The Odyssey (2026)

Intrinsic

Intrinsic

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Arbitrary said:
So this film is just overtly a new front in the culture war. If it does really well we're going to get a thousand articles about how actually the awful shit that was losing companies money makes companies money and we should all just shut up.
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As a glass half full type of guy, let me be counter for a second…

If this does well then it should (super heavy emphasis there), show that if a talented director actually focuses on making a quality movie the DEI hires and everything shouldn’t (see above emphasis) matter. Kind of what has been argued before about no one caring if a tranny is in your movie, but it is when the tranny becomes the point of the movie, etc. Or how no one cares about Ripley or Sarah Connor or other characters that were just good characters and not “strong female hero!”

Unfortunately every piece of evidence here would suggest otherwise since no one can keep their fucking mouth shut and just make a movie anymore. Maybe he did make a good movie and it’ll be a surprise. But all the crap around it will guarantee it’ll be a long time before I give it a shot.
 
OU Ariakas

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Intrinsic said:
Kind of what has been argued before about no one caring if a tranny is in your movie, but it is when the tranny becomes the point of the movie, etc. Or how no one cares about Ripley or Sarah Connor or other characters that were just good characters and not “strong female hero!”

Unfortunately every piece of evidence here would suggest otherwise since no one can keep their fucking mouth shut and just make a movie anymore. Maybe he did make a good movie and it’ll be a surprise. But all the crap around it will guarantee it’ll be a long time before I give it a shot.
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It has been grating on me that Ripley and Connor are the only two women that ever get mentioned in this debate so I was trying to think of some others that would be good. Rosamund Pike in Hostiles and Gone Girl is that type of female character, albeit diametrically opposite roles, in both of these movies. I would argue that she can elevate average writing to something better, but just doesn't really do that many "guy" movies. Carrie Anne Moss as Trinity is also that way in the Matrix Trilogy, badass but not invincible. Claire Danes in Homeland was a neurotic mess, but it was well written and acted to show her being competent and, at times, almost prescient but also very human. Hell, you could argue that the 3 lead women in Friends were "strong female characters" because they did not cower in fear whenever something went sideways. None of the examples above would you ever think of any of them as acting masculine, but none of the are weak wallflowers and it really seems to make these modern examples stand out as deliberately trying to make women act like a man because the writers/actresses do not understand the difference between strength and aggression/bravado.
 
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Dr.Retarded

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OU Ariakas said:
It has been grating on me that Ripley and Connor are the only two women that ever get mentioned in this debate so I was trying to think of some others that would be good. Rosamund Pike in Hostiles and Gone Girl is that type of female character, albeit diametrically opposite roles, in both of these movies. I would argue that she can elevate average writing to something better, but just doesn't really do that many "guy" movies. Carrie Anne Moss as Trinity is also that way in the Matrix Trilogy, badass but not invincible. Claire Danes in Homeland was a neurotic mess, but it was well written and acted to show her being competent and, at times, almost prescient but also very human. Hell, you could argue that the 3 lead women in Friends were "strong female characters" because they did not cower in fear whenever something went sideways. None of the examples above would you ever think of any of them as acting masculine, but none of the are weak wallflowers and it really seems to make these modern examples stand out as deliberately trying to make women act like a man because the writers/actresses do not understand the difference between strength and aggression/bravado.
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Scully in the XFiles and Starbuck in BSG are a couple more off the top of my head. There's lots of decent examples out there.

It's when do you get hit over the head with things like the super duper assassin lady movies where that strong wamen shit starts to get egregiously annoying.
 
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Seananigans

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Intrinsic said:
As a glass half full type of guy, let me be counter for a second…

If this does well then it should (super heavy emphasis there), show that if a talented director actually focuses on making a quality movie the DEI hires and everything shouldn’t (see above emphasis) matter. Kind of what has been argued before about no one caring if a tranny is in your movie, but it is when the tranny becomes the point of the movie, etc. Or how no one cares about Ripley or Sarah Connor or other characters that were just good characters and not “strong female hero!”

Unfortunately every piece of evidence here would suggest otherwise since no one can keep their fucking mouth shut and just make a movie anymore. Maybe he did make a good movie and it’ll be a surprise. But all the crap around it will guarantee it’ll be a long time before I give it a shot.
Click to expand...

This is nonsensical, the only way to get where you're going is to back into it. You can't organically end up with a good movie that just happens to have DEI and trannies.

No good creator includes these terrible casting and race-swapping, trannies, etc. decisions. They're mutually exclusive. If a creator is making these shit decisions, it's because they're shitty and will make a shitty product.
 
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Intrinsic

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OU Ariakas said:
It has been grating on me that Ripley and Connor are the only two women that ever get mentioned in this debate so I was trying to think of some others that would be good. Rosamund Pike in Hostiles and Gone Girl is that type of female character, albeit diametrically opposite roles, in both of these movies. I would argue that she can elevate average writing to something better, but just doesn't really do that many "guy" movies. Carrie Anne Moss as Trinity is also that way in the Matrix Trilogy, badass but not invincible. Claire Danes in Homeland was a neurotic mess, but it was well written and acted to show her being competent and, at times, almost prescient but also very human. Hell, you could argue that the 3 lead women in Friends were "strong female characters" because they did not cower in fear whenever something went sideways. None of the examples above would you ever think of any of them as acting masculine, but none of the are weak wallflowers and it really seems to make these modern examples stand out as deliberately trying to make women act like a man because the writers/actresses do not understand the difference between strength and aggression/bravado.
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You aren’t wrong. In full disclosure in the middle of typing that post I asked ChatGPT for more examples because those were also the only two immediate ones that came to mind lol. I was also thinking about Jamie Lee Curtis in Halloween or someone else not coming to mind.

It wasn’t a very well structured argument but was just a thought.
 
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zzeris

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I think there's almost zero chance this will be anything close to a flop especially with all the premium screen lockdown.

The real question will be the legs, especially with the fierce competition. It's also three hours long and rated R. A 650 million global finish would not be a bomb but I think it would be disappointing to the bean counters.

All the culture war stuff aside, I find the costume and art direction for this movie to be pretty baffling. Like there's stuff that would not look good in any movie, let alone one with a 250 million dollar budget. Look at Bernthal's shirt / chest piece? What is that? And the Batman armor. It's so odd and doesn't even really seem like a cohesive "unique" take but simply bad work. It's some awful mix of historical, modern, and fantastical.

The costume designer has a pretty accomplished resume but pretty much all her stuff was for modern day attire. Outside of Maleficent 2 (a sequel, so she had a reference to keep to already) I don't see anything historical or fantasy based or even science fiction. I think she was out of her wheel house or Nolan had really terrible ideas that he wanted to stick to.
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I want to agree but it will be interesting. This movie specifically infers it doesn't need the male audience who would watch Motor City the very next week. Her Private Hell looks more interesting to a wider audience. Spiderman will crush it in two weeks. Can they pull out most of that 650 million in two weeks, especially since Nolan doesn't feel safe in letting in a wider early sample? With a possibly weaker international audience today? Before Covid, I would say this was a cinch. Today? I think there's a solid chance this doesn't make $600m.
 
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Dr.Retarded

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Arbitrary said:
Laurie Strode, Kirsty Cotton, Nancy Thompson
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I had typed out my response to OU Ariakas OU Ariakas earlier, and I was sitting there thinking about it more over my coffee.

You start going into horror movies specifically, which Terminator was, and one of the first ones that popped in my head was Kirsty Cotton, specifically in the second film.

If you look at Hellraiser, it's that same sort of character arc that Ripley had dealing with an unknown threat almost beat for beat, just totally different settings.

She's trapped inside a house where she knows something evil is up there consuming things in the attic/ship. Confronts the threat, on the house/ship blows up.

Kristi is then waylaid and called a lunatic because of cenobites/aliens, and then she ends up having to descend into hell/nest. Your firefight moment is the cenobite showdown for hellraiser where you get the audience pumped up, but then ends horribly, but she still comes out on top.
 
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DickTrickle

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zzeris said:
I want to agree but it will be interesting. This movie specifically infers it doesn't need the male audience who would watch Motor City the very next week. Her Private Hell looks more interesting to a wider audience. Spiderman will crush it in two weeks. Can they pull out most of that 650 million in two weeks, especially since Nolan doesn't feel safe in letting in a wider early sample? With a possibly weaker international audience today? Before Covid, I would say this was a cinch. Today? I think there's a solid chance this doesn't make $600m.
Click to expand...

Motor City will be lucky to break $10 million its opening weekend. Moana is bombing (not a lot of audience overlap but less parents may be theater fatigued financially by not going). I even think there's a small chance Brand New Day doesn't go quite as large as some people think, even if it's still monstrous. Can it really get back that Infinity War/End Game kind of audience after a decade of mostly mediocre and disjointed followups? Maybe I'll be wrong and it will outpace No Way Home.

The thing I come back to is Oppenheimer's foreign numbers. An American-centric relatively dry R-rated biopic made $660 million overseas post Covid. Nolan has the global pull that few directors do. Yeah, I know there was Barbenheimer and the fact it was well reviewed, but on the surface a film like The Odyssey should be way more appealing to the wider public than Oppenheimer.

It will be interesting to see how it develops. If anyone can ride the culture war wave without drowning, it might be him.
 
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M Power

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Well my mother mentioned she wanted to see this then I told her about how it has blacks playing Helen of Troy and tranny's and now she said she wont buy a ticket. So that's -1 ticket sold. Fuck you Hollywood!
 
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Adebisi

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OU Ariakas said:
It has been grating on me that Ripley and Connor are the only two women that ever get mentioned in this debate so I was trying to think of some others that would be good. Rosamund Pike in Hostiles and Gone Girl is that type of female character, albeit diametrically opposite roles, in both of these movies. I would argue that she can elevate average writing to something better, but just doesn't really do that many "guy" movies. Carrie Anne Moss as Trinity is also that way in the Matrix Trilogy, badass but not invincible. Claire Danes in Homeland was a neurotic mess, but it was well written and acted to show her being competent and, at times, almost prescient but also very human. Hell, you could argue that the 3 lead women in Friends were "strong female characters" because they did not cower in fear whenever something went sideways. None of the examples above would you ever think of any of them as acting masculine, but none of the are weak wallflowers and it really seems to make these modern examples stand out as deliberately trying to make women act like a man because the writers/actresses do not understand the difference between strength and aggression/bravado.
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Here's my list of badass bitches that aren't omg girl power coded.

Crystal from The Hunt
The Bride
Trinity
Furiosa
Luv from Blade Runner
Arya Stark
Brianne of tarth
Keema the wire
Lisbeth Salandar
Ava from Ex Machine
Angel of Verdun
Cast of Annihilation
Vi from Arcane
Maya from Zero Dark Thirty
Leeloo from Fifth Element
Malenia, Blade of Miquella
Patricia from Gomorrah
Hela from Thor Ragnarok
Dot season 5 Fargo
Janet from The Kingdom
Emma Lynnwood from zerozerozero
 
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TheNozz

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Adebisi said:
Here's my list of badass bitches that aren't omg girl power coded.

Crystal from The Hunt
The Bride
Trinity
Furiosa
Luv from Blade Runner
Arya Stark
Brianne of tarth
Keema the wire
Lisbeth Salandar
Ava from Ex Machine
Angel of Verdun
Cast of Annihilation
Vi from Arcane
Maya from Zero Dark Thirty
Leeloo from Fifth Element
Malenia, Blade of Miquella
Patricia from Gomorrah
Hela from Thor Ragnarok
Dot season 5 Fargo
Janet from The Kingdom
Emma Lynnwood from zerozerozero
Click to expand...
The Boss from MGS3
 
Dr.Retarded

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Adebisi said:
Here's my list of badass bitches that aren't omg girl power coded.

Crystal from The Hunt
The Bride
Trinity
Furiosa
Luv from Blade Runner
Arya Stark
Brianne of tarth
Keema the wire
Lisbeth Salandar
Ava from Ex Machine
Angel of Verdun
Cast of Annihilation
Vi from Arcane
Maya from Zero Dark Thirty
Leeloo from Fifth Element
Malenia, Blade of Miquella
Patricia from Gomorrah
Hela from Thor Ragnarok
Dot season 5 Fargo
Janet from The Kingdom
Emma Lynnwood from zerozerozero
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You got a few good ones in there, but then you have shit like the cast from Annihilation and the AI from Ex Machina, and specifically Furiosa what I'm assuming is from the first film. If that wasn't a hit you over the head woman power deal despite the movie being good, and having Mad Max take a back seat, I don't know what is. It wasn't because she was a great character it was because everything else elevated her being a main element to the story.

The women from Annihilation we're all inept and Natalie Portman ended up succumbing to the threat, not a win. The other one is artificial intelligence, so I guess maybe you can say that's a woman somehow, who the fuck knows.

A lot of the stuff on the list though I haven't ever watched and probably never will.
 
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Dr.Retarded

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Adebisi said:
that's a shame
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I mean is there anything in particular you would recommend based upon my initial post? I'm all for checking out something worth it, but we both know how we settle on the Frankenstein monstrosity that came out, what was it last year?

And just to save you some time:
Die kill repeat
Kill Bill
Matrix
Gotm

All decent female heroines.
 
Goatface

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one of my favorite female fighters, Valeria from Conan.
 
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