Pan'Theon: Rise' of th'e Fal'Len - #1 Thread in MMO

KCXIV_sl said:

man, if you had a runner and he somehow got away,you just knew it was gonna be bad. Necro's had to fd in a safe spot if the runner brought back to many mobs.lol The corpse runs were just as fun for me at times then even getting experience. Had some long long nights laughing my ass off because something went bad. lol

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Corpse runs used to be another game. There are certain classes who are pretty decent with carrying everyone's corpses to the dungeon's zone. Monks, Necros, Rogues...etc. It adds yet another role to be played by your team mates.

Dullahan_sl said:

Exactly. That is the difference between grinding in EQ and grinding in say, BDO. YMMV but I could grind in the above scenario for hours and never get bored. It was always exciting to me. BDO on the other hand put me to sleep. I literally could not stay awake playing it.

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It's a shame because BDO is a great game. A step into the right direction. But the idea of hording mobs and AoE them to death in a couple of hits is just stupid. It gets really boring fast. The fight you've been doing at level 5 is the same at level 55. How do you expect the combat to carry us over three months if it's like that. No meaningful coordination, no roles to be played, monsters die in a second, no time to even strategize. What's so called scroll-boss fights are exactly the same; everyone's just hitting the crap out of this thing and it dies in 10 seconds, sometimes less. I don't understand how this is fun to be honest. I've always said if BDO's combat was something like EQ and it had dungeons like EQ did; I'd still be playing it right now.

Hateyou_sl said:

Yeah right. You're so fucking delusional about this game. Brad will nerf and tweak the fun out of every emergent behavior. He wants you playing his exact vision of the game. He's the game God, not the players.

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I guess you never played vanguard all that much

It was? I bailed on beta bc the game was shit but i don't remember those nerfs. Any examples?

I really don't like Vanguard. Not a fan of the itemization system there. It was boring and unimaginative. Not a fan of the quests (it's a completely different approach than EQ and Pantheon). But it wasn't a surprise because everything was clear about the game; it wanted to be something a little different. That's why I wasn't expecting much. But the shitty launch sealed the deal; it was unplayable.

Soygen_sl said:

I mean...if you bailed on beta, you probably weren't around for a lot of the nerfs.

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Well you beat me to it soybro but that's what I was trying to establish. It's not a nerf if it happen during beta and if it was live, Braddy wasn't around. TLDR:need clarity

U guys gettin tired of bdo combat should try some of the harder mobs. I think they'd be equivalent to the bAMs from Tera. Granted I am still only lvl 50 but having fought some ogres and cyclops now I find it a lot more satisfying than the spam of tiny mob aoeing. I'm not sure what direction the later game goes in but my friend tells me he's getting raped at 55 in Valencia, so maybe it gets harder

Dandai_sl said:

It was almost ten years ago, but off the top of my head I remember necro's could infinitely kite creatures (even overworld bosses), shamans had something with their pets that escapes me right now, and blood mage healing had this super intricate and complex "rotation" they could do to be godly healers. All were nerfed shortly after they became common knowledge.

Bards also took a big hit, but I never touched them so I don't remember what it was. Something about custom songs iirc.

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They put a cool down on that sorcerer AOE spell that did awesome damage, but sapped your own health at the same time. The name escapes me, but that spell was great to solo with and I got several levels done before they nerfed it.

Convo_sl said:

Well you beat me to it soybro but that's what I was trying to establish. It's not a nerf if it happen during betaand if it was live, Braddy wasn't around.TLDR:need clarity

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Haha, that's your "gotcha"?

Dandai_sl said:

It was almost ten years ago, but off the top of my head I remember necro's could infinitely kite creatures (even overworld bosses), shamans had something with their pets that escapes me right now, and blood mage healing had this super intricate and complex "rotation" they could do to be godly healers. All were nerfed shortly after they became common knowledge.

Bards also took a big hit, but I never touched them so I don't remember what it was. Something about custom songs iirc.

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So, when players could solo kite overworld bosses and become godly healers they tweaked things to not allow it. I'm all for emergent and even some OP here and there, but that's the kind of shit that needs nerfed. And trying to say Blood Mages ever had a problem with being nerfed is laughable. There were a ton of annoying bugs that didn't get fixed for years, but some bugs included things like being able to life-tap heal from across a zone. Meaning the BMG would die, then run around soloing easy stuff by the graveyard, lifetap healing the group still in the dungeon, until they killed everything and were again out of combat so they could use the res stones to resurrect the BMG. They were apparently quick to nerf shit, but somehow left in that ridiculously OP bug?

One of the reasons Vanguard was fun to play was the dev team was so small and slow fixing shit that at least the fun stuff that would be considered a bug and exploit and be fixed immediately in most over-tuned, over-nerfed games also rarely got fixed. That's why Pantheon has a similar chance to benefit from an insufficient dev team. Fun, unintended things may persist because they're too incompetent to fix them.

Khane_sl said:

Haha, that's your "gotcha"?

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Nah, I don't get all excited about just being right on the Interwebs. Certainly wansnt trying to nail him down, I'm just not familiar with the nerfs in VG.. If people are going to toss out blanket statements that Brad is going to nerf pantheon and use past games as reference, we should at least be accurate.

Pasteton_sl said:

U guys gettin tired of bdo combat should try some of the harder mobs. I think they'd be equivalent to the bAMs from Tera. Granted I am still only lvl 50 but having fought some ogres and cyclops now I find it a lot more satisfying than the spam of tiny mob aoeing. I'm not sure what direction the later game goes in but my friend tells me he's getting raped at 55 in Valencia, so maybe it gets harder

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BDO is a great game. I've spent over three months playing it daily. I was level 55 and I can't remember ever fighting monster that doesn't require horde-and-AoE-to-Death except the Cyclops and the Ogres everything else is pretty much the same shit. Cooerdination with Boss Fights / Guild Bosses is non-existent. All you need to do is DPS the shit out of the boss and stay alive. Boring.

The combat system in BDO was brilliant. Unfortunately, the fights themselves were too simple. They came up with a great system, but didn't flesh it out. They should have more variety in mobs, more ways in which mobs could fight and make life difficult for the player. Instead, I think 99% of the mobs in the game could be killed with the same exact combo. No variety, nothing different. The only change was putting more hp on some mobs. If BDO had more class distinction and class roles and had mobs which did more than stand there and hit you, the game could've been great. The world itself is fantastic and the artwork is simply gorgeous. Some of the systems were simply genius, but the combat just bored me so much after awhile. It started out great, but it just led no where.

Dandai_sl said:

I guess I didn't play the same vanguard as you since that's exactly what Brad did in vanguard. Emergent and unexpected player behavior was nerfed and squashed as soon as possible. I remember in the EQ days he was pissed about quad kiting and wanted to make everything summon and remove snare effects. There's a reason The Vision is a thing.

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Not sure what you mean by emergent and unexpected behavior i suppose.

Dandai_sl said:

I guess I didn't play the same vanguard as you since that's exactly what Brad did in vanguard. Emergent and unexpected player behavior was nerfed and squashed as soon as possible. I remember in the EQ days he was pissed about quad kiting and wanted to make everything summon and remove snare effects. There's a reason The Vision is a thing.

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Just to get the record straight, Brad wasn't nerfing much of anything post-release in VG. There was plenty of nerfing, but it wasn't Brad holding the bat 99% of the time.

New Brad interview

http://haogamers.com/blog/2016/07/11...road-pantheon/

Who is this dude?Visionary Realms Appoints David Reitman to Board of Directors