World of Warcraft: Classic

Being a rogue in AV was so fun. Just playing the role of asshole. “Oh your small group thinks you’re gonna get this graveyard? It’d be a shame if I popped all my cooldowns on your healer and then vanish away”

I remember healbotting the first grand marshal on our server with the unstoppable force fucking knocking retards off that bridge

Pocket healers 4 lyfe. =

Actually my primary concern about Classic servers is that all static servers degenerate over time as users discover exploits and degenerative metas which become more and more abused. #nochanges people will fight any attempts to enforce an environment that was more like the original game, and they will have a legitimate argument so it's not easy to dismiss. I've been a developer for an EQ emu for the last 5.5 years, so I understand this well.

Some examples: (I could provide many)

Al'Kabor/EQMac was stuck in PoP for 10 years and developers abandoned it. What happened there? Nobody killed Vex Thal trash because they abused an exploit that allowed them to get targets for mages across the zone which they parked half a dozen of in the zone to summon the raid to each boss. The zone was essentially ruined. Behavior that would have been disallowed in 2002 had developers noticed it, but the exploit was not well known in 2002.

Then there was pet pulling, which allowed people to use low level pets to single pull anything in the game. We had that in for awhile on our emu, and the result was people pet pulling every goddamn mob in the game (fire giants, lguk named, kithicor DEs etc) which fundamentally broke a core aspect of the game. Sony developers didn't fix this at the time because it wasn't abused anywhere near the level it was on our emu, but they certainly would have if it was. (it was fixed after our era) So by demanding zero changes, #nochanges people are demanding a gameplay experience unlike the original.

Now as for WoW, I saw a YouTube video yesterday which discussed the Blizzard AV post, and it mentioned that AV was the highest honor farm for ranking. This was the exact opposite of my experience with the game in 2005: I was #1 on my server until BGs launched (I won the tabard) then my rank tanked because I did nothing but AVs. The reply I got was this:

in private servers they do AV premades and still finish the game in 20 mins.( 14 mins is my record) Even with all the elites, the mines, the shreders and everything. we're talking about insane amount of honor with this way. If AV turns to a turtle, u afk and u take 15 min break. But generally speaking, turtlers getting shit on by their faction cus noone wants a turtle game. They are rankers and all they want is the maximum honor per hour.

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That is badly deteriorated gameplay. Players abusing how the honor mechanics work by throwing games and ruining the experience for themselves and everybody else in the BG. It's Blizzard's fault for making such an abuseable system, but if you #nochanges the server, then it's going to end up being something unlike what we experienced in 2005-2006. WoW is less a sandbox than EQ was so it's not as severe there, but PvP ranking will probably end up quite different and AV could potentially be ruined.

Incidentally my Preform AV Enabler addon wasn't released until just several weeks before BC, so if that's usable then AV isn't going to feel very classic. I seriously hope they disable it in the same manner they did in 2012 as I do not like what it did to the game.

BoozeCube said:

When PvP was first introduced in WoW there was no honor system, there was no honor points , HK's, dishonorable kills, and/or ranks gear from it. You simply saw the red guy from the other faction and shit on his face because the world demanded it. Not for some reward. Bring back full on classic.

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Sniping killing blows for leaderboard bragging rights was all the reward pvp ever needed.

early AV was the most fun clusterfuck of a battleground. you could make some serious gold just PvEing there.

Lunis said:

early AV was the most fun clusterfuck of a battleground. you could make some serious gold just PvEing there.

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I'm pretty sure I like leveled a priest from 50something to 60 killing stuff in a pve cave while getting a bunch of honor.

I'm guessing we have a bunch of alliance players and a bunch of jerkoffs like the 2 people above remembering AV as being good. Original AV was garbage. It was completely imbalanced and turned into a zergfest long before any changes were made once the Alliance realized they had a much easier time than horde could ever hope to have if they just rushed to the faction leader.

That bridge made it almost impossible for the horde to beat the alliance once that shit was figured out. And you can't make people forget what they already know.

AV was epic and a lot of fun. Farming for all the wolf riders and ice lord and all that stuff was fun. Wow now is about the grind and not that kinda play, whiny min max people who wanted it to be just another honor grind ruined it.

Blizzard should just fix the honor grind anyway that rank system was terrible and toxic.

The map didnt even last hours once the Aliance started zerg rushing the faction leader.

Alliance could also skip all of the NPCs in the horde base after 1.11, while the horde still had to kill many of them. (i.e. the blacksmith) A single alliance of any class could take the relief hut, solo, which meant that it was just a matter of how fast they could ride there. The NPCs provided a means of protection to the defending Alliance in their base who could hide behind them.

Archer coverage in the horde base was just awful. Alliance had a large building right under the towers that shielded them from the archers and horde players. It's a very short run up that ramp into the inner base under the towers. The choke there wasn't very effective largely because of that building.

Also don't forget Stormpike graveyard which is by far the hardest non-base graveyard to take. The entire north region of the map is very linear while the area around the horde base is wide open.

I would also argue that paladins with DA gave them an edge in defense of graveyard banners as well.

I liked AV because I like large scale PvP (it's a fucking MMOG after all) and AV was the only option for it. I hated how unbalanced the map was, which is why I originally made Preform horde only in protest. (yeah, it was petty)