Carnival Row

Lanx said:

so yea or nay? this has 1star score according to foh reviews

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Shit is good. Started slow, turned good quick. 8/10. That last episode was great.

Amazon is 2 for 2 thus far.

Lanx said:

so yea or nay? this has 1star score according to foh reviews

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I'd suggest the 1star review is from someone who hasn't seen it, but is rustled that people don't take their SJW ranting seriously enough and it might be some huge trap where they will watch it and come out as a gay liberal.

Which is all kind of beside the point, because the show is about as SJW as The Boys is.

Just finished this last night.

It felt like it started a bit slow, but it certainly ramped up and by the end of the final episode, I very much wanted more. A solid 4-out-of-5-Star show for sure.

The world in this show more or less mirrors the world during that era, though. Unexplored shit, fewer rights, limited employment options. The fae kingdoms aren't that different from the Africa/India-Asian empire expansions attempted by Britain and other Euro nations back during that time. This is especially highlighted by the fae originally being exotic curiosities and more accepted, then tons of refugees/immigration happened and people started to feel pushed out of job opportunities and get pissed/violent against those impacting their livelihood and bringing religions over (people today forget that the Catholics were -really- distrusted and/or hated in the 19th/early to mid 20th century in America).

But mirroring that time, you're also going to find gradual pushes for more social acceptance, but I don't think the show is going to go "equal rights!" overnight. They'll probably mirror real life. The rich Puck guy will kind of be a pseudo-template. He basically grinded it out and amassed lots of money as a successful businessman, like a Carnegie figure (although he has shades of JP Morgan as well with his vision for an expansion of electricity as a big business opportunity).

zzeris said:

First, the show is excellent but that is not 100% the same thing, not even close. That's the problem with parallels which I think the show stays away from for the most part. Late 19th, early 20th century America was far different than today. The world was far different with unexplored areas, different nations, different power alignments, and about 6 billion less people. People weren't considered angry racists for not letting in every sad sap story in the world. In fact, most people were a lot more honest about the issues of diversity than today.

You are exactly right that people were angry about immigrants taking jobs but that's about the only parallel found. The US was still growing with a very small western pop and much fewer massive cities. No women working, far fewer rights, and no diversity hiring.

The show is great and I hope they continue to push stories instead of agendas.

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And not to mention, a lot of these concerns that are passed off as "bigotry"...were legitimate, we've just simplified history down to a narrative that matches our modern ideological outlook.
But people were angry about the massive crime waves that came with the Irish/Italians due to gang/mafia violence; this violence was absolutely real. They were also angry about the disruption in the job markets (Robber barons would import Irish because their families had less resources or were not even here to protest when the Irish died or some grossly unfair work condition was required. It essentially let the wealthy have an indentured servant class to exploit.) People downplay this while wondering why America doesn't have the robust labor protections Europe does have. They don't ever connect the fact that immigration was the main difference. Europe did not have massive waves of immigration coming in during the industrial revolution, in the early 20th century their labor had far more power to bargain and agitate politically. Anyone think those countries would have wound up with the large concessions labor managed if the business owners could truck in in millions of starving poor to do the job?


That said, watched the first episode. Enjoyed it. Seems like they aren't doing anything that is too on the nose, hopefully, as said, they keep it organic and show how complicated people are.

wormie said:

Finished it. Pretty good. Some SJW parallels can be drawn but I think that would be a mistake in this case.

Spoiler

leader of the party against the immigrants is a female sand person and the bad guy is a chick. Only stark SJW thing I think is the number of female leaders but it’s not overbearing so it works

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Personally, I'd just like to see a brave, beautiful movie about religious refugees who come somewhere to make a new life and end up making a few mistakes and transgressing the locals--only for the locals to become giant bigots and begin murdering them on site. The story would be about those refugees surviving and growing stronger, and fighting back against their oppressors.

Then I want the creator to say it was a parallel about Native Americans/Puritan settlers.

The complaint I have about the first season is there seemed to be a lot of divergent storylines that never really come together. There are a lot of characters in this show and some of them are merely there to further the plot, but in kind of a meaningless way. Or so it would seem at the moment.

After having finished season 1 I have no idea what conclusions I'm supposed to draw about the direction of the plot. I have a feeling this series is going to be a very slow burn.

Khane said:

The complaint I have about the first season is there seemed to be a lot of divergent storylines that never really come together. There are a lot of characters in this show and some of them are merely there to further the plot, but in kind of a meaningless way. Or so it would seem at the moment.

After having finished season 1 I have no idea what conclusions I'm supposed to draw about the direction of the plot. I have a feeling this series is going to be a very slow burn.

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The last EP tied a lot more shit than I expected. I felt there were a lot of characters indeed, but not that many that weren't useful, they were either a way to expose us to the world, or probably being set up for season 2, like the kobold master, or the fanatics, the werewolf. I think the show needed a bunch of characters, just to show us around, what the world was like.

Im talking mostly about

Right. Plus the Police are going to figure pretty damn heavily into the 2nd season, so having that background and character introduction helps.