Star Wars: The Last Jedi (2017)

Screamfeeder said:

And here I thought we were going to have a nice little nerdy chat about Star Wars lore without you being all "SJW FEMINAZI BULLSHIT PROGRESSIVE REDPILL" edge about it.

I hope you can someday just enjoy things again Lithose.

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Never once spoke of SJWs or Feminism or anything of the sort. Maybe you should stop seeing things that aren't there, Scream. Maybe one day you'll be able to argue a point again without your delusional defense of an ideology that isn't even being questioned.

Screamfeeder said:

Explain this particular point to me in more detail then. Because that is exacxly the point. All those old dudes were wrong and it has led to nothing but war and strife.

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The old guys were wrong and the new kids were right. When the old guys are your heroes, you tend not to enjoy that as an audience, especially if you understand the lore of the old guys being philosophers and scholars who spent thousands of years pondering these questions and the new kids found a lightsaber in a fucking junk drawer and has the answers? That's just retarded. Does it have to be explained?

Screamfeeder said:

it does. Explain it more. Because again, this is a fucking world in which Luke is a dumbass hick cracking wise in a military meeting he has no business being in and is arrogantly mocking the Leadership (one being a Strong Independent Woman) about how he used to shoot rats on his backwater and that makes him badass. That is the Old Shit you hold up so high.

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Did Luke fundamentally change ALL military doctrine forever, and show up the previous best pilot in the galaxy? Nope. Luke was told repeatedly he didn't know what the fuck he was talking about in regards to piloting by Han Solo.


He was repeated humiliated for his naivety throughout the whole film. Only toward the end, when another pilot in his team despaired did he offer his quirky little anecdote to try and bolster morale. But then all of his friends proceeded to die, and he had to be SAVED by Han Solo right at the end. He had to work in a team, and still make up for his own short comings as a pilot even. But he was able to show off some skils as a pilot.

However, what he didn't do was upturn military wisdom and make all the older folks look like assholes. On the contrary, Luke realized how important those folks were constantly throughout the film, from Han's lessons, to Obi-Wan's.

Our childhood's change. Things are different. It's a fucking movie. Rey isn't a Mary Sue but Luke is damn sure a Marty Sue. You can't really square that away in your head and it is causing you some issues because you desperatly want a fictional universe to conform to your non-fictional daily life.

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Wow. So let me get this straight, because I want this written down. You do not believe Rey is a Mary Sue but Luke...is? Look at the above clip, then look at this one.


Huh...

Rey vs Vicious Sand Dudes.


Easy victory.

Luke vs Sand People?


HUMILIATION.

LOL

So explain it in detail for me.

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Well, given your last statement I'm not sure how much good it will do. You are frighteningly blind for someone who writes for a living. But let me try.

In the new movies, stating that all the "old dudes were wrong" is an attempt to claim that characters the original story built up as wise and were loved by the audience for their wisdom, like Yoda, were wrong. Saying all they did was kill each other is erasing the actual story that happened, and the context, like the fact that Luke chose NOT to kill his opponents in the end or the fact that the Jedi lived for a thousand generations in peace and prosperity. It tells us its cool to throw away a thousand generations of wisdom, from people who did nothing but study the mysticism of a force which thrives on binding the world together and connecting the Jedi to everything--to throw it all away because for 2 generations shit went sideways. It tries to tell us that a kid who weeks ago didn't even know what another planet looked like, now is worldly enough to not need the wisdom of people who have been to countless worlds and lived full, varied lives.

I shouldn't need to explain to you how ridiculous all the above is. Your points mistake youthful innovation as a serious replacement for wisdom, and it comes off every bit as pretentious as if you really were a kid fresh off his first year of into college courses who now thinks he knows how the world works.

Apparently the Rose actress scrubbed her social media presence because of misogynist trolls.

Fat Asian girl is the Jake Lloyd of this era.

Screamfeeder said:

And Han's experience with people like Luke and Slum planet cannibal dog monsters made him realize he was probably wrong to instantly judge anyone that knew what the fuck they were talking about (See Solo and a dozen other clips out of canon).

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Han wasn't wrong...Luke didn't know what he was talking about. Luke knew how to fly, not jump through space. He had a FEW skills, but not a wide variety. That's what I'm showing you. Luke sits down and makes an ass of himself constantly. Rey constantly shocks the people around her with her competence.

Again do you even watch these movies?

Luke was raised as a moisture farmer by a couple of old farmers. Rey was left alone to fend for herself and learned much earlier how to be self-reliant, aggressive and take what she thinks she deserves. Of COURSE Luke is going to get his ass raped by natives. He barely knows anything about them. Rey however has been totally solo since she was a young kid scrapping around the planet shit-talking other alien junk hoarders. That is literally the entire intro to her.

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So, Rey is this aggressive kick ass woman who TAKES what she deserves. And she works really fucking hard collecting parts to trade in for meal packs, HARDCORE--and remember, she fucking TAKES what she wants. Just like she's going to say fuck this droid because he's worth more food than a year's worth of work will get her.


Oh..no, she empathizes with the machine she just met, is kind to it and then refuses to help herself in order for the machine to follow its dream of being returned to its master (But...but Lithose, she was waiting for her family too! That's where the Empathy comes from!!!! LOL.)

Remember when Luke, who is as you said, much softer than Rey, had a chance to "empathize with droids"? Yeah, he didn't. He was too busy pouting. He instantly agreed to wipe the R2 unit, and R2 had to trick Luke to get away. Luke didn't help out of the kindness of his heart--he was already showing the flaws which would haunt him through the next film. His mind was not on what he was doing, he was impatient to get where he THOUGHT he wanted to be. Yoda was watching him, remember? Another reason he wouldn't take him as a student.

"This one, a long time have I watched. All his life, as he looked away, to the future, to the horizon..Never his mind on where he was, WHAT he was doing."

Luke's flaws were constant through the first two films. He was a dreamer, naive and impatient, and sometimes angry. Many times the answer to problems were right in front of him but he couldn't see it. Half of Yoda's lessons were about that flaw.

Now compare that with how wise and benevolent your hard woman is--who somehow has been scrounging for food all of her life, and is able to fight to survive but would surrender enough food to eat for months because of a fucking machine she just found (Which, everyone in this universe treats machines like garbage...Which is just another damn contradiction we're going to ignore.)


In the end this part of your post may as well be writing 101....

"Look at all these off screen excuses I have for the character I'm defending being able to take care of every problem she confronts with ease that impresses the older veterans who have a shit ton more experience!"

But sure, Rey is a junk rat, that's why Rey can defeat the sand guys. Because of a montage which shows her going down a zipline to get machine parts (Unless its a droid, then she doesn't sell it. It also explains why she can....Repair the Millennium Falcon better than Han can.....Fly the millennium Falcon better than Luke or Han could.


"HOW DID YOU DO THAT?!?!" (That incredible piloting that seemed almost impossible and was by far the best piloting ever seen in a SW film.)

"I DO NOT KNOW!" (Actual fucking answer.)


It's also how she could use the mind trick, fight like an expert with the light saber, repel a mind invasion and then invade another person's mind, use telekinesis and defeat another Jedi's telekentic powers. Because those are things a junker learns right? Her hard life probably had Jedi training...oh nope! She didn't! She just KNOWS this stuff.

Meanwhile, Luke struggles to pull his lightsaber out of the fucking snow after an entire movie of development. After getting his ass kicked for 10th time by a god damn yeti. (Oh and this is after he's been fighting in the rebellion for a few years. Hmm, odd. I guess being a soldier for a while doesn't actually make you instantly into an unstoppable beast for some people? Only people who collect junk for a living.)

In a way, yes. That is EXACTLY the point of why Luke is the Last Jedi and not wanting to further that system anymore but reluctantly training someone he see's exhibiting the same mistakes as his last major fuck up.

And he does just that.

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What mistake? The only thing Luke was scared of was Rey's power. What mistake did she make? (You know, one example of a "flaw" hack writers give Mary Sue's, and go look this up--is that if they are flawed, its that they are "too powerful" or "too kind" and it hurts them in some way..Like Jesus. LOL. )

And yeah, time to throw out everything Luke learned. All those clearly wise lessons from Yoda and things that have toppled an Empire and saved countless millions of lives--all that, means nothing! Because bad things happened recently. lol...

They went sideways enough in the OT to literally destroy that entire order...so yeah. Maybe time to rethink and step back. Anakin was the CHOSEN ONE. How did that wisdom work out? Did it create more war and strife? I forget.
Oh come on. Luke went from " i push buttons on a water evaporator to "I just shot down an Imperial Combat pilot on my first go around and feel confident enough to clap back at Obi-Wan in the middle of him stroking his beard.
.

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Stepping back doesn't mean ignoring all the wisdom acquired. It doesn't mean every old person has nothing of value to offer. Are you really arguing this? What an absolute joke. No wonder you can't connect with audiences. How about you guys have Rey write a fucking App that measures Light/Dark and show off how innovative it is as the method for replacing those fossils and their thousands of years of observation, peace and prosperity. lol.

As for Luke being a moisture farmer. The audience can suspend belief for a couple jumps into the implausible. Heck they can do that for a lot more--even I was willing to wait for Rey's abilities to be explained. But what Luke traded for that ONE fucking thing he was good at, being a pilot, was competency in nearly every other area a character can be competent in.

Tell me the area Rey is weak in, Scream. Go on. Is she a bad pilot? No. Is she a bad duelist? No. Is she bad with her use of the force? No. Does she get angry too easily? No. Is she kind of a jerk off at times and make people mad at her, like say the first droid she meets? No (Droid loves her), as does nearly everyone. Hmm. Does she make any stupid or selfish decisions, like say trading a droid she never met before, for food she REALLY wants and clearly works hard for?

Or maybe as pretentious as a farm kid that has quickly seen enough of the world early on or just have a big enough ego to be a cocky fucker and have little to no use for authority trying to "Keep Me Down". You know, like Luke and Rey and Kylo and Anakin and Han and every other character in this made up world

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It's probably as pretentious as that. Which again, is why EVERY character Luke meets tells him to shut the fuck up and that he's an annoying cunt. Which is EXACTLY what he is.

I can not teach him, the boy has no patience and is angry.


"You want the impossible." (Rejects Yoda's teaching.).."I don't believe it!"

"That is why you fail."


(Remember, Luke uses Han's greed to get him to come with him half cocked--but doesn't have a plan to get out, Leia has to save them both.)


Again, and again AND AGAIN, Luke's naivety and his NEED to learn from those with more experience comes up. Its a constant theme. We watch him deal with these flaws and grow. But you...You are actually praising naivety and being pretentious as a GOOD thing. And what's worse is clearly the movie agrees with you, because a strong, powerful innovator like Rey don't need ANY old fossil corrupting her vision of the future. (She's planning to pitch her app to Empire Venture capital soon.)

Screamfeeder said:

So people that enjoyed a movie should be shunned for enjoying something and that should reinforce your idea that there is an "agenda" because they still say "I like this" in the face of a popularity contest on a microcosm message board? whew lad.

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Nice reading comprehension.

He's saying the defenders were people who were already shunned because of their idiocy.

I agree about Lithose, though. I generally agree with him, but just don't have it in me to spend 30 minutes reading a single post

Screamfeeder said:

Dude I am a busy guy.

Parse this shit down. Your posts sometimes are the equivilant of a 4-6 hour Youtube video of a guy talking to a webcam and expecting me to care.

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I mean, at this point I'm just posting clips and explaining what happened in them because clearly you've never watched the films. That's almost all of what that last post was. Taking things you said and showing how the actual movie totally contradicts them at every turn. Oh, and I laughed at you for trying to take what was Luke's biggest flaw, his pretentious, impatient nature--which was chastised like every other scene and was literally described by Yoda and for which Luke apologized for, and passing it off as
the same" in Rey. (Because, clearly, as the clips show, how competent the two characters are in all things is different, and what's more, how people react to that inexperience is different.)

But yeah, at a certain point I figure I'm just telling you to watch the films, because you've consistently gotten large themes and scenes completely wrong. You saying Rey was not a Mary Sue while Luke was, is just cringe inducing. Clearly an agenda there, and I'm not sure why. Rey is a ridiculous character. Not because she's a strong woman, I fucking love Furiousa, perhaps one of my favorite characters in film. Rey is ridiculous because she was written ridiculous. Literally her only flaw is she's too powerful and so she frightens off the old stupid Jedi, what was his name? Oh yeah, Luke.