Monsters and Memories (Project_N) - Old School Indie MMO

I can get behind mnm adding a ‘loot all’ function. What other qol things are in aoa that aren’t in the mnm ui? I can’t recall wow well enough to recount all the various things. But I know qol is very subjective; I certainly wouldn’t want quest npcs highlighted like in wow but some may consider that qol for example.

Pasteton said:

I can get behind mnm adding a ‘loot all’ function. What other qol things are in aoa that aren’t in the mnm ui? I can’t recall wow well enough to recount all the various things. But I know qol is very subjective; I certainly wouldn’t want quest npcs highlighted like in wow but some may consider that qol for example.

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It's been a while since I've played either game, but here's what comes to mind:

-Target window 'consider' values (level, difficulty, faction)
-Direction arrows to group members
-Static maps
-Floating combat text
-Clickable quest text prompts
-Shift-click gear/item comparison functionality
-Dynamic tooltips using mouseovers (spell ranges, countdowns, etc)
-automatic spell interrupts on movement or target death
-queue large batches of crafting to continue offline
-chat bubbles
-searchable quest journal and NPC conversation log

All of this may have changed, so take with a grain of salt.

The main two things I saw in AoA that were a nice upgrade from anything I'd seen in any MMO to date were in regards to chat.


1. The Chat box setup having all the options in one window pane rather than various sub menus was so nice, especially the all off/on options and the checkmark boxes to choose what you wanted in a window.





2. How the floating text chat worked when around other players. They did a really good job having a popup window show up when talking without it being intrusive. At first I didn't' even notice it but once I got a feel for the game it was quite well thought out and helpful in combat situations. I didn't have to look at my chat boxes and could follow what was going on in the group chat while maintaining concentration on the fight.

As you can see below where the player said "Enjoy".






There's likely more but those were the 2 biggest two things that I thought were a nice QoL change that didn't take much effort.

Pasteton said:

I can get behind mnm adding a ‘loot all’ function. What other qol things are in aoa that aren’t in the mnm ui? I can’t recall wow well enough to recount all the various things. But I know qol is very subjective; I certainly wouldn’t want quest npcs highlighted like in wow but some may consider that qol for example.

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Let’s start with “things that even EQ didn’t try to bullshit you on”

…like a compass

I’m sure “hardcore” players prefer some system where if you drop a sword on the ground it points North (if the zone has an even number of letters, otherwise West), but then Northeast on every third day except days that start with T in odd months in which case it points South so you can “learn the system like a badass” and this would definitely not be explained anywhere in game so you can pull it up on a second monitor anytime you need it

Sylas said:

It's just minecraft graphics, they have some charm at least.

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Absolutely… if you’re a 2 year old.

I’m not saying MNM has great graphics they are frankly Unreal Tournament 2004 quality but run like crap on my laptop from 2019, but Minecraft is like Quake 1 from 1996

moonarchia said:

17 full time employees alone would be $2.5-3m per year just straight payroll and admin costs. Bargain basement devs are still going to need to make enough to live on. If they are working remote the company still has to have a business license in every state their employees live in and pay proper payroll taxes, which is one of the major downfalls of remote work, but even if all 17 decided to move to Bremen, DE in Europistan, that is still going to be a big chunk of money they are going to have to make annually to pay the devs.

The twatwaffles who keep trying to force the game to make gamer unfriendly decisions forget that this is exactly why this shit always fails. For a game to stay running it has to keep bringing the bacon in, and the spergaloids are not a large enough community to get it done. Never have been, and they are a dying breed, thankfully. Unfortunately some of them seem to be running the company, so they have some hurdles to overcome if this game is going to make it to 1.0.

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This is why SOE put Vanguard through an emergency rebuild in the 8 months leading up to it's release. If you talked to Sigil devs they would tell you the entire game was built in less than a year once the order was handed down that the game needs to be commercially marketable (WoW-ification was demanded). It turned out to mechanically be a better more interesting version of WoW (the first time WoW classes/talent trees had been bested by another game, as Warhammer had failed to do this and went off the rails in the later levels).

Could this happen with MNM-- remains to be seen.

There is a new class lead now that Nick is gone, and they have a full team working on it last minute ala Vanguard, it is anyone's guess what exactly it is they are working on, and what the greater vision for the classes (gameplay) is.

Classes will make or break this game, not spawns with 20% droprates in a dungeon camp with lootables that haven't received an itemization pass....

Subpar loot-- let's just say a little birdy told me level 45 named drop nearly identical items to some level 60 named.

Classes and itemization are their biggest hurdles right now to get people to pay for this game.

Quaid said:

Deeply unfortunate Minecraft aesthetic.

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Sure but that's what they can scrape together with what they have. I've long reminded people you gotta support these things if you hope for them to grow. It simply won't happen without a loyal thru thick and thin base.

As AoA appears to have ESG bux behind them, maybe it has a shot too. M&M appears to survive on pretty much dedication and talent for now.

moonarchia said:

17 full time employees alone would be $2.5-3m per year just straight payroll and admin costs. Bargain basement devs are still going to need to make enough to live on. If they are working remote the company still has to have a business license in every state their employees live in and pay proper payroll taxes, which is one of the major downfalls of remote work, but even if all 17 decided to move to Bremen, DE in Europistan, that is still going to be a big chunk of money they are going to have to make annually to pay the devs.

The twatwaffles who keep trying to force the game to make gamer unfriendly decisions forget that this is exactly why this shit always fails. For a game to stay running it has to keep bringing the bacon in, and the spergaloids are not a large enough community to get it done. Never have been, and they are a dying breed, thankfully. Unfortunately some of them seem to be running the company, so they have some hurdles to overcome if this game is going to make it to 1.0.

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The team is all volunteer from what I understand, so the current situation can go on as long as they care to continue that relationship.

My post was just to draw attention to the fact that the community should stop holding the belief that there are no financial goals at all. In an ideal world, this company desires to employ somewhere between 17-30 people in an ongoing way.

I believe that they're correct in their market analysis and their stated goals for the company are achievable. The question is how many curious customers can they convert to paying ones, and which implemented 'identity' features/systems (ex. bare bones UI) help with conversion or hinder it. How much do those systems drive identity, and what is their impact on conversion?

Is the bite worth the chew?

moonarchia said:

If they don't fix the lack of instancing, the answer will always be no. Soft pvp is still pvp, and the game is built for pve. The two do not mix.

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Nick had a front row seat to modern non instanced disputes and how everything plays out. That's one of the many reasons I saw him as essential to delivering, I guess he's still around in some sense(?) which is good and he should be consulted on such matters. Or me, I can tell ya everything in explicit and very objective detail. Glad to fairly neg my positions in those arguments.

moonarchia said:

If they don't fix the lack of instancing, the answer will always be no. Soft pvp is still pvp, and the game is built for pve. The two do not mix.

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Yaaaaa maybe, I dunno. I agree on raid zones, but not dungeons and overworld raid targets. I feel like fully instancing MNM would just make it a different game. It's like arguing it's stupid to open a steak house because burgers are more popular. You may make more money opening a burger restaurant... but what if it's your dream to open a steak house?

UI matters are different. Opening a steak house is not inherently a bad idea just because more people order burgers more frequently. Opening a steak house where you only give guests a Spork because you've convinced yourself it'll make them eat more slowly and savour each bite marginally more? Maybe re-think that.