Diablo 4 / IV / IIII / Fore / Cope / Seethe

Khane said:

It's kind of weird to call something a boost if it's available to anyone and everyone. It's baseline at that point. So why is it called a boost?

That's pretty nebulous.

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For leveling multiple characters in a season quickly, if you want to. You still have to level the first character to a high level to unlock them, and there are no short cuts. Buying the tier skips in the BP doesn't unlock them early either. If you have no desire to level more than 1 character in that season, then I guess they'll just go unused.

Seananigans said:

That is completely incoherent, so I'm not sure why you think there's no way to "wiggle out" of it.

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Heh, so you don't have a context for those statements because you haven't been following the game, at all. Cool.

edit: based on some of the reactions above, several of you just have no fucking clue, you're just flinging shit to see what sticks. Carry on.

Argarth said:

Heh, so you don't have a context for those statements because you haven't been following the game, at all. Cool.

edit: based on some of the reactions above, several of you just have no fucking clue, you're just flinging shit to see what sticks. Carry on.

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Well, the context is right there in that post. And you're already willing to "wiggle out of it" for them.

Which is kind of the point.

Khane said:

Well, the context is right there in that post. And you're already willing to "wiggle out of it" for them.

Which is kind of the point.

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What? Those statements are pretty clear, and I also have the context in which they were made, so they are crystal clear to me.
Blizzard can't wiggle out of these commitments with anything less than a bald faced lie. That was my point. We'll see.

GuardianX said:

I'm not sure if you are aware of this but...businesses lie. Like ALL the time.

They TRY not to lie about things that get them sued, but they still do.




Don't forget insta levels, I know you said "Progression Speed" but you know "Instant level 80!" is gunna be for sale in short order, likely free for the first release. Their justification will be "It's not max level!"



I just want a solid answer on "Vaulting" of content.

I know it's a possibility at the table of "Seasonal Passes" because Destiny does it, Warframe does it and I'm guessing more games that I never played do it.

I really don't think I'm gunna get an answer to this until release or even after the first major "Season" they have comes to a close.

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I've never encountered that concept in the way Destiny handled it, and wasn't it because of the complete overhaul they did early on? I'm honestly not concerned over them cutting notable chunks out of the game every quarter. On the other hand I am sure there will be seasonal stuff that comes and goes, like it is with Diablo 3 seasons currently. Is that the same as "vaulting" to you? Theoretically the same, but the scale matters.

rhinohelix said:

I dearly loved it and probably played 3000+ hours but look at where all that money is today.

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Take my steam library - I have all those games and could still play them again, but for 99% I never will. I paid them, experienced them, I'm done with them basically forever. I don't treat that money differently than the untold amounts I've pissed away on other hobbies, interests, travel and whatever else. In theory I would argue for all that staying just because - paid for that shit, it better be there so I can not play it until I die. But I'm also at a point where I see how it doesn't matter in the long run. I'm not loading up a decade old version of some retired game just because I can.

Khane said:

It's kind of weird to call something a boost if it's available to anyone and everyone. It's baseline at that point. So why is it called a boost?

That's pretty nebulous.

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I don't for a moment believe that there are no actual play benefits hidden in some fashion. What can you even put in there if you strictly include MTX only? Armor set, weapon, horse and cool and very important portrait frames and B.net forum frames? I don't see how you can have a "path" with that, if it's just a 6-10 item mtx bundle that demands 100 hours of play time. Which I guess highlights why I hate those things. If I pay it I better get all the shit no matter what, not on the condition that I dedicate a month or two to only their game. And crafting mats or boosts for getting mats are also power, just with enough intermediate steps that they could wiggle out of it on twitter. So yeah, I don't take those claims serious.

elidib said:

At some point they will probably sell gold, obols, veiled crystals, abstruse sigils, coiling wards, forgotten souls, scattered prisms, nightmare sigils, and ancestral sigils.

None of these directly give "player power" but all of them will be needed, especially gold in high quantities as everything that uses it ramps up very quickly.

Doomsayers will say "They're just selling player power indirectly!" and white knights will say "You don't HAVE to buy any of it, you can just farm it in-game!"

and round and round this argument will go again and again.

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The low hanging fruit will be a mount that moves faster than the free ones. It's not player power but it allows a player to get more rewards which translates directly to power.

It's a single player game. Who gives a fuck. It's not like you are in League of Legends where you start at level 1 and the other team starts at level 20. If you want to pay, thanks for keeping the game free for me. You will burn out on the season end game probably about the same points as I did but paid for the privilege to do so. Cool story.

GuardianX said:

I'm so confused. What are you talking about game-wise?

I thought you were talking about LoL at first, but LoL has no end-game last i checked unless you are talking ranked.

Then I thought you were talking about Destiny or Diablo 3 but who gets burnt out on either of those at "End Game" as well as Diablo 3 not having a fee to play seasonal content.

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The example is if this was a competitive PvP game, getting some sort of power benefit would matter. This is not a competitive PvP game so who gives a fuck if the battle pass has some sort of power benefit?

In Diablo 3 (assuming the end game eventually ends up in a similar space) until extremely recently, the end game was an ever scaling treadmill. You eventually got to a spot where you would quit because to see a gain was not worth the time you decided you wanted to put in. For some people it was when the next gain was an hour away, for others was when it was 20 hours away, for others was when it was 10 minutes away.

I was positing that purchasing some sort of power benefit would just get people to that point faster but at the end of the day, people would quit when the next rung in the ladder was X time frame away.

Fyff said:

The example is if this was a competitive PvP game, getting some sort of power benefit would matter. This is not a competitive PvP game so who gives a fuck if the battle pass has some sort of power benefit?

In Diablo 3 (assuming the end game eventually ends up in a similar space) until extremely recently, the end game was an ever scaling treadmill. You eventually got to a spot where you would quit because to see a gain was not worth the time you decided you wanted to put in. For some people it was when the next gain was an hour away, for others was when it was 20 hours away, for others was when it was 10 minutes away.

I was positing that purchasing some sort of power benefit would just get people to that point faster but at the end of the day, people would quit when the next rung in the ladder was X time frame away.

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jayrebb said:

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PvP is optional. Honestly their entire monetization scheme resembles mobile games where it just preys on the impatient. So you get a faster mount, so you level up faster, so what? You both eventually reach the same end game. And even if someone has better loot than you and can kill bosses twice as fast as you….again so what? It doesn’t impact your PvE experience since you probably aren’t ever gonna group with that other person anyways. And even if you are, it’s to your benefit since he’s gonna help you clear content faster.

Now if you want to engage in PvP, then of course paying to stay ahead matters. But that’s the whole fishhook mentality of paid gaming nowadays. How many mobile games emphasize pvp and clans to encourage spending?

It's not pay for power. Well, it is, but it's not direct power. Yeah, it's sort of play to win but it doesn't matter because it's a single player game. Okay it's single player, and competitive, but not pvp. Sure, sure, there is pvp but it's optional.

That was some quick couple pages on a very slippery slope.

Mizake said:

PvP is optional. Honestly their entire monetization scheme resembles mobile games where it just preys on the impatient. So you get a faster mount, so you level up faster, so what? You both eventually reach the same end game. And even if someone has better loot than you and can kill bosses twice as fast as you….again so what? It doesn’t impact your PvE experience since you probably aren’t ever gonna group with that other person anyways. And even if you are, it’s to your benefit since he’s gonna help you clear content faster.

Now if you want to engage in PvP, then of course paying to stay ahead matters. But that’s the whole fishhook mentality of paid gaming nowadays. How many mobile games emphasize pvp and clans to encourage spending?

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Debatable. That'd assume the rewards aren't important or wanted. Players decide what systems are going to be important to them.

It should go without saying PvP was the "endgame" in D2 for many people. Not Baal runs. Hiding behind "PvP is optional" doesn't hold if the rewards may be valuable. Opt out of valuable rewards?

That's not even getting into the tremendous pressure being applied to Blizzard right now to make Fields open PvP. The lobby for that is quite large.

BoozeCube said:

I like how everyone already knows it's not a matter of "if" they cross the line its simply "when" they cross the line.

Goddamn Blizzard blows dick, such a tainted memory of what once was the pinnacle of gaming.

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Hardly something I think just about blizzard. It's a industry wide thing at this point(double for big developers), more so for any game that has an online component.

Just have to wait and see, what companies say and what companies do are sometimes complete opposites. Especially if they are getting pressure from the suits who just want profits for higher stock prices.