The Hobbit: The Battle of the Five Armies (2014)

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etchazz

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Gavinrad_sl said:
Lol what? His publishers were the ones who pressured him to write Lord of the Rings. He rewrote the Riddles in the Dark chapter, which changed Gollum and the ring, because otherwise the trilogy would have made no sense. Since this also now means Bilbo lied to the dwarves, he explains that away as the influence of the ring.
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you couldn't be more wrong. His publishers stopped him from completely rewriting "The Hobbit" as he tried to tie it into the LOTR storyline. He made some changes to the original novel, but the true retcon that he wanted to write was prevented by the publisher at the time, with good reason.
 
Amzin

Amzin

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Pressuring him to write LOTR and preventing him from re-writing the Hobbit are not mutually exclusive actions. Occasionally publishers do actually do smart things.
 
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Zignor 3_sl

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etchazz_sl said:
Get a hold of the original Hobbit book and read it. There is absolutely no mention in that book whatsoever of Sauron, or the one true ring, or of any impending doom, or a necromancer, or anything at all that ties in to the LOTR.
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The only changes made to the actual plot were done in the Riddles of the Dark chapter. The ring is made a bit more menacing and of much greater importance to Gollum, but it's never explained why, or even hinted at. Gollum is also made much nastier. The original riddle game was a pretty polite affair, with Gollum willingly offering up the ring to Bilbo (who had already found it by that point) at the end, and even guiding him out of the tunnels.

As for the rest of it, the Necromancer was absolutely in the original text, the "One Ring" still isn't referred to as such in the revised edition, nor is the name of Sauron. Any "retconning" beyond the Gollum chapter was done in LoTR itself, where it's explained that the Necromancer was actually Sauron, the true identity of Bilbo's ring is revealed, etc.

And there is no memory loss or any such thing regarding Sauron's return. Gandalf suspects that the Necromancer is either Sauron or one of his servants early on, well before the events of the Hobbit. The rest of the White Council (largely Saruman) refuses to believe this is the case for a long while, and doesn't act until the events of The Hobbit. They launch an assault on Dol Guldur, drive Sauron out, and his spirit or whatever retreats to Mordor and hides there, secretly rebuilding its strength until the time that LoTR begins.
 
Gavinmad

Gavinmad

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For all the people bitching about why they didn't just fly to Mordor.

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kegkilla

kegkilla

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I think another theme of LotR is that you shouldnt smoke weed. at first Gandalf smokes tons of chronic and hes always fucking up. dumbass looks like a disheveled mess, gets his ass beat by Sauruman, then almost kills everyone with that cave mess. After the balrog fight he goes to rehab and gets his shit together.
 
lurkingdirk

lurkingdirk

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I'd smoke weed with Gandalf. Damn, imagine what his, "Here, hold my beer," moments would be like. Shit be flying around and exploding everywhere.
 
Big Phoenix

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Zignor 3_sl said:
The only changes made to the actual plot were done in the Riddles of the Dark chapter. The ring is made a bit more menacing and of much greater importance to Gollum, but it's never explained why, or even hinted at. Gollum is also made much nastier. The original riddle game was a pretty polite affair, with Gollum willingly offering up the ring to Bilbo (who had already found it by that point) at the end, and even guiding him out of the tunnels.

As for the rest of it, the Necromancer was absolutely in the original text, the "One Ring" still isn't referred to as such in the revised edition, nor is the name of Sauron. Any "retconning" beyond the Gollum chapter was done in LoTR itself, where it's explained that the Necromancer was actually Sauron, the true identity of Bilbo's ring is revealed, etc.

And there is no memory loss or any such thing regarding Sauron's return. Gandalf suspects that the Necromancer is either Sauron or one of his servants early on, well before the events of the Hobbit. The rest of the White Council (largely Saruman) refuses to believe this is the case for a long while, and doesn't act until the events of The Hobbit. They launch an assault on Dol Guldur, drive Sauron out, and his spirit or whatever retreats to Mordor and hides there, secretly rebuilding its strength until the time that LoTR begins.
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This shit all sounds as confusing and conflicting as the bible.
 
Azrayne

Azrayne

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I didn't even bother finishing the second movie, stopped somewhere around when Legolas is in fucking Laketown for whatever reason. Pretty sure this one will be just as bad, which is a shame, because The Hobbit is one of my all time favorite books and I read it every year or so, I had high hopes for the movies, even after the first was kinda average.

Fucker should have just stuck with 2 movies.
 
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a_skeleton_03

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I feel real good that I have resisted all temptations and not watched any of these movies yet. The new trailer just further reinforced that he is just money grabbing.
 
Eomer

Eomer

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So many jaded people here. Are the Hobbit movies as good as the LOTR series? Fuck no. Did they stretch the source material past the breaking point to milk an extra movie or two out of it? Absolutely! That shit was obvious the second that Legolas and Kate were cast, and while it wasn't as egregious in the LOTR movies, Liv Tyler had no business having as many lines as she did there either.

But fuck it, the movies were reasonably entertaining from my perspective, and I look forward to seeing another huge war in the third, preferably with as much Beorn action as possible. Some of you act like Jackson raped your first born or some shit.

Although this thread did make me go download a 1080p rip the other night, and I fired it up on my home theatre. I originally watched the first one on the HT as well, but the second one was in the theatre for the first viewing. In any case, good fucking god do some of the CGI and effects look glaringly bad when not viewed in 3D. It was really jarring, and I don't remember thinking that in the theatre. Something about the transition from 48 fps in 3d to whatever the Blu-Ray rip was, I guess.
 
j00t

j00t

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a_skeleton_03_sl said:
I feel real good that I have resisted all temptations and not watched any of these movies yet. The new trailer just further reinforced that he is just money grabbing.
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Nothing against you personally, a_skeleton_03... But these statements just irk me. How many people in Hollywood would you describe as NOT being money grabbing? They didn't get into the business to be poor and unknown
 
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Dumar_sl

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There's a difference, a line, between being a soulless money-sucking whore and havingsomeartistic integrity. Hollywood has fewer and fewer of the latter, almost to the point where there's none left. I don't know about Jackson, but the Hobbit movies are mostly pathetic.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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these movies are only cash grabs in the sense that they know their audience and they are giving people what they want. jackson wanted another big hit to boost his career and after launching a few box office bombs he really needed a boost. tolkien saved his butt the last time so he went back to the well . its unfortunate he had so little material to work with in the hobbit, which is why things feel so padded. but i would not say he is doing this to fuck people out of their money, the dude is trying to save his career. and i honestly believe he has passion for the hobbit and maybe he only wanted to do 2 movies, but since he is on the decline he had to do what the studio heads wanted. the movies while the storyline has been hijacked by fan fiction on the whole are well made in their own rights. he even brought everyone he could from the LOTR films to show up. a hack director would just use all new actors.
 
Gavinmad

Gavinmad

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Maester Chuk_sl said:
these movies are only cash grabs in the sense that they know their audience and they are giving people what they want. jackson wanted another big hit to boost his career and after launching a few box office bombs he really needed a boost. tolkien saved his butt the last time so he went back to the well . its unfortunate he had so little material to work with in the hobbit, which is why things feel so padded. but i would not say he is doing this to fuck people out of their money, the dude is trying to save his career. and i honestly believe he has passion for the hobbit and maybe he only wanted to do 2 movies, but since he is on the decline he had to do what the studio heads wanted. the movies while the storyline has been hijacked by fan fiction on the whole are well made in their own rights. he even brought everyone he could from the LOTR films to show up. a hack director would just use all new actors.
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What a fucking retarded post. He only directed two movies between Return of the King and An Unexpected Journey, King Kong, which grossed 550m, and Lovely Bones, which bombed. His career was fine before he decided to exploit the fuck out of the Hobbit.
 
Chukzombi

Chukzombi

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king kong while a good movie was not as good as any of the LoTR films and lovely bones was just terrible. critically as well as commercially. dude went back to the well and he probably shouldnt have. at least not with something like the hobbit.
 
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