this economy is going to drop $15 mil on such a disorganized idea with no professionals behind it, no design doc, no initial funding, no guarantee of recouping his investment, a very small, niche market, and with Brads shady past and his inability to finish projects, regardless of the amount of money invested.

Raidan_EQ_sl said:

I could just as easily say that if Brad's random bills weren't paid, Pantheon's production would have stopped. Your entitled to your opinion, but I still think it was more just a delusional sense of worth or expectations of money that would going to be donated to the project based off his name. Then the angel investor backed out (think it was like 250k?) and an "oh shit" moment happened and the rest has pretty much been hashed out.

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You're seriously trying to rationalize why it was OK to ask for money for one thing then take it and spend on another? Regardless of Brad's financial situation he asked people to donate money to make a game not pay his mortgage. If he was looking for a handout he shouldn't have used Kickstarter and a BS game that will never be made as a smokescreen to pay his bills. It sounds like he is still using Pantheon as nothing more than a tin cup begging any passer by with spare change to donate it into the black hole of Brad McQuaid's vision

Kyndread-Pantheon_sl said:

I really don't recall ever saying that. It sounds out of context if I did. As far as his pay is concerned, being as he is an executive of the company, founder, etc, one would expect that his pay would be greater than other employees or contractors. Isn't that how it usually works? I'm not saying I agree with paying oneself so much in relation to how much was actually available, but its not my place to judge.

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Pretty much the entire idea of a crowdfunded, start-up, technology company is that NO ONE gets paid until either the product is released and commercially successful, or the company goes "legit" and receives enough investment from venture capitalists or angel investors that it is no longer, by definition, a start-up. Brad just skipped over that shit and helped himself to a third or more of the funds raised, despite having done little or no actual work, the product still largely a figment of his imagination, and the company unable to further it's own goals due to a lack of funding.

Kyndread-Pantheon_sl said:

I really don't recall ever saying that. It sounds out of context if I did. As far as his pay is concerned, being as he is an executive of the company, founder, etc, one would expect that his pay would be greater than other employees or contractors. Isn't that how it usually works? I'm not saying I agree with paying oneself so much in relation to how much was actually available, but its not my place to judge.

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Whenever you are asking for money, whether it be from an investor/publisher/guy on the street, the person that gave you money is going to want to see some return to see what they are getting for their money. The idea that the money simply went into his pocket with let's be really be honest, nothing to show for it isn't going to sit well. Ask yourself, what exactly he is paying himself for? What has he personally done, especially during the early days of the KS except for gather everyone in his garage (who paid for that trip with their own dime)? Website interviews? Reddit AMA? The other guys on the team did many of those things as well (some more than he did) and were compensated a fraction of what he got. The fact that this happened with crowdfunded money makes it worse.

Kyndread-Pantheon_sl said:

I really don't recall ever saying that. It sounds out of context if I did. As far as his pay is concerned, being as he is an executive of the company, founder, etc, one would expect that his pay would be greater than other employees or contractors. Isn't that how it usually works? I'm not saying I agree with paying oneself so much in relation to how much was actually available, but its not my place to judge.

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You said it in a conversation with Convo and I on teamspeak. I remember it because Convo private messaged me right after lol. I assumed it was a lapse in judgement and you regretted saying it the second it left your lips.

Kyndread, unless you are having an affair with brad, i suggest you put this hobby on hold indefinitely and spend that time with the wife. i mean unless she is a shrew or something and you are trying to escape her by putting your extra time into this hobby your marriage and well being is much more important. think about what you posted. brad is the only employee of his company. so that means he is the only one being paid. do you do less work than he does? do you think its more work to come up with an idea than it is to make that idea come to life? do you think these ideas are things he actually thought up on his own? dont sell yourself short dude, you sound like a nice guy. dont mythologize this man. he isnt some god of gaming.

i loved everquest. spent damn near every waking moment of my life dedicated to that game back when it went live and i have mostly good memories of that time. hell i even came back to everquest after an 11 year hiatus and am now a paid subscriber. with that in mind i can tell you that brad is not worth more than you, that he is not a superior being, he is just some guy with a quirky vision that has passed its sellby date and does not deserve to be the only one getting paid on this hobby . and he certainly shouldnt be allowed to take all the money this hobby is generating from you guys efforts. go buy your wife some flowers bring her into the bedroom and point to your junk and tell her "THIS IS GOING TO ROCK!"

Kyn... if you had the opportunity to read the F13 transcript a few pages back discussing the Vanguard situation and all the pitfalls that occurred during that project, my question would be what do you see that would make this game different in terms of seeing the same fate as VG? Maybe not the final outcome but all the problems that occurred in each different stage.

To by honest, I can't say that I blame you for doing what you're doing. If I had the money to support my family and the time to give to something like this, I would roll the dice if the situation was right. However, I doubt it would be know Brad's past but then again IF (and this is a very BIG IF) it did make it, it may be worth it. Just some advice, and i'm sure you understand this, but I would ensure that this could in no way have a negative impact on your life either emotionally, financially, or professionally. If you can continue to work on this project as a side deal with minimal impact on your life, than more power to you.

I would say people on this board would be very understanding and possibly even supportive to you guys if you honestly wanted our opinions on the game and the mechanics but all of us will probably forever skeptical and cautious of Brad and anything he is around. Not necessarily because of games but the collateral damage that has hurt a lot of people over the years. At least that is my biggest beef with him.

Yeah... no. I'm still trying to get over Brad actually asking the contractors for their pay back, AFTER he'd already ganked $45k for personal use. The more I just think about the whole situation, the more I hope Brad ends up on the streets. And frankly, with the way things are going, that's where he's headed. I'd say I can't believe you fools still volunteer for him, but Nigerian scams exist for a reason - they work.

There's been entirely Too much positive energy in this thread. He pocketed close to 60 all said and done. Stop it ya fags.

If this won't attract Brad nothing can.
Lexington Kentucky Mating Call - Boone County Whites - YouTube

Canadian_sl said:

If this won't attract Brad nothing can.
Lexington Kentucky Mating Call - Boone County Whites - YouTube

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Easy... I'm from Lexington KY and we do not want to be associated with the Boone County and West Virginia Whites. LOL. Two things happens in our area, Basketball and Horse Racing.

In regards to the positive energy... I totally agree with you. You can't forget the facts and you really cannot forgive and forget the past, it provides way too much context. However, I don't want these guys like Kyn to think I hate them just because I think their choice to work with Brad is foolish but if he really wants to make that choice as a side deal then more power to him.

Vandyn_sl said:

I'm curious to also know if it's ever crossed the mind of how expendable the current team is if some actual developers (with established resumes in the industry) come on board.

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yep. the sensible goal would be make a working demo. release the demo and then redo the kickstarter...reuse the kickstarter funds and bring in real dev, artists, and programmers to polish things up. the original group could possible be retained as associates.