Casual Rerolled WoW guild - Hyjal Horde

You still had to tab sunder to hold healing threat then figure out whatever mob the DPS decided to go ham on and then focus your sunders on that mobile. Every so often you'd underestimate threat on a target and it would peel to either DPS or healing and you'd have to quickly taunt it. If your taunt was down you'd have to stance dance into Battle to charge it then use your battle stance taunt instead. If it was a true AOE pull you'd have to dance in and out of battle stance and defensive stance to use TClap as one of your very few AOE threat gains. I found it fun and if you were a really good tank your DPS could be more free to unload completely on a mob. If your DPS was smart and hit the correct target you could even predictively taunt the mob and let the DPS unload so the mob peels at 20%'ish and dies before reaching the DPS. Anymore DPS just engages at second 0 and even the DPS just cares about maintaining the rotation instead of easing off the gas to avoid peeling threat.

Not saying it is good or bad. Just mentioning it isn't my preference.

Problem with Imperator is a lot of us already put in work learning it on our own via pugs and paid our dues watching idiots wipe us for a week. The though of going through that again when its so so easy to pug is pure insanity to me.

I'm impatient and immature when it comes to people learning around me. I almost lost my shit on mythic with people standing in bombs and GD fire and it was night 1 when we killed Kargath.

Needless_sl said:

It was still moderately difficult compared to what it is now, back then taunt functioned completely differently. Didn't it only match you with (highest threat # + 1) for the duration of the taunt, if you didn't actually increase the aggro you would drop down to where you were?

Plus later they buffed the threat generation of tanks to 300% of what it was, then again in cata from 300% to 500% where it just became a complete non-issue lol

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A true taunt still functions the same. It doesn't actually add threat it just makes the mob fixate you for 3 seconds.

Krassus_sl said:

Problem with Imperator is a lot of us already put in work learning it on our own via pugs and paid our dues watching idiots wipe us for a week. The though of going through that again when its so so easy to pug is pure insanity to me.

I'm impatient and immature when it comes to people learning around me. I almost lost my shit on mythic with people standing in bombs and GD fire and it was night 1 when we killed Kargath.

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Hah I agree. I've put in my Imp dues myself, but as the coordinator of the Saturday raids I feel that it is my duty. Also, since it is "my group" I want to see everyone succeed and want to see us progress.

Tenks_sl said:

I don't know when they changed tanking to being fairly faceroll but ... its fairly faceroll. There isn't really a concept of threat management anymore. You generate so much threat that holding it is trivial. It seems it is more about using actives to try and mitigate damage and avoid standing in fire than anything else and making sure to have awareness to pick up adds. I found tanking in vanilla rather fun because it was a competition between how much threat I could put out versus how much the DPS could generate. I didn't really care for tanking when I came back, though.

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Yeah I worry on the mitigation cd management primarily and the situational awareness too as far as thinking about trying a tank again. I have a hard enough time with it since coming back this fall to the game just with dps toons(and many in my guild on my old server loved to hit that inferior feeling home more than help unfortunately).

JTheRuler_sl said:

A true taunt still functions the same. It doesn't actually add threat it just makes the mob fixate you for 3 seconds.

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Ahh right, i know they made a change regarding how it works slightly at some point though didn't they? maybe they just made so you still match their threat even after it drops, but if you don't do anything then they'll obviously still hold threat after those 3 seconds?

Krassus_sl said:

Problem with Imperator is a lot of us already put in work learning it on our own via pugs and paid our dues watching idiots wipe us for a week. The though of going through that again when its so so easy to pug is pure insanity to me.

I'm impatient and immature when it comes to people learning around me. I almost lost my shit on mythic with people standing in bombs and GD fire and it was night 1 when we killed Kargath.

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This unfortunately is a catch 22 that makes folks like me feel like I'm left in a perpetual, never ending, catchup mode. It really is discouraging. Coming back in sept and doing SoO literally every day in pugs, not even caring about gear just wanting to learn the fights and figure out how to play better just even in norm and heroic... then going in the guild I was in's mythic and looking the fool for even trying and meeting with rather nasty considerations and being looked down for being inferior after working at things just really makes a person feel pretty much like it was wasted effort to even try. That's one of the reasons I've been trying to look at playing on another server. That and said guild is the top on that server atm with 2/7 Myth HM which really isn't something they should be so pretentious about as they are there.

I mean I dont think you're being as they are with your statements but yeah, it does suck when one encounters that when you're just wanting to be apart of a team and enjoy and improve.

Soygen_sl said:

As someone who is really only raiding Saturday, I don't really care if we do Imp or not. I can totally sympathize with those who play a lot more and have put in their dues learning the encounter. I'd rather not do it, than have to do it with a bunch of people who are already out of patience with people learning it.

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Well that's why I'm giving people the option to leave and have the people who need it stay. Once we get it down once people aren't going to mind killing it. It's the learning aspect of the fight that is especially frustrating. It's a long fight and doesn't start until the last 20%

Every time I read this thread I almost want to resub. Then I remember I have zero time to play.

I even got 10 days of free time and the only thing I did was try to get the UI mods I like working, was too busy to login again and do anything.

The thing with Imperator is that you can usually tell within a few pulls if the group is going to kill it. It's not a race per se, but you do need to be doing 20k dps or very close to it. More importantly, you need to not make any mistakes for the duration of a 12-13 minute fight. The worst part isn't the mines, or getting people to focus on the big add, or getting the reaver down before he starts face-kicking the tank. It's the fucking phase 4 nova. People--and I've been guilty of this a couple times--just lose their shit at the end when there's the big add splitting into a pile of little adds, mines that last twice as long, tanks shitting out balls of death when they run away, a leftover mage still fixating on people who need to get the hell out of the gorup, branded that's back down to 4 stacks, and on top of that a force nova that you DON'T run/jump through unless nobody else is remotely close to you. If you're within 4 yds of someone when the nova hits you, odds are extremely high that one or both of you are dead. When someone yells for everyone to just stop what they're doing and spread out until after nova, nobody dies, and then Imperator falls shortly afterwards.

So I think the reason people who put a lot of time already prefer to PUG it is because you don't worry about hurting feelings by booting screw ups from the raid after a couple pulls. There's no debates or arguing about whether it was retardation or just bad luck. They're gone and you replace with them with someone else more or less immediately, and hopefully the new guy doesn't make the same mistakes. With a guild group that's harder to do. You either have to have infinite patience if someone isn't getting it, you start kicking people which leads to drama, or you call the raid without killing him.

It's not a hard fight at all, it just requires ~12 minutes of constant focus on doing the mechanics right.

I can do whatever but I have to be out by 12

Vorph_sl said:

It's not a hard fight at all, it just requires ~12 minutes of constant focus on doing the mechanics right.

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And as you've said, the focus only comes from experiencing it which can be difficult if everyone wants only experienced people to do it. Said experience has to come from some source and if every group considers "let some other group help someone get the experience" then that becomes a bit of catch 22.

Impregnator fight is fun as a MW monk, theres actually a lot to do since i always control the branded related mechanics while maintaining high healing. life cocoon / diffuse magic rotation to completely negate branded is $$

Cad_sl said:

I'll never get experienced on Imp because every raid we do either doesn't try him or tries him once and then stops.

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I got my first normal and heroic imp kills using the premade finder. Think of it as a rite of passage.

I still have to keep a box of tampons up my ass to stop the blood flow.

Ceder_sl said:

This unfortunately is a catch 22 that makes folks like me feel like I'm left in a perpetual, never ending, catchup mode. It really is discouraging. Coming back in sept and doing SoO literally every day in pugs, not even caring about gear just wanting to learn the fights and figure out how to play better just even in norm and heroic... then going in the guild I was in's mythic and looking the fool for even trying and meeting with rather nasty considerations and being looked down for being inferior after working at things just really makes a person feel pretty much like it was wasted effort to even try. That's one of the reasons I've been trying to look at playing on another server. That and said guild is the top on that server atm with 2/7 Myth HM which really isn't something they should be so pretentious about as they are there.

I mean I dont think you're being as they are with your statements but yeah, it does suck when one encounters that when you're just wanting to be apart of a team and enjoy and improve.

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Don't take this the wrong way but that's YOUR lack of initiative man, no one is asking you to do anything we didn't all do. Let me give you an example and hopefully Lenaldo doesn't mind - Lenaldo wanted to raid heroic, he talked to Hist and came on a normal run 2 weeks ago. Hist gave him feedback which Lenaldo didn't get emotional or lose his shit about. This GD little young druid took the feedback and doubled his healing per second. Then the NEXT day joined imperator pugs and got it on his own like all of the rest of this heroic crew did. Then he took his friends and started his own pugs outside of our raids (again like we all do) and downed it again.

Even Kreug is in our club now after suffering like we all did. My first Imp kill didn't even involve rerolled either, PUG finder for life