The Big Bad Console Thread - Sway your Station with an Xboner !

Xexx

Xexx

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Sean_sl said:
Kinect thing is annoying, but not something Isupercare about.

My biggest things are:

The $100 difference - It matters, it really does. Especially with the following reasons.

The PS4 is more powerful, easier to code for, and Sony isn't having yield problems (I don't trust Microsoft at all if they're having hardware issues).

Sony has far more and far better exclusives. It's not even comparable, especially with games like The Last of Us (which is probably the best game of this generation).

Sony is actively courting indie developers and is fostering an environment for them to grow and there's been nothing but super positive stuff from indie devs about them. Meanwhile, Microsoft is giving indie devs a big Fuck You.

Microsoft is just plain full of shit. They were 100% adamant that DRM was absolutely necessary for this system and that we JUST DID NOT GET IT BECAUSE WE ARE NOT DEVELOPERS. Fuck them and their messaging on that. I can't wait to see them try to explain their way out of it when someone pushes them on that.
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Pretty sure they just wanted to be steam, with all of the restrictions and none of the benefits like some articles stated. MS is blind to why people do use steam, and they only see us as data. A dev friend of mine confirmed that all their dumb decisions were based on poll results and that regardless people would still play with the console. Peopleare sheep,the vast majority have no clue what any of the DRM shit means and do not really care, and that is why MS tried to pull a fast one(albeit quite slowly due to launch date).
 
Selix

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Eyashusa_sl said:
the real bullshit was the DRM/no selling/always need to be online. Now that they've gotten rid of that, its funny to see everyone go, "BUT KINECT IS MANDATORY!!!!" like that is some big fucking deal when it comes with the system.
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I don't hate MS and I don't drool over Sony but the always online BS was a really big deal for me and now that they are removing it that is a big plus in their direction. The problem is they are still $100 more expensive and have less powerful hardware. For the extra $100 I am getting Kinect which unarguably a gimmick. I don't mind it existing but I DO mind them putting one in every box and forcing me to pay $100 for it.


That said I could still realistically buy an Xbone but there still isn't anything it does better then the PS4. Ok Xbox live was pretty awesome but they really need to reverse their indie game policy.
 
Szlia

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I must say I am surprised about the 180. I found their (now defunct) DRM policies to be extremely stupid, offensive even, but I assumed they knew something we didn't know. I assumed they did some marketing research and that it showed the DRM policies did not hinder the mass appeal of the product. I guess there was no research. And/or they did not realize how generalist media would relay the E3 info and how through blogs, twitter, facebook, reddit and the likes, the so called "hardcore gamer" could get the word out to the masses of average customers just how bad the DRM stuff was.

Then again, I should have remembered that Microsoft is the company that released the Xbox, a console that, a couple months after its launch, saw its price slashed and piles of games offered on top to sweeten the deal.


What I wonder at this point is if the change really came from listening to consumers "candid" feedbacks ('u suk'). I suspect it's more what happened at retail (things like the amazon best seller list or gamestop pushing for the PS4), pressures from first party studios ('guys you are killing us here!') or feedback from publishers ('You are on the right path to get the Wii U treatment').
 
hodj

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Abefroman_sl said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sony_BMG

http://www.iclarified.com/entry/index.php?enid=15663

Stop acting like Sony is some kind of fucking saint. They don't give two fucks about you. They would have done the same shit as MS. They might have had plans to do the same shit until the huge shitstorm that hit MS.
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One of those is ancient, the other is Sony legitimately shutting down someone who was hacking their hardware and making it easy for people to pirate their games or something?

How are either of these comparable to Microsoft literally trying to rewrite the publisher/consumer relationship vis a vis ownership and consumer rights regarding video games?

Cause I'm not seeing it.

added: Actually I'm not even getting what you're saying about Sony/BMG at all. Its not ancient but it looks like what? A merger? Oh no. Not remotely the same issue as we have here with Microsoft and the anti gamer movements they made going into this whole reveal.
 
Abefroman

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Szlia_sl said:
I must say I am surprised about the 180. I found their (now defunct) DRM policies to be extremely stupid, offensive even, but I assumed they knew something we didn't know. I assumed they did some marketing research and that it showed the DRM policies did not hinder the mass appeal of the product. I guess there was no research. Or did not realize how generalist media would relay the E3 info and how through blogs, twitter, facebook, reddit and the likes, the so called "hardcore gamer" could get the word out to the masses of average customers just how bad the DRM stuff was.

Then again, I should have remembered that Microsoft is the company that released the Xbox, a console that, a couple months after its launch, saw its price slashed and piles of games offered on top to sweeten the deal.


What I wonder at this point is if the change really came from listening to consumers "candid" feedbacks ('u suk'). I suspect it's more what happened at retail (things like the amazon best seller list or gamestop pushing for the PS4), pressures from first party studios ('guys you are killing us here!') or feedback from publishers ('You are on the right path to get the Wii U treatment').
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Simply a business decision. They probably saw that any gains they would have made from the new policies wouldn't even come close to the money they would lose. Don't think for one second Sony didn't have a bunch of meetings discussing if they should follow MS down the same path.
 
Abefroman

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hodj_sl said:
One of those is ancient, the other is Sony legitimately shutting down someone who was hacking their hardware and making it easy for people to pirate their games or something?

How are either of these comparable to Microsoft literally trying to rewrite the publisher/consumer relationship vis a vis ownership and consumer rights regarding video games?

Cause I'm not seeing it.

added: Actually I'm not even getting what you're saying about Sony/BMG at all. Its not ancient but it looks like what? A merger? Oh no. Not remotely the same issue as we have here with Microsoft and the anti gamer movements they made going into this whole reveal.
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If i buy a console shouldn't I be able to do with it what I want? Sony sure as hell doesn't think so. 6 years is hardly ancient and shows that Sony isn't in the business of giving a shit about you.
 
hodj

hodj

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Abefroman_sl said:
If i buy a console shouldn't I be able to do with it what I want?
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Not if it involves actively hacking the system and then selling or giving that information away to millions of others so they can steal. How far down the retarded rabbit hole you diving here bro?

6 years is ancient in both a technological sense, and in the sense that in that 6 years Sony has suffered quite a bit financially and struggled and now the ps4 shows that this time in the desert has brought them some fucking clarity, which is exactly what Microsoft needs.

Again: Not that any of that would justify what Microsoft tried to do, so tu quo que and two wrongs fallacy just a little harder and maybe you'll become just a little less wrong. Probably not though.
 
Hekotat

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joeboo_sl said:
I'm personally holding off on ordering either system for now. The Xbox One seems like a dumpster fire of a situation so far, but I don't really trust Sony to not botch this launch, especially if they end up selling significantly more systems than they initially estimated. After the PSN hacking/downtime debacle of a couple years ago, and now this:

http://www.ign.com/articles/2013/06/...cking-consoles

Sony can definitely manage to fuck up their fair share of stuff as well. I'll probably let the dust settle for a few months and pick up a PS4 after the first of the year sometime.
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To be fair they've had several updates within the past few years fuck something up and because of that I've always waited at least a week before updating mine.
 
Z

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Definitely keeping my ps4 preorder. (Feel like I have to say that or face the wrath of the the Sony defense force)

As a huge Forza fan, I will probably be preordering an Xbone as well. I tried to tell myself Driveclub would at least hold me over, but it is not getting very positive attention right now. Even if every multiplat is better on the ps4, I can still probably justify 500 bucks for one game. I've played Forza 4 at least a few hours a week since it was released.

Now a question! How do you guys think multiplayer titles will fare between systems? I know all the MS marketing rhetoric for the cloud stuff has rightfully turned some people off, but having the dedicated server resources really does offer some cool opportunities. Does anyone think games like Battlefield, The Division and Destiny could have some advantages on the Xbone (not talking about graphical improvements)?
 
Foggy

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We don't know if PSN+ will have dedicated servers or not. It is safe to assume Division and Destiny will have their own dedicated servers if Sony does not provide them since they are MMO-lite.
 
Szlia

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Abefroman_sl said:
Simply a business decision. They probably saw that any gains they would have made from the new policies wouldn't even come close to the money they would lose. Don't think for one second Sony didn't have a bunch of meetings discussing if they should follow MS down the same path.
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I understand why they did it. What I don't understand is how their initial DRM plan could have been devised without realizing beforehand that it would lead to an epic catastrophe. It's not like the reception was not as good as expected: they got demolished. So any kind of survey / focus group / whatever should have shown that it would be a very tough sell. Maybe they bet Sony would have similar policies (many of us thought they would too), but that's one dangerous bet to make.
 
Abefroman

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hodj_sl said:
Not if it involves actively hacking the system and then selling or giving that information away to millions of others so they can steal. How far down the retarded rabbit hole you diving here bro?

6 years is ancient in both a technological sense, and in the sense that in that 6 years Sony has suffered quite a bit financially and struggled and now the ps4 shows that this time in the desert has brought them some fucking clarity, which is exactly what Microsoft needs.

Again: Not that any of that would justify what Microsoft tried to do, so tu quo que and two wrongs fallacy just a little harder and maybe you'll become just a little less wrong. Probably not though.
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Iv'e derailed this long enough. In closing, I'm simply stating that Sony has done shady shit too and is in the business to make money, not fighting for your rights.

I'm really surprised that MS didn't do a 180 before E3. They should have seen the writing on the wall after just the rumor of their plans caused a shitstorm. Going to be interesting to see how many heads roll within the next 6 months over this. Or could it be possible they were under the impression that Sony was going the same route.
 
Xexx

Xexx

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Hekotat_sl said:
To be fair they've had several updates within the past few years fuck something up and because of that I've always waited at least a week before updating mine.
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I dont think ive ever played my PS3 enough to update it when an update is rolled out.
 
Z

Zombie Thorne_sl

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Szlia_sl said:
I understand why they did it. What I don't understand is how their initial DRM plan could have been devised without realizing beforehand that it would lead to an epic catastrophe. It's not like the reception was not as good as expected: they got demolished. So any kind of survey / focus group / whatever should have shown that it would be a very tough sell. Maybe they bet Sony would have similar policies (many of us thought they would too), but that's one dangerous bet to make.
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I think they targeted their marketing research at the wrong group. I still don't think the hardcore gamer is their target audience. They want the ios crowd. Any data pulled from that group would likely lead them to think an all digital approach would be fine. They completely failed to think who the real early adopters were and designed a product for the mass market.
 
hodj

hodj

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Abefroman_sl said:
Iv'e derailed this long enough. In closing, I'm simply stating that Sony has done shady shit too and is in the business to make money, not fighting for your rights.

I'm really surprised that MS didn't do a 180 before E3. They should have seen the writing on the wall after just the rumor of their plans caused a shitstorm. Going to be interesting to see how many heads roll within the next 6 months over this. Or could it be possible they were under the impression that Sony was going the same route.
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No one is arguing Sony is some white knight defending our rights. We're saying that they suffered and lost enough money this last generation that they've smartened up enough in the short term to deliver a decent product this time, and now Microsoft needs to suffer the same process so they'll grow a fucking brain again as well.

You're arguing a strawman and trying to excuse Microsoft by pointing to not even remotely comparable Sony mistakes.

A far better example of Sony recently fucking over consumers that would work better is proprietary memory cards for the vita being as much as 3-5 times the cost of regular memory cards. Even that isn't comparable to Microsoft trying to literally wipe away the concept of game ownership in one fell swoop and demanding we fucking smile about it while they do it.

I'm not surprised Microsoft didn't back off this at E3, they are fucking tone deaf dude. This is what happens when companies become insulated from market punishment for their stupid mistakes, and this is why the market needs to punish them when they do. Its either that, or the government needs to hyper regulate them and break companies like Microsoft and Sony both up into smaller divisions based on each division's specialty.
 
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