Marriage and the Power of Divorce

Phazael · Aug 18, 2021

GuardianX said:
And with this I'm out.

I appreciate all the input people have given, better or worse, I'm going to go down the road I described.

Plan for failure, pray for success.

All tough love aside, good luck. And make the kids the number one priority.

Kirun · Aug 18, 2021

GuardianX said:
And with this I'm out.

I appreciate all the input people have given, better or worse, I'm going to go down the road I described.

Plan for failure, pray for success.

Best of luck, dude.

My parents stayed together for 24 years before finally divorcing, "for the kids". Remembering how miserable my mom was most of my life I'm sure is responsible for a lot of my cynicism today. Just remember that as long as your children see their father happy, they'll be just fine.

Phazael · Aug 18, 2021

Izo said:
I donno GuardianX - I think you should ask the guy to move in with you 2. If he’s getting your wife’s snatch, he might as well lend you a hand fixing the house, carrying out the trash, raising the kids and such. Make him work for it. Take turns living with pms, do the dishes, pay rent etc. Domesticate that home wrecking sob. Wife will love it, kids get a free homework tutor, wife will get bored with him too. Plus you’ll have new foh material for us to read. Modern times, modern solutions. Win-win.

First off, this is not a thread for trolling Izo.

But assuming you are semi-serious, the dude is a drugged out MMO addict with a track record of blowing up social groups he manages to get into. And letting some other dude schlong his wife to play the long game is the very definition of cuckdom.

Hoss · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
well ME and i had a long talk this week
he thinks if i could keep it to 2 nights a week, i.e. just raiding, i could play, and he could raid in EQ 2 nights a week, but he wants me to spend more time w/ the kids

I know i'm not the only one with this mental image of these 2.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Hoss said:
I know i'm not the only one with this mental image of these 2.

So some good, old-fashioned, non-cheating, MMO drama.

The "friend group" I initially introduced my wife to was actually 2 women "the guy" didn't even join til...maybe a LITTLE later? My wife was complaining about not having people to really talk to because her job is longer hours and makes it SUPER hard to do something she enjoys, which is play MMOs casually. I knew the main lady I introduced her to through the guild and small man group I was in on my server.

Originally, we rolled the new WoW expansion but holy shit it was a chore to play that. I fell off after the friend group (Mainly the mom, I THINK?) nuked a raiding casual guild we were with because of some casual comments that were sexual in nature ("Daddy Denathrius" comments a ton...tame as fuck...). I didn't wanna play WoW much anymore due to the ultra grindy nature of the expansion AND Planes of Power was coming out for Aradune, it's my first and only TLP and I wanted to progress past when I OG quit, GoD.

ANYHOW, the guy and the daughter apparently hit it off pretty quick with her sending him nudes and vids of herself. I never saw them, just heard OF them. Apparently shit started going sideways for that whole group not long after that. Supposedly the guy and the daughter's relationship was toxic as fuck. I told my wife to stay out of her way as she sounds crazy as fuck, every day was a new emergency. The guy and the daughter's relationship basically started becoming toxic to everyone around, that message you quoted was from a weekend where I was trying t do work around the house and basically watchign the kids as she was TRYING to maintain her connection to the group but they were sidelining her for some reason. She spent likely 20 hours in the weekend trying to be online for them to group with and they just shafted her. I told her (Like I said, she lacks common sense...) that they were likely just done with her, I'm sorry for introducing her to them but it's time to ditch them because it's not realistic to put our lives on hold to satisfy people that wouldn't do the same for us. (An "After the fact" I found out was that the daughter had yelled at my wife for not including her in dungeon groups when my wife, told to get food and then join them when she got back as she literally sat AFK for 45 minutes waiting for her to come back from getting food)

So, she leaves the game. She sticks around still in discord (all this was before cheating) and tries to maintain the connection to the daughter and the mother but it all becomes super toxic with stories about her being told from the daughter to the guy. At one point she even brings me into all this telling the guy how I talked to her Brother, and made their relationship even worse.

My wife...wants to please people (yeah yeah, jokes...) she has an unrealistic expectation that everyone can be happy with her and she likes to be remembered well. Combined with that and her shit tier as fuck common sense, she decided it would be best to have a conversation with the daughter (who is a proven liar at this point) to try to salvage at least her reputation in the daughters mind...I don't know why...but she wants that. Of course this doesn't cause the issues to stop, I would say it compounds it all.

Through all this we find out that (MIND YOU...this girl is a liar and a terrible one at that):

Daughter was raped by her brother repeatedly and it was brought about by a step father to both of them as their mother went into denial about the whole thing.
The brother is strange as fuck, mentions constantly wanting to kill himself as well as talking about masturbating in front of open windows facing neighbors, talks about letting peopel take turns with his mother implying that she'll like it, basically the dude is super fucked up.
The mother has some dude that is being dragged around by the nose, apparently showed up to their house unannounced and got told to fuck off.

All of this shit is condensed and I'm leaving out a ton for BREVITY...fucking lol.

I would call into question my common sense but NONE of this shit was even close to apparent when I mentioned the mother to my wife for a pretty decent person to game with, had i known? Yep woulda noped the fuck outta all that shit.

Hatorade · Aug 20, 2021

Use fake name or something next time that shit was confusing. Meddling is almost never worth it, at best you are put in the middle of an ongoing trash fire and will have to play mediator forever.
I have tried to help friends with other friend problems in the past, if money or sex is involved there is no hope.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Hatorade said:
Use fake name or something next time that shit was confusing. Meddling is almost never worth it, at best you are put in the middle of an ongoing trash fire and will have to play mediator forever.
I have tried to help friends with other friend problems in the past, if money or sex is involved there is no hope.

Yeah that's my bad last minute edit before I actually posted it, originally I was using their screen names but I figured I don't really want them to Google and end up on fire as of heaven at some point. If they joined fires of heaven the amount of crazy that they would bring here would be the likes of lumi plus flipping Jerle.

moonarchia · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
Yeah that's my bad last minute edit before I actually posted it, originally I was using their screen names but I figured I don't really want them to Google and end up on fire as of heaven at some point. If they joined fires of heaven the amount of crazy that they would bring here would be the likes of lumi plus flipping Jerle.

So a problem that will ultimately resolve itself?

Kirun · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
So some good, old-fashioned, non-cheating, MMO drama.

The "friend group" I initially introduced my wife to was actually 2 women "the guy" didn't even join til...maybe a LITTLE later? My wife was complaining about not having people to really talk to because her job is longer hours and makes it SUPER hard to do something she enjoys, which is play MMOs casually. I knew the main lady I introduced her to through the guild and small man group I was in on my server.

Originally, we rolled the new WoW expansion but holy shit it was a chore to play that. I fell off after the friend group (Mainly the mom, I THINK?) nuked a raiding casual guild we were with because of some casual comments that were sexual in nature ("Daddy Denathrius" comments a ton...tame as fuck...). I didn't wanna play WoW much anymore due to the ultra grindy nature of the expansion AND Planes of Power was coming out for Aradune, it's my first and only TLP and I wanted to progress past when I OG quit, GoD.

ANYHOW, the guy and the daughter apparently hit it off pretty quick with her sending him nudes and vids of herself. I never saw them, just heard OF them. Apparently shit started going sideways for that whole group not long after that. Supposedly the guy and the daughter's relationship was toxic as fuck. I told my wife to stay out of her way as she sounds crazy as fuck, every day was a new emergency. The guy and the daughter's relationship basically started becoming toxic to everyone around, that message you quoted was from a weekend where I was trying t do work around the house and basically watchign the kids as she was TRYING to maintain her connection to the group but they were sidelining her for some reason. She spent likely 20 hours in the weekend trying to be online for them to group with and they just shafted her. I told her (Like I said, she lacks common sense...) that they were likely just done with her, I'm sorry for introducing her to them but it's time to ditch them because it's not realistic to put our lives on hold to satisfy people that wouldn't do the same for us. (An "After the fact" I found out was that the daughter had yelled at my wife for not including her in dungeon groups when my wife, told to get food and then join them when she got back as she literally sat AFK for 45 minutes waiting for her to come back from getting food)

So, she leaves the game. She sticks around still in discord (all this was before cheating) and tries to maintain the connection to the daughter and the mother but it all becomes super toxic with stories about her being told from the daughter to the guy. At one point she even brings me into all this telling the guy how I talked to her Brother, and made their relationship even worse.

My wife...wants to please people (yeah yeah, jokes...) she has an unrealistic expectation that everyone can be happy with her and she likes to be remembered well. Combined with that and her shit tier as fuck common sense, she decided it would be best to have a conversation with the daughter (who is a proven liar at this point) to try to salvage at least her reputation in the daughters mind...I don't know why...but she wants that. Of course this doesn't cause the issues to stop, I would say it compounds it all.

Through all this we find out that (MIND YOU...this girl is a liar and a terrible one at that):

Daughter was raped by her brother repeatedly and it was brought about by a step father to both of them as their mother went into denial about the whole thing.
The brother is strange as fuck, mentions constantly wanting to kill himself as well as talking about masturbating in front of open windows facing neighbors, talks about letting peopel take turns with his mother implying that she'll like it, basically the dude is super fucked up.
The mother has some dude that is being dragged around by the nose, apparently showed up to their house unannounced and got told to fuck off.

All of this shit is condensed and I'm leaving out a ton for BREVITY...fucking lol.

I would call into question my common sense but NONE of this shit was even close to apparent when I mentioned the mother to my wife for a pretty decent person to game with, had i known? Yep woulda noped the fuck outta all that shit.

Sounds to me like your wife likely got hot and bothered with the stories from the daughter about this toxic dude. Despite their protests to the contrary, women LOVE volatile men. It's precisely why the "noble savage" is a thing. Key word there being "savage". Volatile males create indignation, which women will often create themselves in the absence of it from their lives. Ever wonder why women are so good at pushing buttons? Because often, subconsciously, they want you to lose your shit on them. Notice how they often want to fuck your brains out afterward - aka "make-up sex"? Hmm...I wonder why....

The thing about chicks is they don't always necessarily want "better", in a logical sense, they just want "different". It's why total fucking retards like Mystery pulled tons of strange. Dude wasn't very good looking, dressed weird as fuck, but he's extremely "different". Sure, they'll typically eventually realize their folly with this strategy, but often only after the damage has been done and typically only temporarily.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Kirun said:
Sounds to me like your wife likely got hot and bothered with the stories from the daughter about this toxic dude. Despite their protests to the contrary, women LOVE volatile men. It's precisely why the "noble savage" is a thing. Key word there being "savage". Volatile males creates indignation, which women will often create themselves in the absence of it from their lives. Ever wonder why women are so good at pushing buttons? Because often, subconsciously, they want you to lose your shit on them. Notice how they often want to fuck your brains out afterward - aka "make-up sex"? Hmm...I wonder why....

The thing about chicks is they don't always necessarily want "better", in a logical sense, they just want "different". It's why total fucking retards like Mystery pulled tons of strange. Dude wasn't very good looking, dressed weird as fuck, but he's extremely "different". Sure, they'll typically eventually realize their folly with this strategy, but often only after the damage has been done and typically only temporarily.

All the theory-crafting is why she is going back to therapy, I want to know more about the issue.

I'll be ultimately clear before saying this, none of the following absolves her of responsibility, she and the guy are both adults and are responsible for their actions as well as responsible for seeing thru the consequences of their actions.

I believe the guy was using "Baity" tactics to keep her engaged, either knowing or unknowingly, she would go for a while without responding and then he would message her with some juicy thing. The drama loving part of my wife would latch onto that and respond. Then once they decided to actually cheat, the lack of common sense part along with the part of herself that cannot leave a person thinking poorly about her kicked into gear. The guy isn't much different than me, the only difference is the "Risk" involved in him vs me. I know the "Why" of him, I want to know the "Why" of not telling me when I know every aspect of her and she knows every aspect of me.

Both of these concerns (the Common sense and the Desire to be remembered well) are the reason for one of my "rules" that conversations are to take-place between us as a group. I don't want to be her parent / conservator but, until she reaches some point in therapy that has her confronting the WHY of things like "Why do you desire people, who you wish to have no relationship, to think the best of you?" I feel like I have to be at least involved in her conversations (cheating aside).

Kirun · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
All the theory-crafting is why she is going back to therapy, I want to know more about the issue.

I'll be ultimately clear before saying this, none of the following absolves her of responsibility, she and the guy are both adults and are responsible for their actions as well as responsible for seeing thru the consequences of their actions.

I believe the guy was using "Baity" tactics to keep her engaged, either knowing or unknowingly, she would go for a while without responding and then he would message her with some juicy thing. The drama loving part of my wife would latch onto that and respond. Then once they decided to actually cheat, the lack of common sense part along with the part of herself that cannot leave a person thinking poorly about her kicked into gear. The guy isn't much different than me, the only difference is the "Risk" involved in him vs me. I know the "Why" of him, I want to know the "Why" of not telling me when I know every aspect of her and she knows every aspect of me.

Both of these concerns (the Common sense and the Desire to be remembered well) are the reason for one of my "rules" that conversations are to take-place between us as a group. I don't want to be her parent / conservator but, until she reaches some point in therapy that has her confronting the WHY of things like "Why do you desire people, who you wish to have no relationship, to think the best of you?" I feel like I have to be at least involved in her conversations (cheating aside).

Your mistake is trying to make sense and be logical about a situation, that in her mind, is inherently irrational and based entirely on emotion.

You're approaching female relationships from a male brain's perspective. Women do NOT view relationships and social structures the same way.

Phazael · Aug 20, 2021

Kirun said:
Your mistake is trying to make sense and be logical about a situation, that in her mind, is inherently irrational and based entirely on emotion.

You're approaching female relationships from a male brain's perspective. Women do NOT view relationships and social structures the same way.

This. Plus any solution that does not end in divorce requires both of you to sever all ties to these fucked up people yesterday. Toxic people are predators who only poison all they touch. You are learning this the hard way. Get that druggie ass pussy hound the fuck out of you and your wife's lives immediately.

Also, missed the therapy angle. If your wife has more than the normal female ration of crazy, you have your work cut out for you. This whole situation is built on her (flawed) emotional perception and that other guy looking to dip his wick in another man's woman. Proceed accordingly.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Type this on my phone so expect some weirdness.

So, in case I wasn't clear beforehand yes all those people are cut from our lives. The guy for trying to f*** my wife, virtually or otherwise, and the rest of the people had already broken off ties from us because they had concocted some pretty insane levels of lies in order to, I don't even know what their goal was.

Going forward if we join another community it will be under the pretense that both of us are joining and if one of us leaves then both of us leave. Most of the confusion or issues surrounding this came from the fact that I had a pre-existing relationship, game-wise, with the guy before my wife even knew him. So I had a sense of trust in him, such that I never expected him to go after my wife after he bailed on the other chick.

I think it was a good amount of naivety on my part, I just didn't expect to get double backstabbed. I don't want to keep being negative on the whole aspect because in order to move forward in any sense I need to be positive and outlook. My wife has already been made acutely aware of the standing of most people in regard to this matter as well as the shortcomings of her own and I feel like harping on the matter further rather than seeking a solution in one manner or another is counterproductive.

Gavinmad · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
I don't want to keep being negative

Bro you are talking about this in the wrong place if you want to avoid negativity.

OU Ariakas · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX

You need to find a Christian therapist tied to a church even if you don't go to church. Regular therapists these days are about digging into the shitty parts of your life and making them worse, not better. At least with a Christian one you are usually going to get someone who is truly looking to make your lives and relationship better; even if you have to deal with a little preachy-ness. In fact, I bet you could talk to them beforehand and tell them that the words God, Jesus, and Bible need to stay out of the sessions and they would be more than happy to oblige.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Gavinmad said:
Bro you are talking about this in the wrong place if you want to avoid negativity.

I agree to an extent, I mainly mean in the sense that I keep talking about the backstabby part regarding my wife. Which is a true statement but I don't need to affirm the reality constantly, I need to deal with it as I have planned out. The reality is, I can mentally deal with you all being the FoH I know and love but she can't. The responses about being cucked and what not hit hard because...I mean they are a FORM of true even though I don't like them. They cause me to think and evaluate the situation a tad more outside my own thoughts and decide if I'm bothered by something or if I need to change. There were some very good suggestions, some pessimistic suggestions, some suggestions borne from experience, and some suggestions given though empathetic connection. I appreciated all of it even if I'm not going to follow all of it.

OU Ariakas said:
You need to find a Christian therapist tied to a church even if you don't go to church. Regular therapists these days are about digging into the shitty parts of your life and making them worse, not better.

Comically enough, her therapist IS a christian lady that has been pretty helpful, prior to all this, in regards to her dealing with the stress of her job and the people under her. The reason she stopped going (about 5-6 months ago) was because the lady that she was managing who caused the most stress changed jobs and locations so she (my wife) figured there was no need to return to therapy. My wife really enjoyed going to her, as far as I am aware because she gave her some really good pointers for dealing with the stress. I'm looking to have her return to the same lady if possible.

Lendarios · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
Type this on my phone so expect some weirdness.

So, in case I wasn't clear beforehand yes all those people are cut from our lives. The guy for trying to f*** my wife, virtually or otherwise, and the rest of the people had already broken off ties from us because they had concocted some pretty insane levels of lies in order to, I don't even know what their goal was.

Going forward if we join another community it will be under the pretense that both of us are joining and if one of us leaves then both of us leave. Most of the confusion or issues surrounding this came from the fact that I had a pre-existing relationship, game-wise, with the guy before my wife even knew him. So I had a sense of trust in him, such that I never expected him to go after my wife after he bailed on the other chick.

I think it was a good amount of naivety on my part, I just didn't expect to get double backstabbed. I don't want to keep being negative on the whole aspect because in order to move forward in any sense I need to be positive and outlook. My wife has already been made acutely aware of the standing of most people in regard to this matter as well as the shortcomings of her own and I feel like harping on the matter further rather than seeking a solution in one manner or another is counterproductive.

You are going to make it bro. But I am seriously going to need a diagram with boxes and circles of the group members with arrows helping clarify the relationships..

Hoss · Aug 20, 2021

Lendarios said:
You are going to make it bro. But I am seriously going to need a diagram with boxes and circles of the group members with arrows helping clarify the relationships..

and the nudes. Don't forget we need the nudes of the 2 girls who you told us sent nudes so far.

GuardianX · Aug 20, 2021

Hoss said:
and the nudes. Don't forget we need the nudes of the 2 girls who you told us sent nudes so far.

HAHA

I 100% do not have those nudes and the only other girl was my wife soooo...

Hoss · Aug 20, 2021

GuardianX said:
other girl was my wife

I know. I read what you wrote. Not a deal breaker for me.

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